Greatest Sampling Idea ever , who's gonna spill the beans?

[cobalt1]

I cant believe you just clicked on that name, and Im sorry for its cheesy nature.

I sampled some audio recently from a few movies via DVD Audio ripping software and realized at once how many priceless sound's and effects can be gained by doing so. As a movie's audio track often merge's several sonic elements such as dialog, effects, music and ambiance; often a desired sound cannot be ripped because vocals/and or music has also been been impeded in the audio. This issue arises solely because the software's I have found export the wav sample in stereo or mono and do not separate the DVD info via 5.1 surround.

Seeing as audio on non-divx encoded dvd's is layered for surround sound purpose's, many individual sounds can potentially be isolated and sampled individually. I hope you see now what I am thinking. Think every movie on DVD since the advent of surround offering such a canvas of sonic possibilities, and musical landscapes...every effect mastered by the greatest of experts and payed for by the largest studio's. Im sure this software exists!!! anyone wanna spill the beans?

[metamorphosis]

Hooray, piracy... with incredibly poor understanding of 5.1.
Here's an idea - make your own sounds. That might just give you that original idea you've been secretly hoping for-
don't take offense, I just don't see the originality or focus in what you're asking for...
m@

[Hewitt Huntwork]

What you are talking about is illegal. If, in your work, you use part of a work that is owned by someone else (like all the sounds in any commercially produced DVD) you need their permission and they'll probably want to get paid. There are people whose whole careers are based on obtaining written agreements for things like you are describing.

The good news is, if you create something original yourself, anyone who wants to use it in what they do has to get your permission and pay you.

[Distorted_Mastermind]

Somehow I bet the movie industry has even more money than the music industry to track people down for copyright infringement.
I'm pretty liberal when it comes to sampling, but sound effects from movies should be fairly easy to recognize and track straight to the person who made it.

Sound design is fairly distinctive and styles vary from one person to another. There's a good chance you give me 5 source samples and another guy the same samples and tell us both to design 100 sounds and have them ready within 24 hours...they will likely be 200 samples that sound nothing like the original, but 100 will probably be in a somewhat distinct style and the other 100 in a somewhat distinct style as well.

Also the channels on surround sound bleed just like on a regular stereo mix.

[DWb]

Mmmmm... dance producers have been using dialogue samples (not even sound effects) for years, and by and large not been bothered by it. So it's a question of proportion - if you want to stick an explosion from a Terminator film on your next chart topping pop hit, then you might be in schtum, but if you're planning to use a sword clink from an obscure 70's kung fu film as one of half a dozen layers in one of the seven hihat sounds in a drum and bass tune that's going to come out on a limited-edition-of-200 white label then you're probably alright.

Obviously this is stealing other peoples' ideas and thus massively uncreative and there's no way you can call the tune your original work if you do it - it'd be far more inventive if you just downloaded a copyright free sample pack and used the hihat sound that it provided as-is.

[Mr. Tunes]

well i think the copyright part is obvious, i believe what the original poster is getting at is how cool it is that these dvds are made with separated sounds. i'm sure he knows it's illegal to use verbatim in a track for commercial gain.

as for any software to do this, i think you have to do this the analog way where you take a 5.1 receiver and run a cable that would typically go to your center speaker and run that to the recording device... that is if you want to sample the isolated dialogue you would grab the center channel.

this is interesting what loopmasters did;
http://www.loopmasters.com/sampleshop/1 ... de=LM29_DL

[cobalt1]

jesus, metamorphosis...you sound more like a Paramount shareholder than an artist or musician...of course "no offense" as you mentioned. Being helpful sometimes involves criticism but its best to correct people, so fill me in on 5.1 and spare me the royalties owed in praise. When My kid is in his teens, and is first drawn to music and sound, ill be sure to mention all the copyright laws to him so he can truly be an intelligent lister, like you

Piracy is an issue I take seriously; but my definition of piracy is a detailed one; detail is also something you lack on what it is I'm speaking of.

Sampling is a process, my own application is taking sounds for their color and texture and manipulating them to suit my needs, people sample loops from popular music and present it as their own; they are the thieves, and there are plenty of them out there (*see Amen Break). There are countless threads on taking a kick drum or a high hat and modifying the sound to "replicate" the sound of some famous band or group/artist. And if you think all the samples in your archive are copyright free and have been either sold/or given to you by legal means you know little of the industry. Up until the last decade "illegal" sampling and the sale of "illegal" samples by "legally" registered companies was common practice; and a couple of searches on google will aid you in arriving at the same conclusion.

So you fine individuals, believe there is something morally/ethically/legally incorrect with sampling a single sound, from a single moment, on a single layer of audio and modifying its pitch/duration/formant/amplitude etc etc adding all sorts of filters and effects... to create a new sound, ah wait it isnt new, it will still be copyrighted, and no movie score developer or sound engineer thus far has ever done what it is Im speaking of. If you havent caught on, Im being sarcastic.

Of course, you feel that years of experience with 100,000 vst instruments and all that vested capital warrant's your reaction to my post; you may feel that your ability to engineer sounds from scratch gives you some authority; It is your final product, distinct, aesthetically pleasing or serving some function or your sencere ability to assist others in learning and further developing the artistic medium....that gains you authority, respect or admiration.

Every electronic, made-in-china bullshit you own is in violation, every catch phrase you use, and water was once privatized by a foreign firm in puru...Copyrite law should be the subject of another thread; one you should continually read and educate yourselves on.

[safeaim]

http://www.videohelp.com/tools/BeSweet

That one might do the trick. Or this one: http://www.digital-digest.com/dvd/downl ... id_87.html

I'm not sure what to do with these two, but I remember reading about these to programs on a similar topic. And use dvd decrypter to be able to get the dvd-tracks over on your harddrive. Good luck!

[Gregjazz]

The sounds in movies are created or recorded somehow. Analyse them and try to recreate them yourself. Use public domain or royaltee free sound effects resources if you don't have that ability yourself, and use various synthesis techniques to create the sounds you're after. (for example, gunshot sounds in movies are rarely only an actual gunshot recording)

Or get a Zoom H4/H2 as a mobile recording unit and go start a library of your own sound effects and ambient sounds.

[Hewitt Huntwork]

What you described is a crime whether you think it is or not. It is not open to your interpretation. You say "my definition of piracy is a detailed one" but one that has no bearing on the law.

You can argue that what you are doing probably hurts no one, and from a sampling standpoint you may be right. But coming here to KVR and advocating illegal practices makes this a worse community. My original response assumed that you may not know you were describing a crime, so I thought pointing it out might be helpful.

I'm sure you're a good guy, and I understand your frustration. I hope what I wrote helps you to understand the frustration of others here on the forum.

[DWb]

What you described is a crime whether you think it is or not. It is not open to your interpretation. You say "my definition of piracy is a detailed one" but one that has no bearing on the law.

You can argue that what you are doing probably hurts no one, and from a sampling standpoint you may be right. But coming here to KVR and advocating illegal practices makes this a worse community. My original response assumed that you may not know you were describing a crime, so I thought pointing it out might be helpful.

So I shouldn't mention that I sometimes sing Happy Birthday to someone in a pub?

Bugger.

(Besides which, if he's not actually breaking copy protection, he could be wanting the sounds for a fair use purpose.)

[cobalt1]

The sounds in movies are created or recorded somehow. Analyse them and try to recreate them yourself. Use public domain or royaltee free sound effects resources if you don't have that ability yourself, and use various synthesis techniques to create the sounds you're after. (for example, gunshot sounds in movies are rarely only an actual gunshot recording)

Or get a Zoom H4/H2 as a mobile recording unit and go start a library of your own sound effects and ambient sounds.

(Hewitt, the law cannot enforce something that cant be proven; spend your time writing to monsanto or exxon and help prove their illigal ways...try not to pester guys in their basements trying to experiment with sound for no real commercial benefit)

...the original post was not meant to solicit advice for changing my methods, and if you give the possibility some thought, you would see the creative possibilities. This is the last time im explaining myself.

Im fairly disappointed in how rigid and non-experimental people are becoming, I know how to engineer the electronic sounds you are thinking of, and free soundbanks, even if they posses the exact same sound sequence; lack the direct semiotic experience involved in the audio/visual world of movies and are more difficult to place in context. Im not going to turn this post into a debate on musical meaning, or why its important to visualize sounds...but its something that can be valued at an empirical level.

Truelly organic sound or physically created 'machine' sounds are derived by means of micing and sampling...and i would pay metamorphosis 10$ anyday to go stand under the railing of a moving train with a mic anyday...or perhaps travel back in time to capture the sound of a south american assassination attempt, to turn the shots sound into a crash that I alone could know the origin and the meaning only I can recognize.


here are some things sampling from DVD's can be uselfull 4:

1. What if I wanted to sample a brief solo-musical sequence in a movie where there is other clutter, such as car noise or a crowed...and wanted to do this so I can load it up in melodyne, view its score, modify the score, export to midi, connect to one of my dozen or so legit vst instruments....and adjust accordingly?

2. I can take things like a womans breath from a porno with a funny copyrighted name like "deep space 69" and adjust it so its sounds like a percussion played in a large room...I turn a pigs squeal into a door creaking sound with just as much ease couldn't I ?


2.I can just as easily attempt to isolate a sound, simply to study it in more detail (waveform etc.), or see if perhaps the original "effect" I had heard was actually a mixture of several sounds?? you know sound is temporal...so maybe rewinding a 2 sec sequence on my system in 1x mode for 70 hours and pressing play real quick isn't the best way to go...but Iv thought up what 'metamorphosis' might say " connect the desired speaker audio channel to an input on a computer and load of a oscilloscope and program a separate firmware for the dvd player with circuit bent buttons to aid in cueing up the desired frame...." that way I could be more original like you bunch, or more industry friendly.


3. Lastly I can sample a new bollywood release for intense traffic congestion in Bombay and add distortion and turn in into solid ambient noise which is what all you conformists sound like


You shouldn't have to defend yourself for asking questions.

[Hewitt Huntwork]

So I shouldn't mention that I sometimes sing Happy Birthday to someone in a pub?

Bugger.

(Besides which, if he's not actually breaking copy protection, he could be wanting the sounds for a fair use purpose.)

I don't know where you guys are from, but here in the states a lot of chain restaurants have some crazy happy birthday song they sing instead of Happy Birthday and the reason is because if they do they have to pay royalties. For me, it seems ridiculous. But, my opinion of the situation means squat.

Yes, yes. Read his posts and you'll see that the Public Good is his prime motivator.

EDIT - Ok, I take back the eye rolling. I don't want to belittle anyone. I've made my points about legality and the effect of this conversation on the forum itself. I concede the points about creativity and alternative methods.

[blatanville]

"Good artists copy; Great artists steal" - Picasso.

"Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law" - Alistair Crowley, after ancient Sufi wisdom.

When you submit uncritically to the laws placed upon you, then you are a slave.

M@ & Hewitt Huntwork:
The belief that every sound used in even the largest, best-funded Hollywood movie has either a) been created entirely from scratch or b) been properly licensed and paid-for is charmingly naive.

I worked in the industry for 8 months under two award-winning sound editors, and we "stole" sounds all the time, from other editors (well, the culture IS one of sharing, actually), and from commercial fx libraries we didn't have a license for. It happens ALL THE TIME.

(Note: I'm not seeking to convince you that what sound editors/designers "in the industry" do is "right." Just disabusing you of the idea that everyone plays by the rules in "the industry")

[DanielKonopka]

Exactly, listen to Jean-Michel Jarre track "Hey, Gagarin" on Metamorphoses album. At the very beginning of this track, you can hear very, very identical sound to that of Terminator 2 movie final scene with molten steel, when T101, laying on a chain gear, fires a grenade to rip T1000 apart and make it fall into the vat. Does it sound familiar? I think so. Just listen closely.