Piano/Keyboard Exercises...

[jopy]

doesn't sound daft at all, in fact, don't you think mentally is sometimes a better way to learn? it focuses your mind on the sound of the music rather than just the physical demands. i've always thought that a good pianist can sing anything s/he plays. hence, keith jarrett...

[popmoney]

Chopin would teach his students the B major scale first. Or was that Liszt, I forget...

Chopin used B, C# and F# Major to begin with. The reason was that these scales involve mostly black keys, and are technically easier to play.

If you like I can post up a video of what I consider to be good and bad motions for faster scales (ie, above 120bpm'ish). Im not a professional pianist, and my scales are far from being amazing. But I do think I can demonstrate the technique for you if that would help.

TB

Hey TB

I'd be grateful if you could post that video you were talking about.


Philip

[tee boy]

Right you are. I will try to do it tonight or tommorow.

TB

[popmoney]

Right you are. I will try to do it tonight or tommorow.

TB

Nice one. I look forward to it.

[anomoly]

so when you say "scales" do you guys mean C major scale... then C# scale, then D scale and so on?

and then do the same thing with Chords?

TB a video (youtube) would be nice.

[JumpingJackFlash]

so when you say "scales" do you guys mean C major scale... then C# scale, then D scale and so on?

and then do the same thing with Chords?

TB a video (youtube) would be nice.

Basically yes, the two most common types of scale (in the modern Western world) are the Major Scale, and the Minor Scale.
More information can be found in my Introduction to Music Theory, and examples of all the common different types of scales and chords can be found in my post on Scales, Modes and Chords.

Playing block chords on a piano doesn't really do much for your technique though, so we tend to spread the notes of the chord out into an arpeggio or broken chord.

[peppy197]

Like learning to type, this can take years to be "fluid" at.

Myself I consider my development to be about 1/9 th of the way through what it takes to be what some call:

A Contemporary Keyboardist (a.k.a. John Novello)


allen

[MaliceX]

What's funny is, tendencies or bad habits of mistakes are also prone to becoming a constant practice, in contrast to becoming fluent in a certain style of movement.

I've been touchtyping for about 11 years now (first time was when I was 6, dad owned a Commodore 64 VIC-20 before then, QWERTY rocks, and I still tend to hit the backspace button. Funnily enough, trying something like typing with the keyboard on top of the monitor actually improved that... :O)

Are there any fingering lists for different types of modes and scales OTHER than simple Major and Natural Minor? Also, are there any fingering tips of various different types of arpeggios? (ie: tonal, tritonal, rising, falling, 3's, 4's, reversing, alternation etc.)

[MoreDread]

http://www.pianofundamentals.com/
http://www.zebrakeys.com/

[JumpingJackFlash]

Are there any fingering lists for different types of modes and scales OTHER than simple Major and Natural Minor? Also, are there any fingering tips of various different types of arpeggios? (ie: tonal, tritonal, rising, falling, 3's, 4's, reversing, alternation etc.)

Well, I don't know (or can't remember) exact fingerings, but here are a few basic general tips (as with everything, there are exceptions to every rule):

Commonly, pianists are initially taught to avoid putting their thumbs on the black notes wherever possible.
You should move you hands as little as possible; this means crossing over/under and changing position should be done as infrequently as possible.
You shouldn't 'hop' unless absolutely necessary; - this means you should make use of all of your fingers and avoid breaking up the flow by switching fingers when it's not necessary.
Basically, you should aim for a smooth, even and continuous flow. - Any audible breaks resulting from bad fingering are obviously not good. (Someone listening should not be able to tell what fingering you are using).

[Gregjazz]

Scale technique is something of an little obsession of mine, lol. There is this huge debate over whether or not one should pass the thumb under the hand when playing fast legato scales. While I dont think its constructive to go into that right now, I do think I should point out that at faster tempos, you should not be REACHING under with the thumb.

If you like I can post up a video of what I consider to be good and bad motions for faster scales (ie, above 120bpm'ish). Im not a professional pianist, and my scales are far from being amazing. But I do think I can demonstrate the technique for you if that would help.

TB

Yeah, when playing at faster speeds, you definitely should not be passing the thumb under. The technique is called the "thumb over" technique, but that hardly gives a good impression of what this technique is about. Basically it's about using arm movements rather than finger movements to play fast, consistent scales.

The Pischna exercises are great, but that's not really something you should take on yourself, since you could get some injuries if you're doing them incorrectly--playing them purely through finger movement rather than utilizing arm movement, etc., which avoids injury.

As mentioned before, playing Mozart, Bach inventions, and such, are great exercises that are much more musical (duh) than playing Hanon or the like.

[jopy]

one other route is to get a good video of a classical pianist where you can see his/her hands. jazz pianists aren't good role models for the most part (hit or miss with technical competence, some excellent, some not so good), and many rock/blues players have horrible technique--many play good stuff in spite of their technique, not because of it. but you'll almost never see a classical pianist with bad technique.

[Gregjazz]

The playing demands are so different between classical and jazz pianists, it's a very different thing technique-wise. Then again, I have seen plenty of videos of classical pianists with bad technique.

Also, some of the best jazz pianists play classical, also. For example, Chick Corea, Keith Jarrett, Enrico Pieranunzi...

[jopy]

true enough, most recent jazz pianists do have good conventional technique--you could add herbie hancock to the list of jazz/classical crossovers, he's recorded a very good version of ravel's concerto for piano and orchestra; could also add fats waller, john lewis from mjq, jason moran, and bill evans to the list of crossover players.

...but have you seen thelonious monk's technique? i love monk more than any other musician, but i wouldn't emulate his technique at all. ditto bud powell or duke ellington. great players, horrible technique.

[tee boy]

Ok, so I promised a wee vid showing the two important scale techniques.

But first, I have to just say a few things.

I have played piano for two years. I have never had a proper lesson (though I did have years of classical guitar lessons). What I know of piano Iv learned by communicating with teachers, professionals and other students over the net, examining video footage of performances, watching masterclasses, experimenting on the piano myself, studying the standard rep.

I am not qualified to teach piano, so I want you to understand that my technique might be terrible! Indeed, I know that I have a lot to work on. My faster scales arent even enough, so I need to spend some time working on that, amongst other things.

However, I do think (and so do many others) that these are the two techniques that you need to learn in order to play legato scales on piano.

The first is called 'thumb under'. This involves reaching with the thumb, under the hand and fingers to reach the next note. The idea is that you play that note with the thumb just before releasing the previous note (with the fourth finger). This enables you to achieve a 'true' legato effect. The thumb under technique is what you should use for slower legato scales.

The second technique is called 'thumb over', although this name is very much a misnomer as the thumb does NOT move over than hand (that would be impossible!). However, neither does it move under. The idea is that when playing faster scales, you need a more economical motion and one that avoiding the fingers tripping over themselves!

With this technique, there is a particular motion that I hope you can see properly from my video. The hand turns very rotates very slighty, allowing the thumb to move in the right direction WITHOUT passing under the hand. This is combined with a quick shift of position. Use thumb over technique for fast scales (around 120bpm and above, semi quavers).

The main difficult with this technique is to make the shift of position inperceivable. The effect sounds perfectly legato, but it is not TRUE legato as for a tiny moment there a break in the flow. The art is making this so slightly that it cant be perceived.

You should practice this technique first by playing just the little sets of notes alone (ie, C, D, E... F, G, A, B). You should be able to roll through these notes at super speed as there is not passing involved. Then, begin to slow down the tempo and play the entire one octave scale (involving one pass). Play it continuously up and down. Try and make that shift as inperceivable as possible.

The benefits of this technique are many. First it allows effortlessly fast scales, unlike the thumb under Thumb under prevents speed, as the motion of reaching with the thumb is highly uneconomical (Iv heard DETAILED explanations of why this is, but wont go into it right now...to long, lol). I believe it was pioneered by Busoni as a way to facilitate effortless and fast scales.

If you download videos of piano recitals and what them in slow motion, you'll find that most (if not all) professional piansts play scales in this manner. Funny thing is, some claim not too! See, I think it is inevitable that as you speed up, you develop this particular motion. So to me, personally, it makes sense to develop it from the start. I dont see the point of trying to purposefully pass the thumb under the hand, even to the point where it prevents economy of motion and proves uneffective.

To me, this is by far the most comfortable, relaxed and effective way to play fast scales. Not that I have mastered it! Far from it. But Im getting better, bit by bit.

It will probably take quite a bit of time to get good at scales. After all, its not easy! You need to sit at the piano and investigate this motion. After a while, your body and mind will begin to get it and you'll wonder how you ever survived without it

Hope you can see adequately:

http://download.yousendit.com/2763EA1664AF65B9

TB