KVR Audio

jackoo · Post by **jackoo** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 12:52 pm

I'm talking about the beautiful 'cello?!' sound in the song Procession [beginning of the track], from the album The City.

610KB Mp3 excerpt link:
http://www.mediafire.com/?c1rydxwc3tn

Is this sound 100% synthesis? Or is it sample based?

If it is synthesized, does anybody have any idea on the methods used to create it?

Any information about this sound will be useful for me.

Thanks to any of you who will answer.

colossus21 · Post by **colossus21** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 2:15 pm

hi!

I would say its a real cello. or very good sampled.

BertKoor · Post by **BertKoor** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 2:31 pm

Me thinks it's a sample

Listen how the formants move along up and down with the base tone...

Ubiety · Post by **Ubiety** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 2:33 pm

The City appears on the album Earth. This is all I could find. No mention of a cello.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth_(album)

ViktorW · Post by **ViktorW** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 2:44 pm

No, he means "The City" - the album, from 1990.
I'd also say this is a sampled cello, sounds so much like sample. Sampled instruments like that were getting so popular back then, I mean those who were trying to sound like the real thing. And I bet back then most would have said this was a live played cello.

Sequent · Post by **Sequent** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 2:44 pm

Ubiety, there is a more recent album called the City. I think the question is related to the more recent album.

My guess is that it's probably the Emulator or something similar. He DID have Carolyn Lavelle (who happens to be a cellist) on Voices which was roughly around the same time, wasn't it? And I'm not sure if she appears on The City (will have to check cd booklet later).

But I agree with Bert's formants observation.

Ubiety wrote:The City appears on the album Earth. This is all I could find. No mention of a cello.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth_(album)

BertKoor · Post by **BertKoor** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 3:00 pm

Ubiety, you've got the song "The City" (from the 1973 album Earth) mixed up with the 1990 album "The City". This thread is about it's last track "Procession".

WikiPedia wrote:Vangelis plays all instruments, exclusively synthesizers and drum machines. [...] Instrument patches are all synthesizer-based, but sound very convincing (trumpet on 1, guitar on 3, cello on 8 ).

Still no conclusive answer weather it's a synth patch based on samples or on more conventional forms of synthesis (FM or VCO/VCF/VCA)

Ubiety · Post by **Ubiety** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 3:57 pm

Hey, thanks everybody for telling I was on the wrong track!

BertKoor · Post by **BertKoor** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 4:04 pm

Ubiety wrote:Hey, thanks everybody for telling I was on the wrong track!

Pun intended, huh?

Ubiety · Post by **Ubiety** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 4:12 pm

BertKoor wrote:
Ubiety wrote:Hey, thanks everybody for telling I was on the wrong track!
Pun intended, huh?

jackoo · Post by **jackoo** » Tue Jul 01, 2008 7:04 am

yes, indeed, wikipedia says that unique sound is completely synthesized that's why I'm so interested to find out more about it (method of synthesis??), or whether that is true or not.

To me, a real cello does not even sound like that... it's more like a combination of cello, violin and.... maybe accordion. An accordion patch does replace the 'cello' a little bit later in the track.

Thank you all for your answers, so far.

Any more information about the history of this sound is appreciated.

XDVarenkor · Post by **XDVarenkor** » Tue Jul 01, 2008 7:37 am

Listening right now. It's a sampled cello. You can get a very similar sound with the CelloFan VSTi (sorry no link), but the vibrato is a bit over the top... I think EastWest had a free version of one of their sample instruments that had a very similar cello sound, might be worth hunting for. And yes, there is an accordion sound that joins in later - so maybe check out Peti as well.

(edit) Sorry just noticed you said it was synthesized. Very impressive if it is, but then it is Vangelis. Maybe a string synth like Stringz...

himalaya · Post by **himalaya** » Tue Jul 01, 2008 11:10 am

jackoo wrote:yes, indeed, wikipedia says that unique sound is completely synthesized ....

Not exactly. It says it is synthesiser based. Wikipedia seems not to differentiate between synthesisers and samplers, see the INSTRUMENTS entry, it says:

"Vangelis plays all instruments, exclusively synthesizers and drum machines"

But we know that he had used samplers on this and the 'Direct' albums.

So putting my dedective's hat on, I would say that:
1. the sound is not analog-based - you'd need some serious modular power to get such a good rendition of a cello using analog exlusively, and Vangelis didn't use a single modular synth on this album.

2. is it FM ? I doubt it. Again, I've never heard FM do such accurate cello. But who knows, he did have the DX1 at his disposal and perhaps it was a custom sound made by a very talented sound designer. I doubt it though.

3. Is it real ? The inner notes don't mention a cellist, only voices, footsteps ( curtesy of Polanksi)...

5. Now, the 'Direct' album had introduced sampling for Vangleis and The City album continued it. At this time he was using the Emulator so perhaps the cello came from this sampler ? Which was already mentioned by Sequent.
Also, Wavestation made its first appearance on The City album. It can be clearly heard on the same 'cello' track, "Procession".
Wavestation was released in 1990 so was The City. Korg M1 was also used.
Maybe someone who has one of these could have a look. Perhapas the cello came from one of these ?

Now, if the man himself had moved up a gear or two, perhaps we could ask him directly, but the website he has been designing for years, is still not ready.
http://www.vangelisworld.com

brok landers · Post by **brok landers** » Wed Jul 02, 2008 12:07 am

himalaya wrote:But we know that he had used samplers on this and the 'Direct' albums.

not only there ... he used the emulator for orchestral percussion a lot, i.e. on antarctica, the timpani and piati and such ...
and yes, the cello is from a stock sample library of emu for the emulator ...

and a personal note:
i'm probably the biggest fan of vangelis, but exept the first track of "the city" this album simply is a slap in the face ... i remember how exited i was once i heard a new a vangelis album was out, bought i the first day it was availlable. without even listening before ... what a shock when i was over the first track ... still recovering ...

then again, he already did it a few times ... but not with an whole album ...
well, sometimes his greatest gift (to not know conventions or limits) f**ks him ...

or how would you describe the bonus track on "alexander"?

however, back to topic ...

edit: eh??? someone noticed that, if you type f u c k, kvr itself replaces the u and the c with stars? well, just put spaces between the letters ...

now really back to the topic, sorry for the hijack ...

droopy6 · Post by **droopy6** » Sun Feb 27, 2022 1:25 pm

I found this cello in a Korg Triton: INT-C 035 "Viola Solo".
have fun.

How did Vangelis create this sound?