The "I don't get it" or your 3 overrated synths thread

[rockstar_not]

this thread seems to be a default presets comparison instead of a synth comparison

Yeah, I got the same exact feeling myself.

I don't think that everybody here is talking about presets, but for a lot of people, synths are the presets.

well, then you can't say "a synth that dissapoints" but instead "a synth with dissapointing presets"

That's like saying a ferrari is crap because your 5 year old nephew can't drive it

No, it's like saying a ferrari is crap because I can't tow a horse trailer behind it.

There is a difference. I think it's down to terminology.

Synthesizer - should mean something that you use to synthesize a sound; whether that sound is analogous to a real world sound or something that you just imagine.

Sound Module perhaps would be a better terminology to describe a plugin that you use to intentionally grab a certain kind of sound for a certain part in a song.

Several folks (myself included) want to have either their synthesizers, and/or sound modules, have presets which inspire them to use the instrument creatively. I think that's particularly true for devices which you pay good money for, and totally reasonable to expect that if you pay good money for the device - it should inspire you to make more and better music than if you hadn't given up several pizza meals for the device. I'm a husband, father of 4 kids, and not a synth programmer. I use plugin synths mainly just to compliment my weak attempts at singing and guitar playing. If I can't audition some killer sounds in a few minutes, it gets deleted. Hmm, maybe that's why I stick with freeware! I did just by Jamstix cuz my drum programming skills send a foul stench to the heavens.

I'll never get to the point of learning to program all of the various plugins that I use; and it's a relatively short list of plugins. Let's be honest, how many tens or hundreds of plugins do you have of which you've never programmed a bank of sounds? For me, the percentage would be about 99% never programmed, 1% programmed.

I'm old enough to have lived and used synthesizers before the days of plugins. The synth I became most familiar with 'programming' was a Korg Delta (anyone else have one of those?). I still haven't matched my skill tweaking that thing, as I have with plugins. Reason why? It's all that I had; coupled with about 10 times as much spare time as I have now.

Someone mentioned back a page or two that PM synths are overrated.

I disagree. You will have to pry my dead cold fingers off of Mr. Ray's Electric Piano and it's various variations. Guido knows how to program PM for guys like me.

Perhaps we should start a parallel thread; 3 most under-rated instrument plugins.

I'll start:

1. Mr. Ray's
2. sfz
3. Minimogue VA

With those 3 sound generating plugins, I can do just about anything I need to.

-Scott

[ztutz]

1. Massive
2. Reason
3. Sytrus

These synths just aren't up to the hype that gushes around them. There are plenty of synths that suck, and these don't. For me, these are the most egregiously over-rated.

[The Chase]

this thread seems to be a default presets comparison instead of a synth comparison

Definitely. Hearing any synth as vast as absynth called "just another evolving pad synth" rings that bell with me...imo Absynth rules for most synth sounds, be it leads or basses or atmospheres.

[ctmg]

I insist... why do some people dislike WusikStation ? (well, I'm not affiliate with William...you can talk)

I assume some might not like the interface, but other than that I dont see how anyone could not like it (same for absynth). They do friggin EVERYTHING and do it well, imo.

Wusik could be so good that it got me laid (which is a near impossibility) and I still wouldn't use it out of principle.

[thelizard]

Earlier I said Wusik was overrated because it was too hard to figure everything out. I guess I like it today lol. Just had to spend about two hours with it (opening and reopening the demo). I'll still keep Zebra 2 and Albino on the overrated list though. It has nothing to do with the presets, as is the current argument in the thread. It's all about logical programming. A lot of grief has been tossed at Absynth in this thred, but I think it's brilliant to program. Here's the patch menu. Here are three oscs. This one's on, this one isn't. This is the waveform. Here's where they're routed.
Wusik had a lot of menus for me to dig through, but I guess I'm getting over the romplerness of it mainly because you can build with the same waveforms that you use in most other synths (I still wish it was easier to import your own waves though!!!!)

I think a lot of us are finding it really easy to let off some steam in this thread, mainly because all of us have spent money on a synth, ultimately realizing that a lot of our free synths are put to better use (Oatmeal anyone? Not to mention the fact that xhip cuts through every mix like a buzzsaw and synth1 is just absolutely fun to program.)

Someone mentioned underrated synths earlier. I'd say my Korg MS-20 (Legacy Edition) gets more use than anything else on my machine. The only reason I bring this synth up is to describe the way I feel about the latest and greatest synths these days. This thing only has two oscillators with four waveforms each. However, it is a blast to program and every sound that comes out of it is usable (IMHO).

And I know I brought up the fact that I love Reaktor earlier, but I don't feel that it is overcomplicated either. The number 1 synth in the user library is James Walker-Hall's 3x... which is basically Fruity's 3x Osc on steroids. Plus, every synth in the user library seems to have at least once great, specific purpose. Here's the DnB lead synth. Here's the Trance Pad synth... yadda yadda. It's nice having many synths that are good at one specific thing instead of one synth that sucks at many.

I'm sure I contradicted myself at least once in there. Oh well.

[WattTyler]

1) Neuron VS
2) Plex

Two synths that I really wanted to love. Neuron for the creative sounds, and Plex for the inventive way sounds are constructed.

But... Neuron has a stupid bit of plastic for a contoller, and the software crashes half the time. Over and above everything else, a synth has to be reliable. I gig with the guitar that I use in the studio ( A hand-built Fylde electric). I would never dream of gigging with the Neuron VS. It is too unstable.

Plex never seems to hit the mark. Shame really, because what I would like in a synth is the ability to be able to say ' I would like this kind of sound', without having to spend weeks learning the interface and twiddling a thousand different knobs. Don't get me wrong, I love messing about with VSTIs, I have even tried to build a few myself, but at the end of the day, I want to make music, and I think the whole sound design interface could be more intuitive.

[DrGonzo]

this thread seems to be a default presets comparison instead of a synth comparison

True, but does that really matter?

If a synthmaker have produced a highly technically advanced synth and can just show its capabilities with lousy presets. That's just plain stupid.

Presets are inspiring and always a good starting point for creating your own.

[The Chase]

this thread seems to be a default presets comparison instead of a synth comparison

True, but does that really matter?

errrrrm yea it does (! imho). Presets dont remotely effect the functionality of the synth...I have tons of synths that I still havent trawled through the presets of. I wouldnt slag off any synth that I havent delved deeply into to see what it really is.

[pascual]

.hmm

[pascual]

For me it's all those FM synths.
They are always seen as the cat's pijamas, or Tarzans mother; but no matter how much i try to like them they all sound like cheap background music for some second rate beauty pagent.
It's that glassy cheesiness that i really can't stand! I hate Fm e-pianos, and i loath any fm bell sounds. Add to that the complicated nature of programming them and forget it!

I don't want no Sytrus, i don't want no FM 7 or 8 or 9 and you can also keep toxic.

Seems like you hate FM synths. Perhaps if you try to study a little in order to understand them, you would change your mind. I am currently reviewing the major FM synths available (FM8, Blue, Octopus, Rhino, Sytrus, Toxic III), and found all of them to be great synths, although very different. All of them go way beyond plain and simple FM, too, adding resynthesis, additive, Ring Modulation, Waveshaping, etc.
They are complex, true, and we can easily get lost, but what we can get out of them is fantastic. So, I think you should pay a little more attention to FM itself, and the FM synths out there. There is a world beyond subtractive waiting for you.

To be honest i would never really turn my back to any instrument or any sound, and if i could afford a bunch of plugins and/or hardware, i would defenitely want to have some quality fm action in my tool box. I have fm7 express, and i like playing around with Ganymed occasionally...
But still, it very often manages to sound sooo very cheesy...to me.

[eduardo_b]

Presets dont remotely effect the functionality of the synth...

True, but they can easily demonstrate the functionality, or hide it. I simply don't have the time to spend seeing how truly functional every synth is. Unless, of couse, I wanted to do that instead of music.

[Cosmic Bandito]

I find every synth gears itself twords certain sounds. I've also found that if I can't get into the presets, I am usually disappointed when I try to program my own sounds, because I like to use presets as starting points and most presets will cover whatever a synth can do.

I also found Zebra2's presets fall in this category with me. I was actually suprised that many people said that here, but it confirmed what I felt. Same with Absynth and FM8 (which presets had heavy use of FX and gimmicks).

Sytrus, However, I don't agree with. It has added some magic to many a song for me. Can't program it for shite, and it's hard to work in sometimes, (you have to use it sparringly), but it's amazed me quite a few times. It sort of has that "accident" factor, that old analogue stuff had, but software almost never has.

[BERFAB]

For me it's all those FM synths.
They are always seen as the cat's pijamas, or Tarzans mother; but no matter how much i try to like them they all sound like cheap background music for some second rate beauty pagent.
It's that glassy cheesiness that i really can't stand! I hate Fm e-pianos, and i loath any fm bell sounds. Add to that the complicated nature of programming them and forget it!

I don't want no Sytrus, i don't want no FM 7 or 8 or 9 and you can also keep toxic.

Seems like you hate FM synths. Perhaps if you try to study a little in order to understand them, you would change your mind. I am currently reviewing the major FM synths available (FM8, Blue, Octopus, Rhino, Sytrus, Toxic III), and found all of them to be great synths, although very different. All of them go way beyond plain and simple FM, too, adding resynthesis, additive, Ring Modulation, Waveshaping, etc.
They are complex, true, and we can easily get lost, but what we can get out of them is fantastic. So, I think you should pay a little more attention to FM itself, and the FM synths out there. There is a world beyond subtractive waiting for you.

Well, I think the point is, he shouldn't have to study anything. He doesn't like it. If he's heard all the big FM synths, even if he never programmed one, he's surely gotten to know what they sound like from a very broad variety of the available presets. Just not his thing. Understanding WHY they sound the way they do will, in all liklihood, not change his mind.

Personally, I love the FM stuff. I'm not a programmer and don't have the time or the talent, though I do like to tweak some presets a bit. I think overall, the FM stuff has a warm, 'round' sound that is very full. As an example, FM8's 'Akoustique' bass patch is very satisfying to me.

-B

[ChipCurtis]

John Vulich has a point, most SE stuff really isn't anything special.

But then there are things like Majken's Chimera

Tweakbench stuff

etc..

This isn't the fault of SynthEdit. The programmer makes the synth what it is, regardless of the tools used to create it. The paradox with SynthEdit is that it makes it easier to build a synth, and because of that you get a lot of hastily-put-together ones floating around out there using the stock modules. There are some fantastic SynthEdit creations out there, including OP-X, Superwave, Arppe2600va, all the ODO stuff, etc.

[spaceman]

but for a lot of people, synths are the presets.

well, then you can't say "a synth that dissapoints" but instead "a synth with dissapointing presets"

But if for a lot of people a synth is its presets, the two statements are roughly the same thing.

And didn't the Imperial Government of the Holy Interweb pass a law banning car analogies?

it got added to a more money for poor widows bill and it got rejected