Why are you using prepared grooves?

[BertKoor]

.. but I never have used prepared loops! False accusations!!

[Hovmod]

If I weren't caught doing ALL this stuff myself, but had the opportunity to cooperate with people, I'd have a drummer. Is that uncreative?

[BERFAB]

I'm not a drummer. Back in the day, I used to use various drum machines. Drumloops and REX files, etc. to me are no different than a drum machine. In fact, many of today's 'drum machines' use REX files to create their sounds (hello Stylus). Today I still will program my own rhythms and occasionally hit on something that inspires me to build onto it.

But I don't really enjoy beat creation even though I'm pretty good at it. I prefer playing. Often, I'll create a piece where the drum track really sucks or could be better. So I'll audition stuff from my REX files collection and fly in a drum part that really cooks. No muss, no fuss, as they say.

And just as often, I'll just start auditioning drum loops to get inspired and start a piece from there.

BTW, I use all kinds of formats, including MIDI files, WAV, REX2, as well as programming my own beats directly into the host. As a Cubase user, I find that FLStudio is a much faster tool for doing this.

Cheers
-B

[MotorMind]

Well it's a logic that falls backward though.

Yes, true...But! It's about where people draw the line. Most people draw the line at the point where you use equipment to make a raw sound. And it also has to do with what you are capable of. You won't see me build mics. And I do use Synthedit to create some of the equipment I use, but I don't like programming in C++, so that's were I draw the line.

For the same reason I don't like to use too much prefabbed stuff like loops. I believe it is in my capabilities to create my own and even if it's not as good as a precreated one, my capabilities will only increase by practice.

In the end it all comes down to the pleasure you have in making music and it how you do that is not very important. After all, you draw your own lines. My only point was that prefabbed grooves can be a source of inspiration when trying to get to your own original sound.

Sounds to me like you're just trying to make yourself feel good by thinking that at least you are using your "own grooves". The truth is that it is totally irrelevant to the quality of your music. Ask Amon Tobin, who makes it a deliberate choice to derive everything he makes from other sampled sources. If you have musical talent it will definteley show, even if you just rip everything from the sample CD supplied with Magix Music Maker (although it might have a thorough layer of cheese on whatever you make). People who are stuck up on methods are likely to be insecure about their talents... and often rightfully so.

[Toxikator]

indeed. Or Dieselboy, or any other DJ artist; making entire tracks from other people's loops and samples.

What matters is not what you USE, but what you CREATE.

[Minispek]

Well it's a logic that falls backward though.

Yes, true...But! It's about where people draw the line. Most people draw the line at the point where you use equipment to make a raw sound. And it also has to do with what you are capable of. You won't see me build mics. And I do use Synthedit to create some of the equipment I use, but I don't like programming in C++, so that's were I draw the line.

For the same reason I don't like to use too much prefabbed stuff like loops. I believe it is in my capabilities to create my own and even if it's not as good as a precreated one, my capabilities will only increase by practice.

In the end it all comes down to the pleasure you have in making music and it how you do that is not very important. After all, you draw your own lines. My only point was that prefabbed grooves can be a source of inspiration when trying to get to your own original sound.

Sounds to me like you're just trying to make yourself feel good by thinking that at least you are using your "own grooves". The truth is that it is totally irrelevant to the quality of your music. Ask Amon Tobin, who makes it a deliberate choice to derive everything he makes from other sampled sources. If you have musical talent it will definteley show, even if you just rip everything from the sample CD supplied with Magix Music Maker (although it might have a thorough layer of cheese on whatever you make). People who are stuck up on methods are likely to be insecure about their talents... and often rightfully so.

Well that's a little harsh isn't it? It was just my way to use prefabbed grooves. You shouldn't judge anyone, because of the way they use prefabbed grooves. Yes, I like to use my own grooves, but that doesn't mean that I'm against the use of sampled sources in tracks. That's just not the way I tango...

[Minispek]

indeed. Or Dieselboy, or any other DJ artist; making entire tracks from other people's loops and samples.

What matters is not what you USE, but what you CREATE.

Isn't that exactly what I meant in my earlier posts on this topic?

[liars&ashes]

----Oooo prepared grooves sound awesome. That's it, I'm selling all these stoopid loop cds tomorrow and saving up for some prepared grooves.

Jeff

[bjarnenorheim]

Minispek draw a sensible line.(for electronic music)

Today tools for sound design are so accesible that its totally boring to use sample cds.
After a while you will get a certain sound from making your own stuff.
Its so easy to find instruments to record if your not into pure elctronic music.
Wavetable synths also is boring.
When i hear the fm7 Peter krischner science friction patch over and over again
i think its totally boring.

[Lagrange]

Even drummers bite grooves from other drummers.. They are just phsycally playing them themselves.. Using grooves is like having a drummer play the parts just with no drums..

Just don't straight bite or you will sound like a clone and people will spot your bites indetifying your dental records.. Switch shit up lazy asses...

L

[bjarnenorheim]

[quote="MotorMind"][quote="Minispek"][quote="Toxikator"]Well it's a logic that falls backward though.[/quote]

Yes, true...But! It's about where people draw the line. Most people draw the line at the point where you use equipment to make a raw sound. And it also has to do with what you are capable of. You won't see me build mics. And I do use Synthedit to create some of the equipment I use, but I don't like programming in C++, so that's were I draw the line.

For the same reason I don't like to use too much prefabbed stuff like loops. I believe it is in my capabilities to create my own and even if it's not as good as a precreated one, my capabilities will only increase by practice.

In the end it all comes down to the pleasure you have in making music and it how you do that is not very important. After all, you draw your own lines. My only point was that prefabbed grooves can be a source of inspiration when trying to get to your own original sound.[/quote]

Sounds to me like you're just trying to make yourself feel good by thinking that at least you are using your "own grooves". The truth is that it is totally irrelevant to the quality of your music. Ask Amon Tobin, who makes it a deliberate choice to derive [b]everything[/b] he makes from other sampled sources. If you have musical talent it will definteley show, even if you just rip everything from the sample CD supplied with Magix Music Maker (although it might have a thorough layer of cheese on whatever you make). People who are stuck up on methods are likely to be insecure about their talents... and often rightfully so.[/quote]




Amon Tobin samples EVERYTHING from vinyl.
He is not just spicing up his tracks with zero-g drum loops.
He dont use sample cds

[advaya]

If I weren't caught doing ALL this stuff myself, but had the opportunity to cooperate with people, I'd have a drummer. Is that uncreative?

[herodotus]

I have one thing to say about anti-loop snobbery and I will leave it go at that:

I have clicked on many, many links of people who have stated that if you use prefab loops, that doing so makes your music 'unoriginal'.

Time and again, I have listened to the online music posted by such people, and I am yet to hear any that seemed to qualify as anything like 'original'.

I don't know what this means, but it does have a certain amusing irony to it.

[musikmachine]

I used to be totally against using prefabbed grooves or prepared loops but then i worked with a friend on some demos and his backing tracks were largely based on other other peoples songs.He always said there was nothing wrong with using sampled audio creatively.He was a singer and didn't know how to use the software on a daw which is where i came in.The tracks turned out really well and definitely changed my view of using prefabbed material or prepared loops.The plan was to a put a three track ep out on a white label and see if things developed and the ep did well.If it did we'd go into a studio and rerecord the tracks with session musicians etc.

Why do you ask anyway?

Sorry reread your post

Its not what you've got,it's what you do with it that counts imo.

[thomekk]

Here's my mustard:

I often use prepared grooves (MIDI) for a starter, as 1st draft. But: I'm nearly ever satisfied with them, so I cut out someting here and there, add something here and there, use groove quantizations on them to change velocity and stuff.
In the end I kill lots of the notes of the template, play something live in addition, kill, add, kill, add...

...to make it fit to the actual compo.

AND: Also important is the sound aspect. Try playing a midi-loop with very differently drumkits, change the pitch, add fx to some channels: WHOO, something completely different takes birth

MOre dangerous than using Loop-Templates to me is trying to fit to a certain genre!