help connecting my mixer

[evileye]

right i have a spirit soundcraft notepad mixer, a m-audio audiophile soundcard, sony amp alesis passive monitors
im haveing trouble understanding how to connect my mic up so i can hear my track through my headphones while recording vocal. Here is my mixer



i only have 1 stereo output and 1 stereo input on my sound card
any help with this is much appreciated. im feeling very frustrated

[Sascha Franck]

Alright, there's a bunch of options. Basically, it comes down to how you *feed* your soundcard with the signal you're going to record. And, the options to do so largely depend on what else you want to record.

But let's start with a rather simple scenario, such as only recording a single, mono soundsource - as your mic.
In that case, the mic runs into a mixer channel. Fine, but how to send it to the soundcard? Connecting the main out of the mixer to the soundcard would be less than ideal, since in that case you couldn't use it for monitoring anymore.
But, there's one output option left, that's the FX send.
Now, when you connect one of the ins of your soundcard to that one, you should be able to get some level into the card when turning up the FX send knob.
Fine so far.

To monitor, you just send your soundcard out to one of the stereo channels or to the tape in.

Both your mic and soundcard signals should now be on the headphone out.

The downsides of this method:
- Your recording level is relative to your monitoring level. Once you turn down your mic channels level, the signal running into the soundcard will be lower as well, the reason being that FX sends are post fader (that's your channels volume knob).
- Having said that, it should be almost impossible to do software monitoring with such a setup, as you'd always need the mixer levels to be up, in order to record anything.

Alternatively, you could as well connect the main outs of the mixer to your soundcard. But in that case you'd effectively degrade to some "input only mixer" as nothing else could be done with it. Your monitoring system had to be fed by the soundcard directly. And there'd be no comfortable headphone monitoring either - unless you have an option on your monitoring system (i.e. your HiFi) and would go for software monitoring (or use the Audiophiles software mixer).

In a better world, your mixer would have an additional pre-fader FX send. In that case you could manage everything a whole lot easier, your monitoring levels would be completely independent of your recording levels and you could as well do software monitoring (including FX and such) without a rather wide stretch.

[evileye]

thanks for the help
much appricated
maybe its worth me buying a decent soundcard with a few outputs

[Sascha Franck]

maybe its worth me buying a decent soundcard with a few outputs

Why? I mean, you're not planning to mix outside the computer, are you?
I think you should rather consider a tad more flexible mixer (better routing options).

[where02190]

Dumpm the crappy mixer and consumer soundcard for a real ADDA wih a mic pre or two, There are several in the under $400 range that are great, such as the Prtesonus Firebox.

[Sascha Franck]

Dumpm the crappy mixer and consumer soundcard for a real ADDA wih a mic pre or two,

I may agree on the mixer part, but I certainly don't agree on the soundcard.
It's doing a fine (if not great) job (best drivers ever), and if you need better converter quality, you can easily upgrade your setup with external ADDA converters, as the Audiophile has an SPDIF I/O.
Talking about that, a nice home studio solution, allowing for all sorts of routings, would be the Mindprint Trio. Good preamp channels and digital I/O.

[where02190]

Why add more pieces to the puzzle, get a decent ADDA with mic pres and be done with it.

[Sascha Franck]

Why add more pieces to the puzzle, get a decent ADDA with mic pres and be done with it.

So, what soundcard with decent mic preamps and ADDAs would you recommend?
There's almost none, unless you want to go FW or USB (something still not as good as PCI, in terms of latency).
And I don't think the OP is asking for a FW400 or whatever. This seems to be a rather simple home studio setup and not everybody's got the $$$ for what you recommend.
I stand by what I've said: The Audiophile is just fine and with an additional thingy such as the Mindprint Trio you're all set for a rather well sounding home studio.

[where02190]

there are tons of PCI ADDA with pres, check out the M-audio line for starters.

In addition, FW 400, unless you're trying to overdub with a ton of plugins, will have no latency issues.

For under $400 the Presonus Firebox has 2 great pres, 4 addtonal ins(2 line 2 spdif) and 8 outs.

[Sascha Franck]

there are tons of PCI ADDA with pres, check out the M-audio line for starters.

Which ones? And fwiw, he HAS an M-Audio card already. All he need is converters, no new soundcard.

In addition, FW 400, unless you're trying to overdub with a ton of plugins, will have no latency issues.

You have no idea about latency, as it seems. It's got nothing to do with plugins, unless you *really* tax the machine, but it's got all to do with drivers and the used protocol. PCI is by far superior than FW or USB.
Not that this would necessarily matter, but in case you're going for any sort of software monitoring, it certainly does.

For under $400 the Presonus Firebox has 2 great pres, 4 addtonal ins(2 line 2 spdif) and 8 outs.

The Mindprint Trio comes at around 160 Euros. Quite a difference.
Apart from that, I heard about a lot of driver problems regarding the Prosonus stuff.

[where02190]

Actually it is you who doesn't have a correct understanding of latency, which is often the case with finger pointers such as yourself. I work daily with FW drives and interfaces, and thus have years of first hand experience with same. More plugins, more latency. More plugins take longer to process, creating a longer time between incoming overdub signals and the already recorded tracks, and occurs with any protocol, PCI, FW or USB.

the OP has no pres with their current ADDA, thus the shitty mixer. Replacing both with a single device that has same will give them what they are looking for in a simpler and better quality package.

Let us know if you need help getting that foot out of your mouth.

[Sascha Franck]

Actually it is you who doesn't have a correct understanding of latency. I work daily with FW drives and interfaces, and thus have years of first hand experience with same. More plugins, more latency.

I mean, sorry, but really: What the f**k are you trying to tell me, Mr.Knowitall?
I AM aware of some plugins introducing latency, but that's *some* - and you *do* understand the meaning of *some*, now don't you? There's more than enough plugins *not* introducing further latencies, at least not enough to get any more noticeable than the latency introduced by your soundcard - namely those that you may usually use in a software monitoring context, such as guitar amp sims, EQs and what not.
Of course you wouldn't use anything such as SIR in a software monitoring context.

the OP has no pres with their current ADDA, thus the shitty mixer. Replacing both with a single device that has same will give them what they are looking for.

But the OP is running a modest home studio, something you simply don't seem to be able to accept.
And for such a setup, the solution I suggested not only is cheaper, but it's also allowing for continous use of the Audiophile, which unarguably is one of the most stable and lowest-latency solutions you can buy for a home studio based on a desktop machine.
Suggesting to get rid of it in order to spend even more money for a new FW device, that wouldn't only raise the lowest possible latencies but would as well result in having to deal with new driver setups and what not is just one thing: Bad advice - not hopefully helpful at all, as you try to suggest in your signature.

Had you adviced on getting a better mixer, a better preamp (possibly with digital outs), I would've gladly agreed with you, but what you suggested instead is just doing no good.

[jupiter8]

More plugins, more latency. More plugins take longer to process, creating a longer time between incoming overdub signals and the already recorded tracks, and occurs with any protocol, PCI, FW or USB.

Still speaking out of your ass i see.

[Sascha Franck]

Still speaking out of your ass i see.

Well, isn't it amazing how many people are just doing that over here?
In this case it's really making me wonder, though, as I've seen quite some good advices from where02190 in the past, so I thought he'd be a rather well informed person.

[where02190]

Any plugin creates latency. Some are better than others, but it is impossible for a plugin not to introduce latency, as it takes time, while extremely short, for the plugin to process, which is what creates the latency. Anyone with the smallest clue about digital audio learns this on day one.

So up your ass, you ignorant f**k. educate yourself before you shit out of it again or shut the f**k up.