KVR Audio

mandt · Post by **mandt** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 7:45 pm

Robin! Thanks for this! I agree, you should take it further OR just simply release it as is. The subtle settings are really fantastic on whole mixes. VERY nice bit of work!

Why were you sitting on this? Is there something you felt you needed to finish on it?

Music Engineer · Post by **Music Engineer** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 8:24 pm

mandt wrote:VERY nice bit of work!

Why were you sitting on this? Is there something you felt you needed to finish on it?

hey thanks man. to you all. there was no specific reason for not releasing it - i probably just undervalued its usefulness. also, i shortly thereafter implemented (and released) my compressor which i happened to like better. i wouldn't have expected such a appreciative reaction....O.K....so, probably i should dig out the old project, brush it up and release it.

cymatics wrote:Holy crap Robin!!! You've been sitting on a real gem there.

That is one excellent dynamics processor. Seriously close to the sound of a good hardware device.

With apologies to Aleksey (I used a drum clip he posted in another thread) here is a quick demo of Leveller doing a fantastic job mimicking a Beatles-esque drum squash (think the end of 'Come Together'). The first half is the dry clip; the second half is processed with Leveller.

Leveller Test

boah, some heavy pumpin' going on there. a bit too heavy to my taste, but i guess you did that for demoing purposes.

cymatics · Post by **cymatics** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 9:01 pm

Robin from www.rs-met.com wrote:some heavy pumpin' going on there. a bit too heavy to my taste, but i guess you did that for demoing purposes.

Ha! Yeah, that's probably a bit extreme; but in a mix, that would be layered with the dry signal as well (NY Style Compression). I've been on a quest for the perfect pumping software compressor since I began working entirely in the digital domain four years ago. Most comps just cannot do this properly. The ones that can usually do so in a limited capacity, or only work in a few select settings. It took no effort to get Leveller to this trick beautifully and it was difficult to make it sound bad. Oh yeah... and it already has the wet-dry control built in!!!

Oh jeez... I said like a marketing shill, but I'm really excited about this plug!

Thanks again.

- jon

PS - I don't mean to 'look a gift horse in the mouth'... but is there any chance of a side chain? That would make Leveller an unstoppable beast!

Music Engineer · Post by **Music Engineer** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 9:12 pm

cymatics wrote: Ha! Yeah, that's probably a bit extreme; but in a mix, that would be layered with the dry signal as well (NY Style Compression).

ah, then watch out for comb filtering artifacts when using look ahead on a return bus in hosts without latency compensation.

... and it already has the wet-dry control built in!!!

oh, i didn't even remember that. in that case you just can use it as channels insert for NY compression and forget about potential comb-filtering problems.

I don't mean to 'look a gift horse in the mouth'... but is there any chance of a side chain? That would make Leveller an unstoppable beast!

a side chain...well, when i really dig it out to polish for release, i think, i could do that. but at the moment i'm missing to see the application for that. you want to use it as ducker or something?

zerocrossing · Post by **zerocrossing** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 9:14 pm

Oh come on. Sweetwater? I've never had a bad experience with them at all. I can't say for all of them, but the guy I deal with (David Klausner) is a very good and honest guy. Definitely not a "salesman." For one, he's an excellent musician (he and I used to play in a dual looping set up using JamMans (JamMen?) guitars, Chapman stick and a thing he made called the "dave-o-phone.") he owned an ran a very nice recording studio out side of Ithaca NY, and he's always been extremely honest and knowledgeable about music and gear. Try calling Zzounds or Musican's Friend and get someone like that. I dare you.

Sure, their catalog is full of marketing mush, but that's probably because the manufacturers are telling them they have to put that in. It comes down to a shouting match as they compete for the tiny musician's dollars, but that's not their fault. What are they going to say, "This compressor sounds weak and will make all your mixes sound dull and lifeless!"

Try and if you like, buy.

Mark

cymatics wrote:
mandt wrote:Sorry, no great gear test here, just an observational question . . .

Last night I looked through a Sweetwater catalog and concluded that the feverish volume of hyperbole regarding use of vintage-speak to sell products has reached its zenith. To wade through the BS to try and acquire actual solid information is quite daunting. No disrespect meant to Sweetwater but, come on, how can everything be 'analog' and 'tube' and have 'warmth' and be 'fat'?
By all means... disrespect Sweetwater. They are beyond shameless when it comes to misrepresenting products with marketing buzzwords, exaggerated claims, and outright lies.

mandt · Post by **mandt** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 4:05 am

cymatics wrote: PS - I don't mean to 'look a gift horse in the mouth'... but is there any chance of a side chain? That would make Leveller an unstoppable beast!

Yeah, well my vote would be keep it simple and don't change a thing but, meh . . Oh, and a big ol' steamin'

for the wet/dry knob!

Chrisma · Post by **Chrisma** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 5:19 am

Robin,

Both Leveller and Compressor are amazing!

Very Very powerful compressors. I gotta check out the rest of your stuff after I get to know these very well.

Good stuff so far.

cymatics · Post by **cymatics** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 1:04 pm

zerocrossing wrote:Sure, their catalog is full of marketing mush

You just confirmed what you are criticizing me for pointing out.

zerocrossing wrote:What are they going to say, "This compressor sounds weak and will make all your mixes sound dull and lifeless!"

Or do the honorable thing and don't try to sell a shit sandwich while telling the public it's prime rib.

Their catalog has more fluff than the Sta-Puft Marshmallow Man. No one with a brain or a decent set of ears would dispute that point. They misrepresent a huge portion of the products they sell. Any way you try to justify it, I still call bullshit on it.

cymatics · Post by **cymatics** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 1:09 pm

Robin from www.rs-met.com wrote:a side chain...well, when i really dig it out to polish for release, i think, i could do that. but at the moment i'm missing to see the application for that. you want to use it as ducker or something?

For frequency sensitive compression. For example, if there were a hi-pass on the side chain of Leveller in the clip I posted, then I could vary the amount of pumping caused by the kick drum.

If it's too much trouble or you don't think it's worthwhile, please don't mess with it. It's a great addition to my compression arsenal just as it is.

mandt · Post by **mandt** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 1:37 pm

cymatics wrote: Their catalog has more fluff than the Sta-Puft Marshmallow Man. No one with a brain or a decent set of ears would dispute that point. They misrepresent a huge portion of the products they sell. Any way you try to justify it, I still call bullshit on it.

+1

Funkybot's Evil Twin · Mon Mar 24, 2008 2:28 pm

Show me one catalog that doesn't. If they're the largest offenders of talking up bad gear in their printed catalog, then it's only because they have the largest printed catalog. It seems like most of the time they're just taking the manafacturer's copy and just rewording a few things, which is the same as every other retailer. When speaking to one of their reps, I've never gotten particularly bad advice or felt like someone was trying to pressure me into buying crap I didn't want. I can't say that for the other two giant music instruments/equipment retailers here in the states (Sam Ash, Guitar Center/Musiciansfriend).

Music Engineer · Post by **Music Engineer** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 3:56 pm

cymatics wrote:For frequency sensitive compression. For example, if there were a hi-pass on the side chain of Leveller in the clip I posted, then I could vary the amount of pumping caused by the kick drum.

If it's too much trouble or you don't think it's worthwhile, please don't mess with it. It's a great addition to my compression arsenal just as it is.

well, in that case, it would probably be better (easier) to incorparate an (optional and adjustable) filter into the analysis path of the plugin itself instead of providing an independent input to the user to let him wire up that stuff himself, no? however, here goes my plan: i'll do a dynamics processor for my rs-met product line which will include the algorithms of the Leveller and my Compressor. but the transfer curve of the compressor-algo will not be restricted to the standard threshold/ratio stuff, but will be freely adjustable by dragging around node points. and this dynamics plugin will provide both, a side chain input which can be used for the analysis instead of the standard input, and an optional filter in the analysis part. ...and M/S processing. ....and whatever else comes to my mind.

cymatics · Post by **cymatics** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 4:56 pm

Robin from www.rs-met.com wrote:well, in that case, it would probably be better (easier) to incorparate an (optional and adjustable) filter into the analysis path of the plugin itself instead of providing an independent input to the user to let him wire up that stuff himself, no?

Actually, that's exactly what I meant, but I wasn't clear in my terminology.

Robin from www.rs-met.com wrote:however, here goes my plan: i'll do a dynamics processor for my rs-met product line which will include the algorithms of the Leveller and my Compressor. but the transfer curve of the compressor-algo will not be restricted to the standard threshold/ratio stuff, but will be freely adjustable by dragging around node points. and this dynamics plugin will provide both, a side chain input which can be used for the analysis instead of the standard input, and an optional filter in the analysis part. ...and M/S processing. ....and whatever else comes to my mind.

HOLY SHIT!

That sounds amazing!

If you need anyone to beta test PLEASE send me a PM to let me know.

Music Engineer · Post by **Music Engineer** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 6:28 pm

cymatics wrote:If you need anyone to beta test PLEASE send me a PM to let me know.

i'll probably make some public beta and announce it here when it's about time.

Chrisma wrote:Robin,

Both Leveller and Compressor are amazing! Very Very powerful compressors. I gotta check out the rest of your stuff after I get to know these very well.

Good stuff so far.

have fun and make some nice tunes.

mauseoleum · Post by **mauseoleum** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 6:46 pm

Any chance you could "polish" or "verify" the Leveller beta you posted here and make a "safe" (release) version of the very same plugin? I think it "just works" as-is.

Leveling Amps; Fact or Fiction?