Alternatives for chords sequencing

[disturb]

Theory guys will probably cringe when reading this, but i'm trying to get deeper into the theory thing, and the more i try, the more i can't be arsed to learn all the fingerings for all types of chords, in all their inversions and keys etc.

It just doesn't seem logical to me, that in this day and age, you still have to go through a cumbersome piano roll, when we could have any system that makes much more sense in terms of layout and even theory.

I already know about the two versions of chordspace, and the plugin from the latest kvr DC, so don't bother just posting a link, eventhough i'm interested in how you use those if you do.
The concepts are great i think, but I'm more interested in a program that would let me sequence chords, and choose their inversions etc form one self contained interface.


I've started fiddling with keykit, it has a lot of possibilities, but no way (without coding your own module) to get chords relating to a scale.

So if you know about something interesting as a vst, max/reaktor or standalone midi app, please share.


cheers[/url]

[Toxikator]

you can't (as near as I can tell, anyway) sequence with Chordspace, but it is a great way to audition sounds which you can then translate to the PR...

Of course, that's in FL, where the MIDI routing is quite diff. from other hosts. If you could record its output (as I'm sure you can in some hosts) then it would be a mighty effective chord sequencer, at least so long as you were able to quantize or keep your mouse clicks in time.

I have no idea how Playa outputs MIDI (I still can't get that sucker to do anything ) but I imagine it could be a mighty chord sequencer as well; you play the notes, record the output, and bam! instant chords.

Of course (and Nuffink, please don't bite my throat open here) those plugins are going to deal primarily with tetrachordal jazz harmony (Playa does indeed offer up diatonic triads but only for the major/natural minor that I've been able to figure out). I've yet to see something which deals with voiceleading or primarily traidic harmony, but then again I've not been looking; again, Playa can do inversions, but because it's focused primarily on the planar voicings of jazz harmony it cannot (and has no reason to) do any sort of automatic voice leading.

Really dude, try chordspace, it can probably do a lot of what you're after, depending on the kind of sonorities/harmonies you're working on.

[disturb]

Well indeed i didn't mention that, but chordspace always sounded too jazzy to me, maybe i missed something.
I can get stuff i really like out of tonespace though, but the layout with the mousewheel is kinda weird.
If tonespace had a sequencer in which you could drag chords from the 'grid' and some additionnal sequencer lines for chord type and inversions, it would be a killer...

[nuffink]

Well indeed i didn't mention that, but chordspace always sounded too jazzy to me, maybe i missed something.

disturb, it's the most common complaint/request I have. There's a new version coming soon with a lot more triads and a lot more presets. Give it a go when it comes out, you might like it.

[Toxikator]

Well indeed i didn't mention that, but chordspace always sounded too jazzy to me, maybe i missed something.

disturb, it's the most common complaint/request I have. There's a new version coming soon with a lot more triads and a lot more presets. Give it a go when it comes out, you might like it.

Sweet!

May I feature request (if I'm not totally discounted at this point)?

(unimportant)
more support for extensions like with chordspace
support for alterations

(mad important)
EXPLANATORY PATHS, PLEASE!

If this is at all doable, I'd love to see it; as in, when you play I7, Playa indicates that it's a V7/IV, so you understand the motion. Especially important with things like the bIIIM7.

I get a headache just looking at Playa, going "what do I do with a i6? how do I get to bV?" etc.

[disturb]

Well indeed i didn't mention that, but chordspace always sounded too jazzy to me, maybe i missed something.

disturb, it's the most common complaint/request I have. There's a new version coming soon with a lot more triads and a lot more presets. Give it a go when it comes out, you might like it.

Cool.
Seriously you should consider making a version with a step sequencer that'd allow to choose the root note, chord type, inversion...
That's pretty basic stuff, but even a simple one with midi drag'n drop to the host would be a great feature for non keyboardist (eventhough it doesn't take tons of skills to play it in the first place).
The pbend method of playa 1 felt odd to me to play with, it seemed pretty hard to keep tracks of where you are wether you're hitting keys, or automating.

Anyway, i'll check it out, any eta yet ?

cheers

[nuffink]

Anyway, i'll check it out, any eta yet ?

cheers

I'm struggling with a, shall we say, feature. It's proving to be more intractable than I'd thought and I don't want to release a beta until I have some clue as to how I'll fix it.

[spitboxer]

disturb, it's the most common complaint/request I have. There's a new version coming soon with a lot more triads and a lot more presets. Give it a go when it comes out, you might like it.

oooooh .. WHEN???

[tapper mike]

If you want to taste the elusive fruit you need to go out on a limb to get it.

You have your entire life to learn extended chords. What you now know didn't come in a day. Practice adding a new chord or extension each day it will take less then 5 minutes. No Song is all b13 chords.

[spitboxer]

Well for me personally I am learning chords but the questions come up about progression, what chords to use in any given scale, and the rules with major, minor progressions

It is a bit overwhelming to start so something that aids me in staying in key for now is awesome.

[disturb]

in case anyone might be interested, Vince Manzo published a library of modal objects for max/msp, it's an awesome starting point for building harmony-based patches in max.
www.vincemanzo.com

[tapper mike]

Think global, play modal.

You can reduce extended chord structure to 1-3-5 or 1-3-7 so long as those elements are maintained you can get rather liberal with the extentions even if they don't fit precisely to the original key you started with.

It's not about cementing a song to a key structure. Dissonance is created not by flowing within a harmonic or key structure but creating a resistance force that needs to be reckoned.

Play a simple I-IV-V chord progression
Then play a simple I arppegio over all three chords.
I/I connosance = sounds the same
I/IV slight harmonic tension.
I/V greater harmonic tension.

Don't be afraid to paint outside the lines.

[aggronord]

i think you can do what you want with this small program. it was designed for buzz but you can save as midi files and import them in your sequencer.

http://www.buzzmachines.com/utils/cw07.zip

i used it alot for buzz tracker and a little bit when i converted to Live a couple of years ago. i know, making substantial chord progressions can be a real pain in the ass when you do not know how to play keyboard/piano. it just take some time, etc.. good luck

[disturb]

i think you can do what you want with this small program. it was designed for buzz but you can save as midi files and import them in your sequencer.

http://www.buzzmachines.com/utils/cw07.zip

i used it alot for buzz tracker and a little bit when i converted to Live a couple of years ago. i know, making substantial chord progressions can be a real pain in the ass when you do not know how to play keyboard/piano. it just take some time, etc.. good luck

oh shoot, i had totally forgotten about this one !
i remember using it for a while and it's great indeed, let's you build a progression by selecting chords, and you create patterns for the voices assignment.
You can midi yoke it back into your vst host too...

thanks aggronord

[aggronord]

hehe glad to help, i used it with midiyoke aswell (that is also a very useful tool if you want to have interaction between apps that normally dont talk so well together).