Does that thousand dollar laptop include soundcard and software ?jplanet wrote:Cost effectiveness, sampling capacity and expandability.
Compare a $3000 Motif or Triton with a $1000 laptop loaded up with Forte Ensemble. The workstations give you 128MB samples...with up to THREE whole velocity switches! With a laptop, you get Ivory with 7 velocity levels, and 4GB samples...
Try to install a B3 modeller on your Fantom...or even a decent virtual analog...it takes a $3500 Kurzweil before you even begin to see those features.
Where has software actually improved on hardware?
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- KVRAF
- 2070 posts since 5 Oct, 2005
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- KVRAF
- 5703 posts since 6 Dec, 2003 from Mission Control
Practically every way imaginable except for the actual sound of analog instruments and response of analog processing. DWb is correct that the biggest single advancement is zero or near zero R&D and manufacturing cost. Once you have paid for your tools you're done. Although you can produce high quality VSTs using completely free stuff.
Recently I build a Delta emulation basically just for one person and gave it away. I did it in a few hours, it cost me nothing but time and had fun doing it. I could have done it in hardware too but it would have cost me at least a $1000 and taken 6 to 9 months. It would not have been free. OTOH it would have sounded much better..
The next big thing is scale Vs. price. Up to a certain point commercial software costs too much for what it is. Past that point there is no practical way of making a lot of this stuff in hardware. It can be done but the cost is too high. You gotta consider freeware too. There is no hardware equivalent to free instruments and recording equipment.
Recently I build a Delta emulation basically just for one person and gave it away. I did it in a few hours, it cost me nothing but time and had fun doing it. I could have done it in hardware too but it would have cost me at least a $1000 and taken 6 to 9 months. It would not have been free. OTOH it would have sounded much better..
The next big thing is scale Vs. price. Up to a certain point commercial software costs too much for what it is. Past that point there is no practical way of making a lot of this stuff in hardware. It can be done but the cost is too high. You gotta consider freeware too. There is no hardware equivalent to free instruments and recording equipment.
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- KVRAF
- 2028 posts since 18 Mar, 2004 from New York, N.Y.
Sure, you could make it work. Even if you wanted to go factory new and have everything with the latest and greatest, I just priced a Lenovo Thinkpad with dedicated graphics and 7200RPM drive, Windows XP Pro, 2GB of RAM, 2.4gHZ Core 2 Duo for $930. Get a USB M-Audio think for less than $200, and assume that you have some VST/VSTi's you use already - you're still at less than half the cost of a new workstation, and the possibilities would eclipse anything available in dedicated hardware.Acid Mitch wrote:Does that thousand dollar laptop include soundcard and software ?jplanet wrote:Cost effectiveness, sampling capacity and expandability.
Compare a $3000 Motif or Triton with a $1000 laptop loaded up with Forte Ensemble. The workstations give you 128MB samples...with up to THREE whole velocity switches! With a laptop, you get Ivory with 7 velocity levels, and 4GB samples...
Try to install a B3 modeller on your Fantom...or even a decent virtual analog...it takes a $3500 Kurzweil before you even begin to see those features.
For argument's sake, if you were starting from scratch, you could spec a new laptop with 1GB of RAM, integrated graphics, 5400 RPM drive, and a lesser processor for under $600, or better specs in a refurbished laptop, and you would still squash the specs on any Fantom/Motif/Triton, with plenty of room left to spend on a few very high-quality instruments (not to mention what you can get in freeware).
This makes a lot of sense, especially considering that just about anyone on this forum already has a MIDI controller and some VST's to begin with. Also, this is assuming a laptop so that it would be even more portable than a workstation synth, but a small desktop is, of course, even cheaper...Those 88-key workstations aren't so portable when rehearsal is up a few flights of stairs...
- KVRian
- 955 posts since 18 Apr, 2006
I hope this isn't off topic, but where I love software (at least compared to lower end hardware) is the mixer. It remembers every setting and is so automatable. I remember writing down settings on a mixer and moving faders as recording to a master track. what a pain.
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- KVRian
- 1471 posts since 8 Jan, 2008
Well, a lot of hardware contains software. In addition, software pretty much requires hardware. In fact, there's a whole new wave of hardware aimed at the software arena. So, essentially, we're pointing at a hybrid solution. Perhaps, we can call this 'harsoware?'m-ac wrote:How long is it going to be before software 'beats' outboard completely? Surely its unavoidable?
Personally, I don't see any absolutes here. In addition, the real winners are the manufacturers and vendors who are more interested in the 'cha-ching' tones than the actual music.
I've got nothing to sell...am I on the right site?
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Mac of BIOnighT Mac of BIOnighT https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=70598
- KVRAF
- 2521 posts since 3 Jun, 2005 from Italy
OK, OK, I'll vacuum it tonight...kL wrote:What? You don't dust your software? No wonder it doesn't sparkle like analog.
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Mac of BIOnighT Mac of BIOnighT https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=70598
- KVRAF
- 2521 posts since 3 Jun, 2005 from Italy
Arseware?ughnonumus wrote: So, essentially, we're pointing at a hybrid solution. Perhaps, we can call this 'harsoware?'![]()
Although I will have to dust those....
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- KVRian
- 964 posts since 14 Jun, 2003 from USA
Bottomline, I think Software is the most convenient. It's fast to setup, simple to use and very flexible. You don't have to deal with wires and heavy pieces of equipment. Mobility is MUCH easier. Every piece of software integrates & communicates well with eachother as well.
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- KVRian
- 1414 posts since 24 Mar, 2007
software has allowed a much larger audience to make music (more accessible, cheap, etc). Whether or not having every shmo making music is a good thing, is another topic.
The more I use software the more i realise i need hardware, mostly the hands on control, not necessarily analog synths, etc, but the ability to manipulate with my hands, im sick of mouse clicking. As mentioned above, a combination of hard/software is my satisfying for me.
The more I use software the more i realise i need hardware, mostly the hands on control, not necessarily analog synths, etc, but the ability to manipulate with my hands, im sick of mouse clicking. As mentioned above, a combination of hard/software is my satisfying for me.
'The science of rich men does not elevate all mankind, but only themselves.'
sound cloud
sound cloud
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- KVRAF
- 6596 posts since 21 Jun, 2004 from Secret Underground Hideout
really, that's debatable? would you mind starting a thread inquiring about this? i can't imagine that getting the tools for expression into everyone's hands a bad thingdszep wrote:Whether or not having every shmo making music is a good thing, is another topic.
"Most people who experiment with drugs are not lying in the streets, suffocating on their own vomit. If you want to see some of that, go to the Pub on Saturday night at closing time." ozwest
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Muzik 4 Machines Muzik 4 Machines https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=9550
- KVRAF
- 7829 posts since 6 Oct, 2003 from Quebec
for me,
-number of instances(i don't have nor want to have a 36 compressor rack in my living room)
-ease of automation (not having to read thru midi tables to find the right nrpn/cc/sysex to control parameters)
-total recall (especially for sequencers, compared to a tape deck)
cost (see number of instances
)
-number of instances(i don't have nor want to have a 36 compressor rack in my living room)
-ease of automation (not having to read thru midi tables to find the right nrpn/cc/sysex to control parameters)
-total recall (especially for sequencers, compared to a tape deck)
cost (see number of instances
- Rad Grandad
- 38041 posts since 6 Sep, 2003 from Downeast Maine
the wife can't see more software 
The highest form of knowledge is empathy, for it requires us to suspend our egos and live in another's world. It requires profound, purpose‐larger‐than‐the‐self kind of understanding.

