KVR Audio

xolax · Post by **xolax** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 6:20 am

I know that all of you people hate "tarnce", but lately all Ive been listening to is psytrance and now ive been trying to make some of my own. Ive got the 2 of the foundations down - the drums and the bassline, but here's where I get stuck. When I listen to psytrance, I hear a lot of really subtle sounds that are not your straightforward leads like in other types of dance music. So Ive been trying to figure out what kind of sounds psytrance uses - I cant seem to find something that fits just right (in the lead department). When I listen, I dont even hear any definate leads. Any advice??

afreshcupofjoe · Post by **afreshcupofjoe** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 6:30 am

post clips.

runagate · Post by **runagate** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 7:06 am

By no means does everyone here hate trance.
Just the people with personal integrity do.
But you have to wonder: why do so many people have so much trouble making the basic sounds of the most cliche-ridden genre that's ever existed? I mean the programs are actually set up to make it easy to make 8th notes with a repetetive, plodding feel. That's why techno exists: the medium of using a drum machine without knowing wtf you're doing just lends itself to the repetetive, mind-numbing idiocy that is "dance" music.

Angst Queen · Post by **Angst Queen** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 7:31 am

I like trance. I use eJay to make mine.

rounser · Post by **rounser** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 8:00 am

By no means does everyone here hate trance blah blah blah

Oh do shut up.

He's asking a sensible question and idiots start replying (not you afreshcupofjoe).

Go away idiots, go talk about how VSTs can't make bass or something.

xolax, forget KVR for this question, it is a silly place. Try posting here - less idiots, more knowledge:
http://forum.isratrance.com/viewforum.php/forum/2

xolax · Post by **xolax** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 8:33 am

Thanks for the advice rounser - Im going to check it out tomorrow when i wake up.

leahzero · Post by **leahzero** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 8:40 am

runagate wrote:By no means does everyone here hate trance.
Just the people with personal integrity do.
But you have to wonder: why do so many people have so much trouble making the basic sounds of the most cliche-ridden genre that's ever existed? I mean the programs are actually set up to make it easy to make 8th notes with a repetetive, plodding feel. That's why techno exists: the medium of using a drum machine without knowing wtf you're doing just lends itself to the repetetive, mind-numbing idiocy that is "dance" music.

The drone/glitch elite has spoken!

In all seriousness, since this thread will no doubt shortly turn into a flamewar thanks to helpful, erudite comments such as that quoted above, you may want to check out forums that are more geared towards EDM instead.

http://www.dogsonacid.com/
http://www.tranceaddict.com/

I find the former has greater technical expertise within its community, while the latter is more noob-friendly/ridden but has more pertinent dance-oriented tracks to reference for inspiration and instruction etc. Good luck, and don't let elitist hubris like that above dissuade you from asking questions.

xolax · Post by **xolax** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 8:44 am

runagate wrote:By no means does everyone here hate trance.
Just the people with personal integrity do.
But you have to wonder: why do so many people have so much trouble making the basic sounds of the most cliche-ridden genre that's ever existed? I mean the programs are actually set up to make it easy to make 8th notes with a repetetive, plodding feel. That's why techno exists: the medium of using a drum machine without knowing wtf you're doing just lends itself to the repetetive, mind-numbing idiocy that is "dance" music.

Im not saying that I cant make the basic cheesy supersaw preset - because I can, but what Im asking is what kind of sounds goa and psytrance use for leads. I sure can make all the basic dance sounds, but for the subtle psy sounds, I seem to be lost because when I throw whatever sounds I come up with into the track, it does not sound right and feels out of place.
EDIT: This is what happens whenever I want to try something new.

kvrers are unforgiving lol

morphex · Post by **morphex** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 9:14 am

xolax - Are you into the more 'melodic' psytrance, or the type that is mainly in one key, with the emphasis on complex rhythmic synths, machine-like beats, and major sound-designing? By 'melodic', I'm referring to the type of track that has constant 303-style arpeggios filter-sweeping over the course of 16 or whatever number of bars. An example would be some of the Astral Projection tracks from around the year 2000. They included key changes in their music while others focused mainly on the sound fx and cyber-like drum programming. Can you name any group in particular that you're influenced by?

Peace - morphex

runagate · Post by **runagate** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 9:41 am

xolax I assure you that whoever's style you like didn't achieve that style without a lot of, shall we say, trial and error. When it comes to electronic sounds the ability to juggle what it will sound like once "recorded" or whatever it is we do now as opposed to what it sounds like to the "inner ear" before it is a tangible sound is much harder to gauge than with a known set of standard instruments, something which it is all too easy to forget.

As a futher hikack of your thread, however, I must point out how sublimely glad I am that KVR seems to be hostile to trance to the purveyors of such to the point where they point out where their specific forums exist. Perhaps they'll all go away instead of dominating every day with "better Virus" and "better sine bass" threads. Somewhere an actually intelligent maker of techno must be aghast at his name being sullied by every fucktard that places their kicks at the beginning of every single bar.

living sounds · Post by **living sounds** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 9:42 am

The Goa/Psytrance genre is actually quite diverse. There are guidelines however:
- use long delay echos with modulation effects on it
- make use of filters throughout your tracks, filtering bits of synthlines, atmos, pads etc in and out
- modulation effects are important
- any effect you can think of really, be it bitcrushers or ringmodulator
- insert breaks often, at regular and irregular intervals
- put in all the effect sounds, atmos, sampled stuff from sci-fi movies etc. you can find
- build a hypnotic, polyrythmic spiderweb of basses, synth-arpeggios and sequencer-lines
- don't use anthem-elements (no supersaw theme!!!)
- no hands-up-break!
- don't be predictable, this is not the kind of music that needs to be easily accessable to everyone

hoffy · Post by **hoffy** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 9:54 am

Hey runagate, mabye people would give a f**k about your comments if you had talent?

Why did you even click on a thread about psytrance when you clearly don't even like it?

You describe psy-trance as the most "cliche-ridden genre"; I'd probably agree but when someone has a legitimate question about it, why waste your time bagging them *and* the genre out? Even if the arrangements and structures of psy-trance are ordinary, producers like infected mushroom and hallucinogen are incredible at sound design, which essentially is what this thread relates too.

I mean, I've just listened to the garbage on your website. Sounds like you've been producing music for about an hour. Any fuckin' moron with a bunch of shit-edit synths could make that idiotic fuckin noise. I'm sure you will pretend that the "music" you create is an artistic statement, but it seems quite obvious that your complete lack of musical understanding, engineering skills or sound design techniques force you to write the crap that you do. I mean who would make that fuckin' shit intentionally?

You suck, and your music is pathetic.

leahzero · Post by **leahzero** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 9:58 am

runagate wrote:As a futher hikack of your thread, however, I must point out how sublimely glad I am that KVR seems to be hostile to trance to the purveyors of such to the point where they point out where their specific forums exist. Perhaps they'll all go away instead of dominating every day with "better Virus" and "better sine bass" threads. Somewhere an actually intelligent maker of techno must be aghast at his name being sullied by every fucktard that places their kicks at the beginning of every single bar.

My apologies, I was mistaken with my comment earlier.

I meant the groan/bitch elite.

Hewitt Huntwork · Post by **Hewitt Huntwork** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 10:18 am

runagate wrote: fucktard

I was trying to think of the perfect word to describe someone who clutters up the forum with posts nobody wants to read, who doesn't know "wtf" [they're] doing", and "just lends [themselves] to repetetive, mind-numbing idiocy".

Thank you for providing the perfect example I was looking for!

hoffy · Post by **hoffy** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 10:27 am

click on runagate's signature. Seriously. Once you hear his shit music you'll figure out that he couldn't write this style of music if he tried.

Incidently, i don't like psy-trance either. But at least it doesn't sound like whatever down-syndrome type music runagate attempts...

Like there's serious psy producers (ie: signed psy trance artists) who use KvR and post questions about "better virus" hardware synths and "better sine bass"...

... funnily enough, there are "producers" of glitch and other shit who make idiotic posts here all the time.

Runagate, you're a talentless shit.

Goa and Psytrance production tips