Overloud TH1 Guitar System released!

[hibidy]

This is going to be like all that retarded omnisphere crap.........

Overloud has the right to charge whatever they want, and the winning and moaning over the price is RIDICULOUS!

[Simone Coen]

I respect everyone's opinion over here of course.

Still, your points (which I agreed could be right in the end) don't make me change my mind.

[zvenx]

Personally I can't wait to try the download.
I own Line Six Pod Farm platinum, Guitar Rig 3, Amplitube2
I have tried to like the line six in its various software incarnations for the past two or so years, I regretfully have to surmise it really isn't my cup of tea and have never ever used any in any of my productions....
I have a love hate with the amplitube and until xgear had major gripes with its design....but it is ok... guitar rig I love for weird sounds.... but based on the demos this is the most realisitic sounding amp simulator that I have heard so far, can't wait to try it in my own productions....

Simone any idea when these will be at stores in the US?
thanks
rsp

[koolkeys]

simone,

Instead of taking an emotional stand, you should learn as a marketing guy, that customers and prospective customers who are sharing their views about your product are immensly valuable...

also some of your arguments are really lame...if your product is as good as you claim...do you seriously think that even if line6 amp farm does a translation from dsp to intel people will give a damn ?
they want a great sounding product, that's all.

my personal view is that th1 will probably be great, but too pricey for most,
as someone said there are too many hardware + software alternatives already.

i sincerely hope you will prove me wrong.

thomas

I don't recall ever seeing any rules that say a developer or marketing rep can't get emotional about their product, especially when it's taken YEARS to complete and people still think they know how good it is without ever even touching the thing. That's insulting. It's like putting two years into a new CD release and when you announce it people say it sucks before even hearing it. That's unfair and uncalled for.

Add to that the fact that so many people SWEAR by the previous products made by this developer, and people have even less reason to gripe, IMO.

About the Amp Farm thing, look at what he was replying to. They are not a fair comparison, and to be honest, have they even updated their technology even once in the time that was likely spent on TH-1? I don't think they have. I may be wrong on that one though. I do know that they are decent products. I even own one of them.

I also find it strange that people say there are too many alternatives already. Then why are you keeping interest? If you are not interested, then why does it matter? And if you ARE interested, then obviously there are not enough alternatives out there to make you happy and completely satisfied.

TH-1 is priced pretty much on cue with the competition. The argument that it's too pricey is silly if you're comparing it to the competition. As Simone said, that doesn't even mean you will pay that price. Aren't people around here smart enough to know that suggested retail price means nothing?

I just think people are being a bit unfair. At LEAST wait until you test the thing. If, after that, you still don't like it, say you don't like it. If you are just going to go into the demo convinced that you won't like it, you're probably wasting your time.

My opinions.

Brent

[Compyfox]

No need to feed the trolls, let's respond to the devs directly.

1) IK doesn't sell online with VAT: in fact, if you go there and fill the basket with any product, it will tell you it's VAT excluded. VAT is added on checkout and depending on the country you live in and whether you buy boxed or download products

Great, so IKM's AT2Metal is as expensive as TH-1, with way less features bundled. Add to that the fact that if you want more amps, you have to pay the same again (or a slightly lower "crossgrade price") and even more to get everything from what they offer.

2) reason we can't put VAT is because of the EU Law: for digital goods you can make pay your national VAT (in Italy, 20%), but for 'physical' goods you have to make pay the local VAT (Italy 20%, DE 19%...)

I blame the TAX offices for that. Still I don't see a reason why, if digitally sold, there can't be a price "including VAT"? Okay, if it's sold via ShareIt, I can still go the US funds route, still pay the VAT though but get off at least a nickel or two cheaper.

It's just a thing to understand - no need to go off on that.

4) how can you judge a product without ever trying it?

Judging from provided audio and video demos. Sorry, I wasn't on the Beta Tester team (who probably got their plugin at an unholy deal for sure) - wasn't considered either (speaking of which, I barely ever am - must be doing something wrong though).

A tight time limited demo (if it's only that limitation!) is a definite turnoff since I have other stuff to do than spending 14 days and nights in the studio to "really" grasp what's going on in there. Which is why I barely demo anything properly, if ever, since it's mostly not even possible. Not to mention find a suitable guitarrist, who can play more than 4 chords in infinite loop, that offers as much sparetime.

5) those prices are list prices: street prices will be lower in the shops and through distributors of course... we sell online at list price... this is not a problem for you, since you can demo TH1 for 14 days it means that if you like it you can order it locally and get it before the demo expires... [EDIT] for the lower price avaialble

The only shops who usually do that, are in the US and have prices beyond insanity, or are in the UK and charge too much for the exhange rate. If I let a pack ship over, I pay as much as getting it regulary over here in Germany. The only firm in Germany who'd host a boxed version, is Thomann.de - they don't have it listed (yet). And looking at our local shops: they usually jump over the shop counter and rape you, your family and your family's family right at this very moment, and in your afterlife if you even "consider" asking for a discount.

It's so easy to say, that you get it cheap "on the streets". And I really "like" it when people do that. Especially if they're living overseas.

6) comparing TH1 (or AT2 or GR3) with Line6 stuff is really like comparing apples and pasta IMHO. Line6 technology is DSP based and the computer rendition is just a translation of that DSP thing into 'Intel' CPU language. Overloud's (and for what I know, NI's, IK's...) technology is a totally different beast, in fact, it could never fit into the kind of DSPs Line6 uses

GearBox / POD Farm is not DSP based. Before the POD could use GearBox and the model packs, everything ran from the PC CPU only. They coded it in parallel. All UX, TonePort and GuitarPorts since day 1 don't have a DSP chip, only the POD2 and PODxt (who came out a year after the GuitarPort/GearBox) featured that. GearBox started as control device, tone generation and recording solution "for the PC" first - and ran strictly from the CPU while the GP/UX/TonePort/POD1 was (and still is) just a dongle. The ToneEditor for the POD came around the same time, which later adapted the technology of GearBox with a firmware update.

The Plugin however still runs from the CPU only, not from the hardware.

7) judging a plugin product by the number of amps and fx is just like judging:
- a car by the size of its wheels
- a real amp by the number of channels or the number of tubes
- a musician by how he can play fast
....

It's a comparision thing. I have to weigh what PC hardware I want to get, based upon numbers(!), before I get some new equipment. The same applies to software, especially if it's hardware bound, dongle ridden, or something that you can only test in like 3-4 places all over the world and you're stuck in the boondocks.

So what does Average Joe do? Yes, he takes what has the most bang for the buck. It's daily routine. And you can't really say that you only need like 5 amps for the rest of your life - depending on the job, or if we talk about sound layering, it can be way more. Especially from an engineers point of view. And we're not talking about the usual amp suspects here.

8 ) thanks for the one of you trying to teach us how to market our products... and it's funny... you might be right... but how do you know when you don't own and test the product? What do you know about our price policy with distrbutors?
Next time we'll make a poll here to ask what the right price for our products. Guess how much you'll value it in the poll?

Compared to what's already out there, I already stated my limit.

I'm not saying how to run your biz, hell no. And I'm definitely not disrespecing the work and efforts you put into this plugin. I just expected something... different. But it seems like the PT days have finally ported over to the VST realm. So my solution is to go for something that I can actually afford or stick to use what I have at my disposal.



I accept it to be the party-pooper once again. But I don't get like 3grand a month, like others probably do, to swallow such a purchase at ease without living on noodles for months. Maybe at a later state if there's a price drop, or a group buy/crossgrade deal, or if I can buy it used without the software becoming NFR and paying a fortune for account transfer. Or heck if I get more than just 500bucks a month for a living! Else it's highly unlikely in the near future.

Though I still do appreciate the SimulAnalog Suite, even if it's that outdated, buggy (the Soldano especially) and discontinued "as is". So... thanks for them.

About the Amp Farm thing, look at what he was replying to. They are not a fair comparison, and to be honest, have they even updated their technology even once in the time that was likely spent on TH-1? I don't think they have. I may be wrong on that one though. I do know that they are decent products. I even own one of them.

GearBox/AmpFarm/POD Farm... ah what the heck, whatever you want to call it... it got updated with model packs, the packs were finetuned, the software was finetuned, you recently got that... shiny... dualtone thingy dingy. So I wouldn't say that they're riding the dead pony.

I also find it strange that people say there are too many alternatives already. Then why are you keeping interest?

Personally:
a) the developers are the ones who made the SimulAnalog Guitar Suite
b) it featured a way more flexible routing concept than any other "all in one" solution (could have pulled that off with eXT though, if it wouldn't crash on me)
c) It was shiny and new... and the usual hype going on at the boards.
d) The price was a mystery and the devs were all like "fair priced" (which is a subjective thing, I have to admit that).



Just my 2c on this. Time to get off this part of the boards to let the thread cool down again. Futher complaints go via PM, please. The fire for flames were enough fueled alredy.

[koolkeys]

So I'm a troll? Or were you talking about somebody else?

Compyfox, I mean no disrespect when I say this. But I really don't see what in the world would actually satisfy you in this situation. CAN you be satisfied? I mean, if you find the plugin for a little less in a store? If it sounded as good as the competition or better? Judging an amp sim by an mp3 may not be the same as "feeling" the sim when you play. So I do still think it's a bit unfair to judge it prematurely.

I think your intentions are good here and you may even be frustrated because you DO want TH-1, but the combination of factors just isn't what you expected. I do hope you find whatever you need, but I just feel that the posts here(not just yours of course) were a bit unfair.

Also, adding new amps and putting a shiny interface on the Line6 stuff doesn't mean the actual engine has been updated or the quality changed in any way. And that's what I'm talking about when I say that I don't think it's been changed much.

I sincerely wish you the best in your search.

Brent

[Jazzguitar]

Judging from provided audio and video demos. Sorry, I wasn't on the Beta Tester team (who probably got their plugin at an unholy deal for sure) -

Please, what does "unholy deal for sure" to meaning ...?

You say: "Time to get off this part of the boards to let the thread cool down again." OK, start please by tell me WHAT and HOW do you know about of my Beta Tester deal as professional musician/producer with Overloud COMPANY? I'm really curious about.



-----------------------------------------------------
www.carlosarellano.com/music

[hibidy]

let's see, a very large group of people who are getting along and talking about an upcomming product, and two, maybe three who are trying to tell the company what to do and everyone else what to think.........hmmmmmmmmmmm. Now......what's this about trolls?

[buscemi]

First it was big bad IK, then Line6, probably some other devs I can't remember, now Overloud... and suddenly the devs that were evil before are used as examples against the newest target. They'll start smelling your shakedown a mile away pretty soon if not already.

[Dean Aka Nekro]

I only know half of the "codes" myself - C for condenser and D for dynamic is also understandable, but what is R?

Sorry i have not read the whole thread but i'd bet it means ribbon (IE: AEA, Royer, Sontronics, SE Electronics and heck i think even the lowly cheap (and mostly nasty) Samson have knocked out an active ribbon mic IIRC ) - the guy who has engineered and produced The Melvins, Kyuss, Clutch & QOTSA...etc is always smirking whilst giving it the old \m/ with a Royer R-122 in hand in TapeOp ad's oh and donning a crap pair of shades (Joe Baresi - does a great job mind and his work sounds great on records i have)

The Sontronics Sigma model is becoming a 'go to' on cabs for me and the price is very reasonable too. I always use a Senheisser MD421 (default for me). Since i had the Sigma and was loving it i put up the MD421 with it and have been really liking it alot (many times no EQ has been needed) and 9/10 times im recording high-gain 'mettle' amp head's nearly always a 1960A loaded with vintage 30's and/or sometimes 'the mongrel' (a small sized marshall 4x12 loaded with 4 different Celestion's).

I highly recommened you try one on a cab Compy if you can friend

The only amp sim(s) i use are ReValver MK II & BoogieX:

ReValver i use two modules only - the IR Cab/Mic module & VST host module
BoogieX - same thing minus the vst host module of course

I really am looking forward to trying this one out Simone, if the opportunity to use Cab/Mic IR's was to be/were implemented i think you would for sure be onto a winner and the ability to host 3rd party VST plug-ins would be the icing on the proverbial cake and make this one a no brainer for me personally but:

ReValver MK II wont wrap using FXpansion's VST To RTAS Adaptor so i can not use it within PT's (and i never heard of it being possible either) - I suspect it is down to the fact that ReValver MK II can Host VST plug-ins within its self as a VST plug-in (sorry if this sounds rambling folks its late...) though i am no expert by a long stretch on all on such technical stuff Plus bearing in mind that if that is the case then for it to run smoothly as a native RTAS plug-in it is just not feasible of course! because if the VST & AU version's had the feature then the RTAS only user's would no doubt spit out their dummy's and...you know what am saying (i could live with it mind )

Anyways enough babbling from this caveman, just really looking forward to TH1 demo with zero pre-conceptions for the love of tone...the eternal quest

Nekro

BTW: SUNN Model T sim would be a treat and a Dumble Overdrive Special also would be most welcome

[Sascha Franck]

So what does Average Joe do? Yes, he takes what has the most bang for the buck. It's daily routine. And you can't really say that you only need like 5 amps for the rest of your life - depending on the job, or if we talk about sound layering, it can be way more. Especially from an engineers point of view. And we're not talking about the usual amp suspects here.

I'm sorry but you don't seem to have an idea about what you're talking about here at all.
I'm making my living entirely by playing guitar and I have never felt the need of owning more than 2 amps at once. Ok, there's been times I had around 5 plus some rack stuff, but apart from 1-2 they were gathering dust.
It's the same for almost all of my guitar slinging colleagues.
Speaking from an engineers POV, most engineers I know are more than happy to see a guitar player having one or two quality sounds he/she is really familiar with rather than somebody showing up with tons of different stuff.

Now, of course, in case of software, we do obviously expect a bit more (I do as well), but as someone looking for a great tone, I'd rather take 3-5 basic amp models (as an example: Vox-ish, Fender-ish, Marshall-ish, Recto-ish and a Boutique model) and a selection of quality stomp boxes (someone please make a clone of a Fulltone OCD, an Xotic BB Booster and a Hermida Zendrive...) nailing the ultimate tone instead of permanently having to deal with myriads of options, none of them exactly being what I was looking for in the first place.

Of course, we don't know yet whether the TH1 will be the ultimate tool, either (so far, only the modern metal leads of Dimitar and the riffing shogger posted have convinced me, both of them not being tones I usually make much use off, the clean and crunchy stuff I heard so far left me cold, to be honest), but judging an amp sim from the number of available amp still isn't making much sense to me.

For instance, I constantly see you talking about the POD and it's great amount of amp models and the likes. Well, I *do* own a POD XT. Want to know how often I exactly use it? Right - NEVER! Because it sounds like utter crap. It's featuring the most undynamic amp models of all times, the tone is lifeless and boring to even start with. I also don't even know a single player worth their salt using PODs much in any serious productions. Ok, Limp Bizkit might be an exception, but their recordings made with a POD sound like shit, too, so that doesn't help either. Also, their full amps don't see much use but in top 40 bands and the likes.
I have never heard about a guitar player bringing their Line 6 Spiders or even Vettas to a studio session as their main amp. Never ever, not even once (and rest assured thet Limp Bizkit had quite some other amps beside PODs in use as well...). What you still see in recording (and most live) situations is a tube amp or two and a bunch of selected pedals.

Fwiw, I'm not saying software hasn't come a long way - it certainly has and I'm enjoying it as much as everybody else. But comparing any decent amp sim to what Line 6 has on offer is useless, simply because, as said, Line 6 has quantity over quality plastered on them all over the place without delivering much (if any) truly decent amp sounds (I pretty much like their Delay Modeller, though).

Again, as said, I have no idea whether TH1 will be a better solution instead of what I already use, but in case the Overloud folks start with sound instead of features in mind as the basic idea, I'm all applauding such an approach.
And whether the asking price is actually justified or not - who'd be able to tell yet? Sure, it's more expensive than others, but in case it also sounds that much better, why not?

- Sascha

[cwig]

release... ASAP...

Price: list is 249 Euros + VAT (where applicable)
US and Canada: 349 USD

Wasn't there talk about a special introductionary price?

That's the reason I mention LIST price.

Fine

[MelodyMan]

You should all buy an old J-station. One of the best amp-sims ever made even by today's standards awesome quality. I also use a Digitech RP250 for recording and i'm very satisfied with it. It is all in the tweaking imho.

[cwig]

The manual is now available for download from http://www.overloud.com/en/download/

[buscemi]

The manual is now available for download from http://www.overloud.com/en/download/

Thanks for that! Good catch.