3am - Salt19 (atmospheric instrumental finished)

[Jazzyspoon]

I really like what you've done with the place.

This is probably the biggest artistic statement you have made with harmonics and non-rhythmic elements yet. (I know they are there, but they are so subtle) Your tracks are never short of style, too.
You should be proud of this, bro.
As I sit listening to this with my morning coffee (really having a Zen moment), I can't help but think you may have stumbled on some great new element in your workflow. I hope to hear more of this technique from you in the future.


Nice.

[vieris]

I'm gonna bump this 'cause I've remixed and rearranged it to be a much more cohesive track.

Here are the new versions...

MP3: http://www.3amnoise.net/salt19.mp3
WAV: http://www.3amnoise.net/salt19.wav

Thanks everybody for your input!

This is quite nice. puts me in a similar mindset as the classic AE Amber Album (thats a good thing).
I'm not saying it sounds like its from that album just has the same feel to me. I like, i like.

[jancivil]

I actually like the first version considerably more than the revision. sonically, the revision is bigger, richer, but it seems, I don't know, blocky, and less flowy.

they have a different quality; I can see how some might like the latter one best. sounds seem to jump out of the mix more; and have a harder quality. I haven't fully A/B'd em though..

[justin3am]

puts me in a similar mindset as the classic AE Amber Album (thats a good thing).

One of my fvorites of all time! Though I understand what you mean, not a direct comparison but just being mentioned in the same thread as Autechre is a compliment above compliments.


@Jan: You are not the only one that feels that way. One of my coworkers said that he liked the flow and disonance of the original over the structure of the new version.

Thanks for the kind words guys.

[runagate]

I'm in the process of downloading and it sounds exciting.

The wav ones absolutely won't DL for me tonight, I've no idea why, so I'll check on em tomorrow.

I've got quite a backlog of songs that've been listened to but not commented upon so I imagine you'll be hearing from me.

[Voidoid Surrealist]

@Jan: You are not the only one that feels that way. One of my coworkers said that he liked the flow and disonance of the original over the structure of the new version.

Another vote for flow and dissonance here. I like the mix in the revision better, but I think the substance of the original is superior.


Anyway, great stuff.

[rosllow]

superb.

love the autechre style synth stuff in combination with the piano... at times it feels and sounds like a virtual orchestra warming up.

the skittish beats underpin the flow while never actually conforming to any sort of "traditional" time signature.

there are a few times when i wish there was less there, as the quiet moments work better for me, with the space in the track becomming almost another instrument.

Time slows down when listening to Justin's music

great statement, couldn't agree more on this track. seems to stretch, compress and bend time in a very pleasant way.

cheers, really enjoyed this a lot.

rosllow.

[runagate]

damn, that song is inspiring

being a jazzbo type I can't help but concur with rachmiel that this method really lets your musical mind shine through, in a way that's probably impossible with your composed pieces... that make sense? It's only the second song of yours that's made me think that

now, obviously, half the reason I am into PC music-making is so that I can compose unlike my previous live-music incarnation, but I'm pretty sure I recall you saying you never did the live-as-opposed-to-composed thing previously, which is pretty mystifying considering that you've got it nailed on this song at least, that thing we improv people gush about

[justin3am]

Thanks guys!

VS: My wife loves that picture! Avante cat looks a lot like our old cat Meko who died not long ago.

Thanks rosllow for taking the time to share your thoughts. I'm still trying to perfect this kind of thing but I agree that sometimes silence says more than the sounds that surround it.

Runny, you are right, this is new territory for me. The fact that the improvisation is still grounded in thoughtful programming makes it easier but one thing that I hear (especially in the first itteration of the track) is my own insecurity. I'm glad that you enjoyed it because I very much enjoy the feeling of being on unfamiliar ground.

[runagate]

one thing that I hear (especially in the first itteration of the track) is my own insecurity. I'm glad that you enjoyed it because I very much enjoy the feeling of being on unfamiliar ground.

I assure you that you wilol always be able to hear your own insecurity in an improv. The best thing I can tell you about that is don't worry about it and you'll get over it to a large degre. Even a dungivaphuk gangsta like me gets plenty of cringe factor out of listening to my improvs, because I know when I'm skating on thin ice. Then again, pulling off seat-of-your-pants amazing shit live is probably the greatest feeling you can ever get playing music. I can still remember a several dozen bar recorder improv solo I played that went so far off into syncopated polyrythms that when I brought it back into the underlying 4/4 of my other toy-instrument playing compadres by playing each of the preceding notes in double time, but each note played twice in a row... shit, that was unbelievable. And it landed on the one beat for the next person's solo. On a plastic recorder, and I remember it from 12 years ago and laugh while I type this. That enough encouragement?

[justin3am]

I think what I meant by insecurity was lost in translation a little... I am the kind of person that embraces insecurity. When I said that, it was meant as a less pretentious way of saying "honesty". I hope I never get over insecurity in that respect, it's really what keeps me creative.

I love your anecdotes, even text (plus smilies) is enough to feel the electricity you exude.

[jancivil]

I had a (religious) discussion recently where 'the other side' objected: "but that cuts out the very ground you stand on!" and I said that this is the only way to really begin, that it's essential.

if one never does this, one is in danger of only ever rehashing that ground. (of course there are many that would only ever want to do this, and remain secure in that comfort zone.)


this piece feels like it harbingers a shift of paradigm for you, Justin.

[justin3am]

This is a topic that is very interesting to me, Jan. The concept of knowledge is a very alien thing to me, for to have knowledge one must "know" something. I feel that we only really perceive because the only evidence we have of our surroundings is had though perception which is inherently biased towards the experience our faculties have had throughout our life. Coming from that perspective, security in ones point of view is a very dangerous thing because if the way that your body and brain receive information change based on it's environment but your mind and soul don't adapt because of preconceived notions of "knowledge", perception becomes a closed loop.

Keeping this in mind, changing ones perspective becomes the only way to achieve any level of objectivity. Even then, I have only seen with my eyes, I've only heard with my ears... I've only read with the understanding that I have developed from the education I received (thanks Long Beach Unified School District!) and those that hear me speak and only infer my meaning based on their understanding of my use of words. [sarcasm]Luckily for us we have created systems that help us develop our perception in a way that is conducive to communication.[/sarcasm] I saw a Robert Anton Wilson lecture where he talked about actively striking the word "is" from his vocabulary. Though I couldn't quite do it my self I understood the sentiment. Nothing truly "is", you perceive it and your perception has the potential for change.

This is where I come back to insecurity. I'm not sure and I'm very comfortable with that. The results of my day to day life are the result of an insurmountable number of variables that my mind has the amazing ability to parse without me being conscious of it. Why shouldn't that be true for my creative endeavors. I'm much more comfortable working without preconception, but with the fear (for lack of a better word) that the outcome might be shit, than I am working under the confines of conventional "knowledge". That being said, I have found it necessary to work within those confines to understand that possibilities that lie outside them.

For that reason, I will not carry on a conversation about religion. I'm not sure and I'm comfortable that way but I have a tremendous amount of respect for people that find comfort in feeling that they do know, as long as they use what they know to nobel ends. I myself tried to be religious but I found it very scary to have answers for all questions. I still participate in church events because the church my parents are a part of are very nobel in their endeavors (helping the unfortunate, building a sense of community togetherness) and they welcome me though they know that I don't share their beliefs.

Anyways, I'm suffering from diarrhea of the... typing fingers, or something.

[jancivil]

I think it's 'knowing' something versus having an educated guess.

In a really successful improvisation,, one can have one's whole universe of experiences as to how 'this' might work, or why these may be 'best' choices for inclusion (/exclusion), and experience is brought to bear on any of it; but to prejudge according TO these experiences brought to bear gets us in our own way, I think...

It's a peculiar balancing act, enough 'recall' (muscle memory, for one thing), but in a zone that serves only the object nature of how it sounds, how the listening *is* the playing - in my experience is a space where the subconscious guides the conscious, recalling organ...

the recalling has to be there, all one's best guesses brought to serve the object in time; but once you've decided you KNOW some choices ARE best choices, gets you in a space where you're playing your fave licks, and <deciding> where to stick them. I mean, nothing should be arbitrary.

[justin3am]

It's a peculiar balancing act, enough 'recall' (muscle memory, for one thing), but in a zone that serves only the object nature of how it sounds, how the listening *is* the playing - in my experience is a space where the subconscious guides the conscious, recalling organ...

the recalling has to be there, all one's best guesses brought to serve the object in time; but once you've decided you KNOW some choices ARE best choices, gets you in a space where you're playing your fave licks, and <deciding> where to stick them. I mean, nothing should be arbitrary.

Interesting, but this is where (in terms of music) I'm handicapped. I don't have a lot of experience. I've been a recording engineer for longer than I've been successfully making music. I can rely on "muscle memory" for compression and eq techniques but I still need to experiement to get where I am going with composition. I guess that is the reason I only understand simple tonal relationships, even when listening. I supplement experience with curiosity though... rather than saying "this doesn't work", I ask "how could this work?"