Need some help here.
I recorded this last night and I think I'm having some problems with 2 progressions clashing against one another. I've tried different chords but it keeps coming out the same.
Please note this is just a test render showing the transition between the main song and a bridge. There are no effects, compression, automation or modulation on anything. Everything is pretty static. Just rendered this section to show the chord issue.
*Yoink
Here are the 2 chord progressions that come at the acoustic
guitar bridge @ B 2:3 - 3:0 (I manually drop out the drums)
Prog 1:
D7th sus 4th
GbM
DM7 add9
GM
C5
D6 sus4 or Gadd9
CM7
Prog 2:
D7sus11
GbM
GM7sus4
Csus2 or Gsus4
C5
Do they clash?
Should I just fix this in the mix instead?
I think my ears are overloaded and a bit tone deaf right now.
Please let me know ASAP as the vocalist is coming in tonight and I have to have everything working before then.
Thanks for any help
Clashy Chord proggies or just fix in the mix? SOLVED :D
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- KVRAF
- 2356 posts since 30 Sep, 2003 from Sunny Staffordshire
I'm not sure how to answer this one to be honest. The chords used follow highly chromatic progressions... they seem almost intended to clash. That seems to be a feature of this type of harmony. So I'm not sure how best to advise regarding the progression itself.
What I will say is that it might pay you to consider the voiceleading a little more. Highly chromatic progressions usually stem from voice leading procedures - one or more melodic voices moving chromatically to shift the harmony through chromatic alterations. My advice would be an attempt to give the harmonic progression a slightly more 'goal oriented' feel through voiceleading. Looking for common notes between neighbouring chords is usually a good start.
I'll grab my guitar / keyboard and see if I can come up with an example for you.
TB
What I will say is that it might pay you to consider the voiceleading a little more. Highly chromatic progressions usually stem from voice leading procedures - one or more melodic voices moving chromatically to shift the harmony through chromatic alterations. My advice would be an attempt to give the harmonic progression a slightly more 'goal oriented' feel through voiceleading. Looking for common notes between neighbouring chords is usually a good start.
I'll grab my guitar / keyboard and see if I can come up with an example for you.
TB
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- KVRAF
- 2356 posts since 30 Sep, 2003 from Sunny Staffordshire
Prog 1:
You could try going from Dm9 to G13 (with the E being the common note). This would give you a nicer resolution to the C. Try going Dm9, G13, CMaj7. You would even flatten the 7th initially and make it an apoggiatura, resolving to the diatonic 7th (again, E being the common note), or down to D (the 9th).
I also think it might be nice to use Ab rather than Gb in the second chord. You could make a nice chromatic descent that way with the tritone root movement.
Let me sequence a quick example.
TB
You could try going from Dm9 to G13 (with the E being the common note). This would give you a nicer resolution to the C. Try going Dm9, G13, CMaj7. You would even flatten the 7th initially and make it an apoggiatura, resolving to the diatonic 7th (again, E being the common note), or down to D (the 9th).
I also think it might be nice to use Ab rather than Gb in the second chord. You could make a nice chromatic descent that way with the tritone root movement.
Let me sequence a quick example.
TB
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- KVRAF
- 2356 posts since 30 Sep, 2003 from Sunny Staffordshire
Ok, I appreciate that you may not like the V-I cadence in this progression, but it fits the chord scheme of your first progression and demonstrates how a chromatic melodic voice can add some chromatic flavor to your music while retaining a goal orientation. If you mess around with this kind of thing, fitting it into your own style and harmonic tastes then you should be able to give highly chromatic progressions a far greater sense of unity.
http://www.mediafire.com/?xq9nnvdb12t
TB
http://www.mediafire.com/?xq9nnvdb12t
TB
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- KVRAF
- 2545 posts since 22 Jun, 2004 from Paris. Well, not far.
I am no very well versed in theory but what I can say is that, being a lover of Stevie Wonder and his 1970s chord progressions, this sounds very fine to my ears.
No problems from where I stand.
Sorry if this not helping.
d
No problems from where I stand.
Sorry if this not helping.
d
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 6111 posts since 18 Oct, 2007
To decend this way is a really good idea. Gone to try it BRB.tee boy wrote:Prog 1:
You could try going from Dm9 to G13 (with the E being the common note). This would give you a nicer resolution to the C. Try going Dm9, G13, CMaj7. You would even flatten the 7th initially and make it an apoggiatura, resolving to the diatonic 7th (again, E being the common note), or down to D (the 9th).
I also think it might be nice to use Ab rather than Gb in the second chord. You could make a nice chromatic descent that way with the tritone root movement.
TB
stay juicy!
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- KVRAF
- 10286 posts since 17 Sep, 2004 from Austin, TX
Um, I can't imagine why you'd ask me as I completely ignore western theory most of the time but I've got to agree with the "love Stevie Wonder" assessment. This sounds great, my only problem is that I didn't write it.
The mix, however, really sounds like a GM soundset. Which is terrible.
And that bass's AM is bad, too.
Great work, I hope you don't wreck it by changing it too much.
The mix, however, really sounds like a GM soundset. Which is terrible.
And that bass's AM is bad, too.
Great work, I hope you don't wreck it by changing it too much.
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 6111 posts since 18 Oct, 2007
No GM used! I play everything live. I still have to change up a lot but its coming along. As I said its in a very very basic form. Just trying to get all the progressions to work together so they actually create a certain feel that subtly breaks away from the main verse section.
TB I like the form of your chromatic decent. It's a great reference so far. Just have to transcribe everything over to guitar now. I will let you know how it works out
Thanks again.
TB I like the form of your chromatic decent. It's a great reference so far. Just have to transcribe everything over to guitar now. I will let you know how it works out
Thanks again.
stay juicy!
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 6111 posts since 18 Oct, 2007
runagate wrote:Great work, I hope you don't wreck it by changing it too much.
Looks like I'll need only minor changes to a few notes to make it sound the way I want..stay juicy!
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- KVRAF
- 2356 posts since 30 Sep, 2003 from Sunny Staffordshire
Actually, the little progression was done on guitar (then programmed for the synth).Optomadic wrote:No GM used! I play everything live. I still have to change up a lot but its coming along. As I said its in a very very basic form. Just trying to get all the progressions to work together so they actually create a certain feel that subtly breaks away from the main verse section.
TB I like the form of your chromatic decent. It's a great reference so far. Just have to transcribe everything over to guitar now. I will let you know how it works out
Thanks again.
If you start with the A shape D7sus4 (at the 5th position), with the chromatic line descending on the B string, you should be able to get it pretty easily.
TB
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- KVRian
- 943 posts since 15 Mar, 2005
hi optomadic,
for me the chord prog that comes in with the acoustic guitar @ 0:29 sounds slightly 'weak' now and again, but no biggie. to me it feels like you would only have to adjust a couple of notes here and there.
and for me the main thing that clashes is the voice leading note that plays just after the 2nd rhodes chord @ 0:32.
like the song, nice. i like TB's progression too.
for me the chord prog that comes in with the acoustic guitar @ 0:29 sounds slightly 'weak' now and again, but no biggie. to me it feels like you would only have to adjust a couple of notes here and there.
and for me the main thing that clashes is the voice leading note that plays just after the 2nd rhodes chord @ 0:32.
like the song, nice. i like TB's progression too.