Vista, is just a phase

[glokraw]

bombproof

I just had a crash with Feisty 1 hour ago

Although my jacklab-openSUSE 10.2 wineasio sysytem is very solid,I crash my debian unstable/experimental setup every week ':-o', as befitting
the names of those repositories, but I don't lose data, and I don't bother logging out, just hit the off button...and to make it worse, I have ubuntu and Mepis stuff mixed in,
not highly recommended, and on top of it, some apps were RPMs converted to DEBs with alien...Now I'm sure -that- is what Mr Torvalds had in mind from the beginning!

And there is a new beta of the Jacklab openSUSE audio distro, with tons of fixes,
and wineasio built in...just to keep it fair!

[robenestobenz]

okay, so here it is, again! No details, this is fact, of which you're free to look up:

Linux has better performance, Windows looks better. The End. Everyone agrees.

You're either in a different argument or you keep perversely misrepresenting what everyone else says to better set up your own viewpoint. For a start there's plenty of nice looking Linux distros. The overall message here, is that linux is more secure, economical on resources and open in various ways, whilst windows is de facto more established, widely supported and compatible with different configurations. It's not a good thing, but it's the way it is and an intrinsic virtue.

[Lunch Money]

Besides that, Windows looks better isn't a fact anyhow. I prefer the look of Ubuntu.

Radek, the extra info you provided doesn't contradict what I said, though. So that's another couple of straw men.

glokraw: cheers for that-- I can't promise I'm going to follow through on your example ('cause I'm not much of a synth guy, among other reasons), but I certainly appreciate the concrete example of Linux audio coolness.

[glokraw]

Besides that, Windows looks better isn't a fact anyhow. I prefer the look of Ubuntu.

Radek, the extra info you provided doesn't contradict what I said, though. So that's another couple of straw men.

glokraw: cheers for that-- I can't promise I'm going to follow through on your example ('cause I'm not much of a synth guy, among other reasons), but I certainly appreciate the concrete example of Linux audio coolness.

Well, if you be a guitar hero, I hope you use ecamegapedal the linux virtual stompbox for ladspa plugins, and creox self contained multi-fx, as you can route the fx in and out of themselves/each other with jack, willynilly, only limited by sanity and cpu, just plug in that axe and RAVE! (Some very nice ladspa FX, but careful, as the ecamegapedal will not monitor volume, as you test fx (just pickem from the long list)

Creox has tremolo, phaser, distortion, flanger and echo, each can be on or off with the others as desired, so phase and echo your guitar (or whatever), and send it into an input of the ecamegapedal, and give it some crunch! Then back for tremolo and distortion...Oh, this can get really sick!!!

Also edited previous post to show how to get to the zyn banks, for those curious, just menu
and button stuff...

[hseiken]

By looks better, I mean, you'd be more likely to buy a used pc with windows built in, no? App selection looks good...etc...

Looks = candy...visual, applications, etc. It's all candy...candy is looks.

[Lunch Money]

I thought looks were looks. Now I'm all confused-- looks means app selection?

[james0tucson]

...uselessmind...it's not just a clever handle...

"Can I put silverware in the microwave?"

hmm...

how do you boil an egg in a microwave?

I have a microwave egg cooker. It works really well. I don't know where it came from but it's shaped like an egg, and will boil 4 at a time. My wife uses it occasionally to make eggs for party trays.

[Meffy]

Belgium is just a place I remember.
Streets of light, one forgotten night,
Early flight, we just slipped away,
Sharing breakfast, nothing left to say.

[DuX]

I'm tired so I'll try to be a bit short [for my usual and rare posts], a bit sarcastic and probably a bit cryptic... First, I don't give an ant's arse about Vista. Tried it, installed XP back. If you're serious about your DAW - you'll do the same or avoid the testing part completely because it's a waste of your precious time. It's a marketing scam and there are many MS droids, inexperienced users that've never seen a computer working properly, ignorant people in general, and other bored and ignorant children of MS around trying to convince people that Vista is worth it - don't believe them. It's just crap. [ fullstop ]

I've read the whole thread and visited all the links. It was very interesting. Thanks for the links, that book about MS is really good and very true IME. I've been in IT for veeery long and that book reminded me of all the shit I've been through with MS OSes through years... please god make them go away, although I must admit MS is making us in IT quite some money with this pile of crap they're trying to sell as an "OS".

On topic: Yep, Vista is a nice phase towards MS's demise. I'm glad they made such #@$%! OS. It'll speed things up...

Linux or BSD for Internet and other usual crap you do on your comp is an excellent choice - my choice. i'm very glad I made it. It feels nice using Linux and it's not a bit tougher to use than Windows. Same procedures only different package IYKWIM. You have to give it some time to learn those different procedures. it's unrealistic to expect from any OS to work properly right out of the box. Windows doesn't work properly right out of the box too, I don't know what some people are talking about... MS advocates probably?

Windows XP, nlited to the bare bone for audio and graphics is still a necessity for me, unfortunately and quite indefinitely I think, but some time in the future...

Thasit. I'm a happy camper now,

The most important thing is that everything works nicely for me [Linux/XP combo] and MS is going to hell. Life is wonderful. As far as I'm concerned i can work with this setup until I die. I only hate bugs, I don't need any other "new" or "better" features in anything, just fix all the bugs in everything and make it as stable as possible [I'm talking XP, Linux, plugins and everything software related in general].

Cheers!

[hseiken]

I thought looks were looks. Now I'm all confused-- looks means app selection?

Yeah, was tired and drunk when that post was made...now I'm just tired.

[Wopelka]

recently i bought a laptop with Vista installed on it.

Very nice, looks gorgeous, no problem for the end-user that I am.

i'm a happy Vista owner.

[mcgwd]

OS wars are stale, use what you need/want to get job done.Why waste time trying to explain superiority, write music and use forums as a resource.Its a waste of energy, seriously.

[Lunch Money]

I've noticed a few of you Linux gurus already offering your help, but anybody else got any ideas for poor ol' koolkeys?

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2621190

And yes, this is primarily a sneaky way of saying, "easy, eh?"

--

Dux: WindowsXP DOES work out of the box. I'm not sure why you think it doesn't. And I've already stated I'm not an MS advocate, I just use what works. <shrug>

[DuX]

@Lunch Money: So you don't have to install any drivers or tweak and setup anything after you install XP? That's odd. I usually say to my clients "that's when all the *fun* starts" [after the install] . Since I have a customised nLite XP install I don't have to spend so much time setting it all up, but you have to install all the drivers properly at least.

Same with Linux or any other OS. I've never seen a case of "it just works" . I mean, it can work that way, but that's not a proper install. It's a well known fact that the newest drivers you download directly from the manufacturers site are better than the MS generic ones. You should disable as much of MS stuff in XP as you can to have everything working properly [stable]. Talking about "stable", Win2000 was in general more stable than XP.

So far as music software/making goes, I'm so used to doing it in Windows - when you set it up right it's really easy and productive. The only things that bother me sometimes are technical in nature, like "what is this working in the background", "couldn't this work smoother" and such. XP has become a "Music OS" for me, even though *technically speaking" it's not up to the task as Linux can be, but what the hell . If it works... hmmm OS-X is more like it, though [Music OS].

and I'm far from being a "Linux guru", I just use it for internet and everyday work, and it's the same as anything else, but it feels somewhat better than XP, morally speaking, like freeing yourself from the chains or something.

Cheers!

[Lunch Money]

@Lunch Money: So you don't have to install any drivers or tweak and setup anything after you install XP? That's odd. I usually say to my clients "that's when all the *fun* starts" [after the install] . Since I have a customised nLite XP install I don't have to spend so much time setting it all up, but you have to install all the drivers properly at least.

Sure. My video card, LAN card, and onboard audio all work out of the box. When I plug in my external HDD or Sansa MP3 player or USB key, they're recognized and work perfectly.

But that's not exactly what I meant, I guess. I can see why it might have seemed that way, as I was being fairly short. But to get my Mackie soundcard, Line 6 TonePort, and Edirol keyboard to work properly, I need to install drivers. To use my vid card's full capabilities, I need to install drivers. But those can be seen as add-ons, which also work "out of the box"-- I plug them in, run the setup wizard once, and it's done. There are no Linux options for any of those peripherals. Video cards have workarounds in Linux, but manual definitions are NOT easy and not for the faint of heart. I'll take a pass.

Same with Linux or any other OS. I've never seen a case of "it just works" . I mean, it can work that way, but that's not a proper install. It's a well known fact that the newest drivers you download directly from the manufacturers site are better than the MS generic ones. You should disable as much of MS stuff in XP as you can to have everything working properly [stable]. Talking about "stable", Win2000 was in general more stable than XP.

Yeah, I'm debating, but I DO agree to a certain extent. Where I don't agree is where you say "Same Linux". As mentioned in my above paragraph, the option simply isn't there with Linux. I don't ascribe to the last two beliefs, though-- disabling XP stuff is generally a way to invite INstability, although it can sometimes be a way to gain back some performance-- but those are two different points. Disabling services can have unexpected results. Disabling the user-accessible stuff like ClearType and transparent menus (or whatever) used to be important back when XP was first released and machines were more modest. On a modern machine, it's negligible. WinXP and Win2000 are so similar in terms of stability that it's almost a non-issue, but it's a matter for debate that 2K is "more" stable. That hasn't been my experience (at least, since SP2), and when XP DOES hiccup from time to time, it's more able to self-recover without reboot than 2K was.

So far as music software/making goes, I'm so used to doing it in Windows - when you set it up right it's really easy and productive. The only things that bother me sometimes are technical in nature, like "what is this working in the background", "couldn't this work smoother" and such. XP has become a "Music OS" for me, even though *technically speaking" it's not up to the task as Linux can be, but what the hell . If it works... hmmm OS-X is more like it, though [Music OS].

Yeah, I'm indifferent to the Mac/PC debate. I really hate Apple's marketing strategies, but I'd definitely use a Mac if one were offered to me. Since nobody's offered one, I'll stick to PC for now. And I definitely DO agree that Linux has more raw potential to be an efficient music machine than any flavour of Windows. With any luck, we'll even see it happen in my lifetime.

and I'm far from being a "Linux guru", I just use it for internet and everyday work, and it's the same as anything else, but it feels somewhat better than XP, morally speaking, like freeing yourself from the chains or something.

I agree-- and although I criticize people for blindly obeying the "warm fuzzies" of Linux, I've felt them myself. Which is perhaps why I know beyond reasonable doubt that it's one of the most powerful reasons for switching. But my logical side, like yours I suspect, prevents me from using it in a music machine or for any field in which industry standards are required. Sure, you can do a lot with the GIMP, but if you have a client that wants perfect PSD files, you'd probably be best using PhotoShop. And for publishing... I'm still trying to figure out why FrameMaker is being required by the writing/editing jobs I've been applying to (it's an old kludge of a program), but there are no Linux alternatives. Point being, I understand that feeling of liberation and release (5 KvR points to whoever names the lyricist first. ) but it's not a compelling reason to switch yet, for me at least.

Greg