KVR Audio

Stargard · Post by **Stargard** » Sat Jun 02, 2007 1:12 pm

the choir's chords are ok. but based on the harmonies, you could make many different bassline runs that would fit. the easiest one: 2 bars F, 2 bars C, 4 bars C#

try it out.

Subtle · Post by **Subtle** » Sat Jun 02, 2007 1:27 pm

Thanks that bassline works... but its not the mood im looking for.. so my solution is now to recreate the choir and adjust it accordingly.. however my lack of skills in finding the notes, even when i got them written to me on the last page is going to make it hard for me.

I sincerely appreciate every input.

CinningBao · Post by **CinningBao** » Sat Jun 02, 2007 1:33 pm

C Eb G is C minor
C F G is what we call a sustained 4th or 'C sus4' for crude shorthand
(play them on a keyboard and you'll hear the difference)

- most chords are triads (three notes) and one of those notes is usually the third. third's are crucial for determining the happy/sad (major/minor) aspect of the chord, so when you say 'aren't these the same chords?' the answer is no; one is a minor triad and the other is a sustained 4th (which, if you play it, can be resolved by dropping the '4th' (in this case the F) a semitone (to E) to create a happy major chord, or Eb to create a minor chord.

I would really suggest you get some tuition.

jakob · Post by **jakob** » Sat Jun 02, 2007 1:38 pm

Music-Man to the rescue! Defender of harmonies, defeater of dissonances!

I just fired up my sequencer, loaded a GM choir Aah (from the fluid soundfont) hacked in the chords (thanks, CinningBao), so here you go:

Choir loop with drums, original key (F minor)
Choir loop, A minor, just transposed up 4 semitones
Choir loop, A minor, inverted chords so it's not too high

Music-Man .... awaaaay!

Jakob

csl · Post by **csl** » Sat Jun 02, 2007 1:44 pm

personally i'd just shift the bass to an F and be done with it. then you could add a bit of movement, as stargard suggested, by doing 2bars f, 2 bars Eb, 4bars Db (ie, just dropping 2 semitones each time). that'd match the choir's mood imo.

just move the A bass to F though and it'll hopefully make more sense - that's all you need to do for starters.

Subtle · Post by **Subtle** » Sat Jun 02, 2007 1:53 pm

Musicman, wow.. those choir sounds great.. really awesome.. if you could have made the transposed choir at 128 BPM for me, plus twice the length too loop it. I would forever be grateful !!!!

CinningBao, Ah i see for a moment there i though Eb is the equilevant to F since i though Eb meant upping the note to F. while it means putting the note down to D#.. cool.. now i learned that atleast.

Subtle · Post by **Subtle** » Sat Jun 02, 2007 1:55 pm

csl wrote:personally i'd just shift the bass to an F and be done with it. then you could add a bit of movement, as stargard suggested, by doing 2bars f, 2 bars Eb, 4bars Db (ie, just dropping 2 semitones each time). that'd match the choir's mood imo.

just move the A bass to F though and it'll hopefully make more sense - that's all you need to do for starters.

Thanks.. yeah i know.. but the rest of the track is already recorded and mixed for the key A Minor. The choir only plays for one part of the track.

afreshcupofjoe · Post by **afreshcupofjoe** » Sat Jun 02, 2007 2:59 pm

Why change it? It's definitely dissonant, but it sounds good! There's nothing wrong with a bit of dissonance. If you put the choir in the right key, then it would turn a work of art into a typical cheese fest IMO. I have to agree with your producer friend here. In the 21st century there really is no "wrong key". Just do what sounds good.

Subtle · Post by **Subtle** » Sat Jun 02, 2007 3:08 pm

Hey thanks.. im very glad u think it sounded good, cause i thought so too.. thats prolly why i accepted and used it. but people were complaining about it so. im definitely changing it now thanks to Jakob's samples.

JumpingJackFlash · Post by **JumpingJackFlash** » Sat Jun 02, 2007 3:50 pm

Subtle wrote:CinningBao, Ah i see for a moment there i though Eb is the equilevant to F since i though Eb meant upping the note to F. while it means putting the note down to D#.. cool.. now i learned that atleast.

I suggest you read my Introduction to Music Theory. I know I'm biassed, but it will help you get to grips with these basics.

Stuff can be out-of key and still sound ok, but like others have said, if you really care about music, you need to know why (and how) this works. So, a basic knowledge of keys and chords is essential, in my opinion at least.

jakob · Post by **jakob** » Sat Jun 02, 2007 5:10 pm

Subtle wrote:Musicman, wow.. those choir sounds great.. really awesome.. if you could have made the transposed choir at 128 BPM for me, plus twice the length too loop it. I would forever be grateful !!!!

I may get to that later, but doesn't your sequencer support audio-stretching? And you can put the thing in twice to loop it, can't you? What software are you using?

Subtle · Post by **Subtle** » Sat Jun 02, 2007 5:28 pm

jakob wrote:
Subtle wrote:Musicman, wow.. those choir sounds great.. really awesome.. if you could have made the transposed choir at 128 BPM for me, plus twice the length too loop it. I would forever be grateful !!!!
I may get to that later, but doesn't your sequencer support audio-stretching? And you can put the thing in twice to loop it, can't you? What software are you using?

Yeah, already done that. =D remix is finished.

I'll check out ur tutorial JumpingJack

Subtle · Post by **Subtle** » Sat Jun 02, 2007 6:25 pm

Alright, i thank u all for ur effort to help me finish this remix.

For those interested here is the result:

http://www.subtleinc.net/Astral_Project ... _Remix.mp3

Cheers

jakob · Post by **jakob** » Sat Jun 02, 2007 6:35 pm

cool mix, and those choirs are sooo smooth

Anyway, glad to help!

Musicman .... awaaaaaay!

MauroR · Post by **MauroR** » Thu Jun 07, 2007 9:01 pm

Yes the bass part is off-key but the track it's quite cool, just train you ear more and you'll be fine.

Can anyone tell me which key this is in ?