Power Conditions?

[Broz]

I have read that many power supplies can dull the tone of your equipment(in my case a tube guitar amp)by makeing it sound muddy and lose definiton. Does anyone on here know anything about this and could a Power Conditioner improve my tone. I'm looking at a Furman Power Factor Pro.

[audiorules]

You mean AC power source, not power supply.

Unless you live in an area that is subject to major brownouts, or are so remote the power is really shit (low voltage, poor ground) then there's no need to worry about your power.

If you are intending on getting a power regulator, get something that's going to regulate, protect and give you backup, get a real UPS, AKA uninterupted power supply. They are not cheap, but will output clean, regulated balanced power that is consistant and should your power go down, provide you with backup power to safely shut down without worry of a sudden line spike when the power restores.

APC is the leader in this industry, and their products blow away anthing Furman makes, which, with very few exceptions is snake oil in disguise. Few of their products have any real protection or do much of anything to "condition" the incoming power.

[BertKoor]

Power conditioners are 95% marketing bullshit for audiophiles that have no clue how stuff actually works, but have enough money to spend on chasing their Holy Grail.

The power (and it's "condition") that comes out of the wall at your place has hardly any corellation with the tone (muddy or tight definition or whatever) of your tube amp.

Normal mains power is 110V or 220V or thereabout, and it's AC: Alternating Current at 50 or 60Hz. So look at it with a scope and it resembles a nice sine wave. No, it's not exactly a sine, but close enough for now.

If appropriate actions weren't taken in the power supply of your amp, then your guitar signal would go up and down in volume 50 or 60 times per second. We call that Amplitude Modulation or AM, and it would sound like a giant hum. Not nice...

So the mains power is converted to Decent Current (DC in short) by means of a rectifier and a capacitator and some other electronic bits. The target is to have the most ideal and stable power supply fo rthe amp to work as predictable as possible. The designer knows that the incoming voltage fluctuates (50 or 60 times each second by definition, sometimes it's 220 and another time 240V) so he'll do whatever he can.

Now in this operating model (AC -> power supply -> DC) you can do whatever you want to the incoming power, but the power supply will delive the very same decent current to the amp. That's it's job.

So any power conditioning that supposedly changes the sound is 100% hocus-pocus. No such thing. But the guy that spent several hundreds (or thousands) of dollars on it will believe he'll hear the non-existing difference to justify the expense. People are suckers, we like to be fooled.

BUT: there are situations where power conditioners DO have effect! In heavy industrial places with power fluctuating all the time for example, or when you have no choice but to draw power from the same group where fluorescent lights or dimmers operate, or when the fridge switches on/off you hear that as a click. Then you want to filter out anything above 60Hz and stabilize the current, and power conditioners can do that if the power supply of whatever device isn't up to the job.

[BertKoor]

If you really do want to improve the tone of your guitar + amp, then look into the following:

* Pickups and electronics of your guitar. Not something you'd experiment with on a daily basis, but it can be worthwile to replace! Also new strings may bring some life back.

* The cord between the guitar and the amp: shorter and thicker is usually better. If you hear crackling when moving or stepping on it, it definitely needs replacement.

* Anything else inbetween the guitar and the amp, like stomp boxes. Ofcourse they add effects, but they will also degrade the sound when switched to bypass. So pick carefully what you need. I used to have a Boss digital effects processor, but don't use it anymore since it changed the tone even when everything was on bypass. Replaced it by a Tech21 TriOD overdrive plus a Boss BF2 flanger, and that combo sounds much better. Running stomp boxes on batteries instead of power adapters reduces hum.

* The condition of your amp. Tubes wear out and need replacement every now and then, and the bias may need adjustment at the same time. I play a couple of hours per week on my amp, and have the amp serviced about every three years.

* The speaker cabinet connected to your amp has a big influence to it's sound also. It may take some critical listening sessions to pick the best cabinet for your amp.

[whyterabbyt]

We call that Amplitude Modulation or AM, and it would sound like a giant hum. Not nice...

pfft. mains hum good. http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 54#2577554

[Alan]

Power conditioners are 95% marketing bullshit for audiophiles that have no clue how stuff actually works, but have enough money to spend on chasing their Holy Grail.

Then there's the rest of us who get tired of replacing expensive equipment due to dirty electricity. I agree with the audiophile part for the most part.

[audiorules]

For the most part, conditioners for tube amps are completely unnecessary, and I agree with Bertcoor. However, not completely. Voltage variations will definitely change the tone of the amp, and it's not uncommon for venues to have low voltage, and, in the case of clubs and smaller venues, noisy power due to compressors from HVAC or coolers on the same circuit which will cause voltage drops and add noise to the line.

While it's true the PSU section of your amp mostly converts to DC power, there is a massive amount of voltage applied to your tubes, (deadly if you touch it right) and dips in voltage or low current flow will definitely affect this, and the tone of your amp.

In a digital studio, a good UPS is a must have. Not for tonal qualities, but for safety. Spikes in the line, dirty power, or power failures are all potentially deadly to studio electronics and good clean audio.

[Hink]

Power conditioners are 95% marketing bullshit for audiophiles that have no clue how stuff actually works, but have enough money to spend on chasing their Holy Grail.

Then there's the rest of us who get tired of replacing expensive equipment due to dirty electricity. I agree with the audiophile part for the most part.

In my younger days I played a lot of dives with both a plexi halfstack and then a boogie halfstack I can tell you that power does matter in some cases and yes it seriously hurts the guitar sound (it really doesn't take much variance to be detrimental either)...but of course I'm talking tube amps here which do indeed draw a lot of power. Much of today's gear have better transformers and smaller power requirements...so I reckon this fits into the other 5%...

[audiorules]

Actually your typical Marshall or Boogie 100W head won't draw more than about 5 amps, less than most hair dryers. The problems arise when clubs have beer coolers, AC, neon bar signs, etc., on the same leg as the stage power. The compressors in the AC and coolers, when they kick in, draw a massive amount of current, and can significantly lower the voltage, which electronics don't like, especially tube amps, and will, if exposed to it over time, severly shorten the life of components.

Neon or flourescent lighting will induce some massive noise in the AC line, as well as in single coil pickups.

[Hink]

Actually your typical Marshall or Boogie 100W head won't draw more than about 5 amps, less than most hair dryers. The problems arise when clubs have beer coolers, AC, neon bar signs, etc., on the same leg as the stage power. The compressors in the AC and coolers, when they kick in, draw a massive amount of current, and can significantly lower the voltage, which electronics don't like, especially tube amps, and will, if exposed to it over time, severly shorten the life of components.

Neon or flourescent lighting will induce some massive noise in the AC line, as well as in single coil pickups.

actually it was the light show, PA and the rest of the band that robbed my amp of power....most places I've played the bar and ac were on different circuits...they were dives, but not that bad...

edit: fwiw the light show wasn't fluorescent....

[audiorules]

Diference circuits is not the same as a different leg of power.