Recommend me books on Chord progressions

[egbert]

arrhhh ok i see what your saying,

so the roman numerals are just for the different chords,ok think ive got this,
and the pattern your telling me about is a common progression that works well ?

ii V I is something you have heard a million times but didn't know what it was called. It is a cadence just like V I is . The "A - men" cadence at the end of every hymn is harmonised with a V I progression and most symphonies end with some seesawing back and forth between the V and I and finish on the I.

The point of using the roman numerals is that it gives the general case which can be applied to all 12 keys. The numerals are just labels for the degrees of the scale. In C major the Ist to 7th degrees of the scale are the 7 white notes on the piano keyboard from C up to B.

It can be worth sitting down with a particular scale and working out all the chords you can build exclusively out of scale tones. Do this for each degree of the scale and you have a table with all the available chords you can use in a progression without leaving the key.

im just going to concentrate on learning maj scales as i can build chords from this and understand how they are contructed, doesnt the circle of 5ths give you a good guide as to what chords work best with one another ?

Circle of 5ths takes you around all 12 tones so obviously it modulates out of the starting key. In bebop or jazz showtunes which are often quite chromatic, lots of keys is no problem. In pop music there is more often a tendency to stay close to the key centre so finding chords within the scale tones of the main key is useful.

If your tune is in A minor you have all the chords that use the white notes to play around with without leaving the key:

These are the 7th chords:

Cma7, Dmi7, Emi7, Fma7, G7, Ami7, Bmi7b5

There are plenty of extensions and variations on those too.

[leighbeynon]

right im with you, so circle of 5ths is slightly different then, but very handy to modulate from one key to another, as the neo soul stuff i like i could be in one key for verse then using the circle of 5ths i can modulate to a new key to lift the chorus and create some tension,

i always get a little confused with what key your in,
from my understanding, normally the chord you start and end with,
or the key that the song seems to cycle around,

but if im in C what chords are availble to me ? as my piano teacher tells me it doenst matter what chord you play in your music,

i want to understand how i stay in 1 key and use differnet chords,
surely its not just cmaj 7th cmag 9ths as these are just stacked chords??

or maybe this was just explained and it went over my head??

[BertKoor]

Reading books is good, but using it in practice is a whole other thing.

I'd suggest to take some Stevie Wonder or Jamiroquai songs, and analyse their chord structures. Don't cheat but start from scratch and do it all by yourself. Start with a simple one (e.g. "Isn't she lovely") so you don't get too frustrated.

If you've done this a lot, then you're getting some experience of the "grammar" used in this style. Common chords & patterns will surface.

[t00nz]

right im with you, so circle of 5ths is slightly different then, but very handy to modulate from one key to another, as the neo soul stuff i like i could be in one key for verse then using the circle of 5ths i can modulate to a new key to lift the chorus and create some tension,
??

I wouldn't worry too much.. about modulating keys at this stage. Once you get non modulated stuff, it'll just 'click' when modulation has occured.. as you'll spot a pattern you know in another scale.

i always get a little confused with what key your in,
from my understanding, normally the chord you start and end with,
or the key that the song seems to cycle around,

Use your ear for this.. the key you're in is the 'home' note in the music.. most obvious in a melody. From that you have a scale, from the scale you have some chords.

With very little practice you should be able to hear the root of a scale.. and then , if the the key changes in a piece, you should catch that too.. a new temporary home note.


101:

For a given scale, you can build a chord on each note of the scale (using other notes in the scale).

All these chords are said to be 'in the key' of the root of the scale.

When song writing, with a melody in a particular key/scale, you can use (at least) any of the chords in the key to harmonise the melody. (And using any of these, will of course mean that all the notes in the harmony are in the same scale as the melody.)

Sometimes the melody will change key. In this case you can use the set of chords based on the new scale.

Often it will return to the original key. So then, your harmony chords will also return to this key.



But remember that chord theory is just a way of describing and discussing what is going on.. Yes there are common patterns, and things that have been discovered to sound nice and you can re-use all this.. but they are not 'you must do this' rules..

Also useful to see that many particular scale chords have a job.. or direction.. this one tends to suggest this one, suggesting this one.. etc.. Get them flowing and sounding nice and supporting a melody and you're pretty much home... time to worry about voicings

[egbert]

but if im in C what chords are availble to me ? as my piano teacher tells me it doenst matter what chord you play in your music,

i want to understand how i stay in 1 key and use differnet chords,
surely its not just cmaj 7th cmag 9ths as these are just stacked chords??

or maybe this was just explained and it went over my head??

A minor and C major are the same notes just starting in a different place = A minor is a mode of C major (aeolian). All those chords I listed for A minor are also the scale tone sevenths for C major.

Here are some common C major progressions that stay in the key.

||: Cma7| Fma7:||
(think Carlos Santana eg Song of the Wind on caravanserai)

(NB- When the chord moves to Fma7, the key hasn't changed - if it were F#ma7 that would be a key change)

|Cma Ami7 | Dmi7 G7| this is a "I VI ii V" progression.

Rhythm Changes (from the tune I've got Rhythm)

Cma Fma Cma Cma Fma Fma Cma Cma G7 F7 |Cma Ami7| Dmi7 G7|
Pretty basic blues or rock 12 bar. It only has I IV V in the main progression (plus a little turnaround at the end . Three chords - all you need to add is the truth

[leighbeynon]

i was also just recommend this guy >>>

http://www.jazzkeyboardlessons.com/#study

[BertKoor]

Didn't you already have a piano teacher? Maybe you just wanna move too fast...

NB: have you tried analysing some existing songs yet, like I suggested yesterday?

[leighbeynon]

maybe i am trying to run before i can walk, only been having lessons for 1 year, and i have improved but i seem slow to read the music then realise the notes and play them,

does this speed up over time ? i know in some of the songs im asked to practise there are chords made up in both left and right hands but as yet im not seeing them so obviously as a player of 7 years experience,

i think i will get where i want to be but it will take another 4-5 years of lessons maybe longer,

i do have books showing you how to memorise all maj chords, then min, and extensions showing you how to count up from the last note in the basic triad,

but maybe this wont be as useful as i wont know the scales and understand the chords so much ??

[TGV]

yo,


you might want to check out those two books:


http://www.berkleemusic.com/school/cour ... 7&program=

[egbert]

There is definitely going to be a lot of stuff you need to memorise and practice till it becomes second nature. Reading piano chords in music notation form takes time. Many people find it easier to read charts where the chords are just named and the pianist supplies his own voicings. It is a big help if you have learned the 5 basic chords in 12 keys first in their root positions and then learn useful voicings for them - in one hand and two hands. If you already know these essential building blocks then adding extensions and alterations is no biggie.
One way to make this less intimidating is to learn all of this in one or a couple of keys (eg C if they play keyboards) and gradually generalise what you know to the 12 keys. Being able to play a smooth progression around the blues or whatever you fancy in at least one key gets you hearing the chordal colours and you will feel like you are playing something resembling music.

I learnt classical piano as a child but I really learned most of the theory and chord voicings I use without using music notation so much. I wrote out voicings in a notebook - for example:

C dominant 7th:
(C) Bb D E A and
(C) E A Bb D -
these are two useful C7 voicings with the 9th and 13th extensions and no 5th and you typically play the rootless (ie leave out the C) voicing in one hand and either the bass player plays the root or you do it with your left hand and play the voicing with the right. I found some of these sorts of things in Jazz theory books but I was already used to finding my own voicings for these sorts of chords on guitar so it was pretty easy to find alternatives which would work in a progression.

[calex]

tag

[stimresp]

http://home.austin.rr.com/jmjensen/CircleOf5thsFun.html

Symmetry in the circle of fifths

[leighbeynon]

thanks egbert,

yeah someone else told me to play just the basic triads through the c scale
so my fingers get used to the placement,
then do the same thought D etc etc

sounds like pretty good advice, i might give this a go,

as i say i do have a book that tells you all maj triads, and tells you to play them in the order of circle of 5ths, then onto min, etc etc

so maybe it wouldnt hurt to try and remember as much as i can, thing is remembering what chord im playing (the name) as well as what it looks like

lots and lots to learn !!

[leighbeynon]

this is the book i have

http://readingroompublishing.com/index. ... 48a8a89a53


leigh

[reddvinylene]

I wanna be able to do this: