KVR Audio

sounddesigner · Post by **sounddesigner** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 4:45 am

I'm about to buy a cheap Mic preamp and i was looking at the Presonous Eureka, the Dbx 376 and the Tlaudio 5050 . has anyone used any of these and have any comments on them? wich of these do you think is best and why? I've never heard either and will only be demoing the one i purchase during the 45 day return policy period. Also if you know of another good one in the $400-$600 range i'd like to know.

morphex · Post by **morphex** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 7:19 am

Out of the units you mentioned, I've had the most personal experience with the PreSonus Eureka channel strip. I personally think that the Eureka is capable of producing great-sounding recordings (with a well-matched mic). For the price, you get a well-constructed piece of hardware with many tone-shaping options. I like the concept of a channel strip that is a 'jack of all trades'. By that I mean, if finances are tight, it's great to have a pre with eq and compression all in one unit. The Eureka also features a 'saturate' control to simulate the effects of tape-saturation.

I have used the Eureka while recording vocals (great for adding a splash of coloration), keyboards/synths, drum-machines, as well as acoustic guitar and percussion. I found that having a little bit of compression and eq available during the 'tracking' stage, helped me to get the right sound right off the start, which made the mixing process a little easier and quicker. I should note though that I was recording a 'dry' take along with the take processed by the Eureka, just in case I wanted to use plug-ins instead of hardware later.

I have not used any of the products made by TL Audio, but I plan to. My friend uses a TL Audio mic pre as well as their project-studio sized mixing console (I think it's called The Tubetracker). The tracks I've heard where these units were used sounded very 'silky and warm'. Yes, sounds like a cliche, but I loved the results when used with a high-quality microphone and an acoustic guitar with some vocals. Drums and synths also had a real 'posh' sound to them.

If you're only looking for units that are between $400-$600, the Eureka is a good value. As far as I know, most of the TL Audio stuff is more expensive. Another option would be one of the offerings from Focusrite, i.e.- TwinTrack Pro (2-channel mic pre with eq and opto-compressor at $599), or if you'll be recording mostly vocals, the VoiceMaster Pro (vocal-friendly channel strip with eq, de-esser and compressor at $649).

It really comes down to what type of recordings you'll be making (i.e.-acoustic or synths, etc.) and if you need the added eq or compressor features. True Systems makes the P-SOLO at about $600. I've listened to recordings made with this that have an amazing amount of detail and depth. There is no eq or compressor though. Another great value (but more expensive) is Universal Audio's SOLO/610 or SOLO/110. The difference is the 610 is a classic vacuum pre/DI where the 110 is pure class A, and can sound totally clean or crunchy depending on settings. They are both around $800 but are worth the extra money if you don't want or need additional eq and compression. For less expensive units, ART makes some boxes that specialize in dialing in a tube sound.

I would suggest calling your local music retailer and making an appointment to demo their products. I would bring the mic you intend to use as well as any music on cd that could be ran through the unit, this way you'll be able to hear the different sonic characteristics of each piece of gear before you decide on what to spend your money on. Hope that helps. Good luck.

Peace - morphex

where02190 · Post by **where02190** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 10:36 am

Hands down the best pre's in your pricerange are the FMR RNP. For $500 you'll get 2 great preamps that'll blow away pre's consting 4x that.

sounddesigner · Post by **sounddesigner** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 4:13 am

Thanks for the feedback it is greatly appreciated and also sent me in another direction. The mic pre's i'm looking at now are the True Systems P-Solo and the Fmr rnp because i prefer just bringing in a very clean and detailed signal, My focus is on fidelity rather then eq and compresson etc or coloring in general. I also like what i read about on the universal audio solo 110, but that would require me doing more money saving. BIG help you've been Thanks!

afreshcupofjoe · Post by **afreshcupofjoe** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 4:21 am

Another vote for the FMR RNP.

Danno · Post by **Danno** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 4:30 am

If I may add my take:

I have the HHB Radius 10, which I believe is the same as the TLA 5001... which in turn has the same pre as the TLA you are considering. (I think so, anyway)

We have done a bunch of AB's with the Presonus ADL600, the Portico line, the Chandler line, the UA6176, ..etc..etc... These all sounded BETTER of course, but not by THAT much. By contrast, I found the inexpensive Presonus range way less pleasing to my ears.
(That ADL600 is effing awesome tho... my dream pre, I think)

The RNP is great tho.... not quite as present as the 6176 or the Chandler we tested,

) but still quite nice.

If you want to get a little tubeyness, then maybe check the TLA out.. but for cleaner sounds, the RNP is great!

Danno

Uncle E · Post by **Uncle E** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 5:18 am

The Rane MS1b specs out the same as the Grace 101 yet only costs $149. The Groove Tubes Brick sounds the same as one of the settings on the ViPre, it's a bit noisy & doesn't have enough gain for some applications but it'll give you more tube vibe than hybrid pre's like the lower-end TL Audio's/HHB's. Anyway, of the pre's you mentioned, I'd recommend getting the Presonus & swapping the op amp out for a Burr Brown, bringing it close to the old MP20 spec.

where02190 · Post by **where02190** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 12:20 pm

If transparant is what you're looking for, the only one so far mentioned worth looking into is the FMR RNP. Nothing with tubes is going to be transparant.

Uncle E · Post by **Uncle E** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 5:12 pm

where02190 wrote:If transparant is what you're looking for, the only one so far mentioned worth looking into is the FMR RNP.

The RNP isn't as transparent as Rane MS1b or Grace 101. It's not even designed to be.

Killvehicle · Post by **Killvehicle** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 5:54 pm

where02190 wrote:If transparant is what you're looking for, the only one so far mentioned worth looking into is the FMR RNP. Nothing with tubes is going to be transparant.

The Presonus Eureka isnt tubes either, I feel it can be very transparent. It has a tube saturation control which isnt tube either, hence most of the time I leave it off.. And FWIW the compressor in the Eureka is very nice as well, Hell even if you dont use the compressor or EQ during tracking, you can use the compressor and EQ as a typical hardware compressor/Eq by bypassing the preamp stage. I still use a lot of outboard gear and enjoy this fact..

afreshcupofjoe · Post by **afreshcupofjoe** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 12:51 am

where02190 wrote:If transparant is what you're looking for, the only one so far mentioned worth looking into is the FMR RNP. Nothing with tubes is going to be transparant.

Tubes can be very transparent, but you have to spend a lot of money. Nothing in the "less than $1000" price range uses tubes how they are designed to be implemented. They use low voltage "starved plate" circuits which just add distortion to the signal. They are only good for adding grime to your sound, and IMO they are a waste of money, because the cost of adding the tube circuit could have gone into better components that would have improved the quality of the entire amp. So Where02190's advice is good in this case, stay away from anything (in this price range) with a tube in it.

Uncle E wrote:
where02190 wrote:If transparant is what you're looking for, the only one so far mentioned worth looking into is the FMR RNP.
The RNP isn't as transparent as Rane MS1b or Grace 101. It's not even designed to be.

This is true, the RNP is not as transparent as the RaneMS1b or Grace101, but I wouldn't even put the Rane in the same category as the RNP. The Rane is very nice for the price, but it's just not the same quality of preamp as the RNP. Specs don't mean all that much. The Rane also has better specs than a Neve, but I don't know of anyone who would trade their Neve1073 for a Rane MS1b.

The Grace 101, on the other hand, IS a very nice preamp, and it is VERY transparent. It's definitley in the same league as the RNP, if not slightly better. It just depends on what kind of flavor you like.

The RNP is not really tranparent, but this doesn't mean it's not detailed. It just imparts a bit of it's own subtle color or character on the sound. I would say is similar to the way API preamps have a bit of character, and wouldn't be considered transparent. It's not anything like the kind of saturation they put in all of this fake "starved plate" junk that everyone is so familiar with.

Uncle E · Post by **Uncle E** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 1:44 am

afreshcupofjoe wrote:It's not anything like the kind of saturation they put in all of this fake "starved plate" junk that everyone is so familiar with.

The Groove Tubes Brick & Universal Audio Solo-610 don't use starved plate designs. There are even a couple ART pre's that hit the tubes with 300V, though they still sound terrible despite it.

sounddesigner · Post by **sounddesigner** » Thu Jun 14, 2007 8:51 pm

I ended up buying the 'Grace design 101' (wich i knew nothing about before this thread). It is very clean sounding and i am very pleased! Thanks for the help!

Anyone use these mic preamps?