Cytomic 'The Glue' Compressor

[mystran]

@mystran
Hi there! Just wanted to ask, if you could try again with the new 1.0.10 as i think that "the glue" has really improved with this new release.

I tested with 1.0.10. My demo period with the older one run out ages ago.

Andy did some reprogramming / algorithm changes. I think it also effects the stereo behavior in a good way (couldn't tell any difference between "the glue" and the UAD 4K anymore).

Well, reading the list of things that were changed, I think I'll have to use the rest of the renewed demo period to play with it for purposes of normal customer evaluation too. But the above posted results with regards to stereo detection in static case are 1.0.10 results... so in theory they could be wrong with regards to the older samples done with 1.0.9 (maybe it WAS the same as UAD before).

[Ankherias]

Thanks for doing the test mystran, a quick test with a vectorscope shows an increase in width of the stereo field with the M/S method so I think I'm going to like it.

[andy-cytomic]

@adl & mystran: Thanks for running some tests. I currently do have time to go through in detail everything said, but let me say what The Glue is doing and has always done.

1) The Glue gains the left and right signal exactly the same
2) The Glue has two sidechain amps and two ratio shapers each with it's own gain detection diode
3) Both of these diodes then feed into a single attack resistor, capacitor, and release resistor
4) This signal is then fed to the two sidechain amps control signals, which makes it a feedback compressors
5) This is the smoother and analog way of the digital version of simply taking the maximum of either detector.

Having two complete ratio shapers is more expensive in analog and in digital. Summing the left and right signal to mono before feeding into a single sidechain amp is not ideal since you will not compress out of phase signals correctly. I don't know what the UAD plugin is doing in this regard, but summing to mono is not an option to me.

So, by summing to mono on an out of phase signal (ie the left is inverted of the right) you will indeed not mess with the stereo field, but you will also not do any compression as the sidechain signal will be zero!

Andrew Simper

[mystran]

I don't know what the UAD plugin is doing in this regard, but summing to mono is not an option to me.

Agree on it not being a good idea.

I guess two diodes feeding single filter network basically comes down to picking the highest signal (maxing) because that's the voltage the resistor sees, and if one models limited currents, then it becomes some sort of non-idea max() function?

My test was rough anyway, so quoted values might not be totally right, and it might have missed a lot of small details.

So, by summing to mono on an out of phase signal (ie the left is inverted of the right) you will indeed not mess with the stereo field, but you will also not do any compression as the sidechain signal will be zero!

Yup, that's the part I forgot to test against. Summing stuff once they have been rectified is safe though, since they are no longer out-of-phase and won't cancel.

But don't worry, your external side-chain input allows the extra fun anyway. Have fun at Messe.

[andy-cytomic]

I don't know what the UAD plugin is doing in this regard, but summing to mono is not an option to me.

Agree on it not being a good idea.

I guess two diodes feeding single filter network basically comes down to picking the highest signal (maxing) because that's the voltage the resistor sees, and if one models limited currents, then it becomes some sort of non-idea max() function?

Yes that's right. I covered it briefly in point 5) above but the following may be of interested. Because a diode is an exponential voltage to current converter you end up with something along the lines of: id1d2 (v1, v2) ~= exp (v1) + exp (v2), so if v1 >> v2 then id1d2 (v1, v2) ~= exp (v1), where id1d1 is the current post diodes. (for those non math geeky reading the thread ~= means "approximately equal to" and >> means "very much greater than". The bit where it gets more interesting is when the signals are approximately the same level, which just happens to be most music with mainly mono content and a bit of ambience. The behaviour is in this case the most different from simply taking the max.

...Yup, that's the part I forgot to test against. Summing stuff once they have been rectified is safe though, since they are no longer out-of-phase and won't cancel.

Well that's it, you don't get your bonus this year

But don't worry, your external side-chain input allows the extra fun anyway. Have fun at Messe.

Definitely, that's what it's there for Thanks for posting the test signals and for checking them out an commenting on them mystran

Andrew Simper

[jpga]

LOVE IT ANDREW !!!

JP

[mystran]

Urgh.. actually toyed around with the new version a bit for purposes of listening how it sounds, and have to say I like it much better than previous (which I didn't find very interesting). I'm actually starting to wonder whether the stereo behaviour of the Glue is actually an advantage when compressing some stuff like drums simply because they stay nice and tight and focused.. hmmh.. and then use a wider-sounding compressor on the final master bus to pull some width into the general ambience....

Oh well.. I wish I actually knew how to make decent music.

[Tp3]

Oh well.. I wish I actually knew how to make decent music.

CAN I USE IT AS MY SIGNATURE ??

[mystran]

Oh well.. I wish I actually knew how to make decent music.

CAN I USE IT AS MY SIGNATURE ??

Sure after my copyright expires 70 years after my death (as if you had to ask).

[SWAN808]

Oh well.. I wish I actually knew how to make decent music.

CAN I USE IT AS MY SIGNATURE ??

Sure after my copyright expires 70 years after my death (as if you had to ask).

[mystran]

Oh well.. I wish I actually knew how to make decent music.

CAN I USE IT AS MY SIGNATURE ??

Sure after my copyright expires 70 years after my death (as if you had to ask).

Those sun-glasses look scary, and the grin is somewhat threatening too. Don't you guys dare to try to kill me now just to make that go faster (you may freely attempt to kill me for other reasons though, I think).

[aplats]

Oh well.. I wish I actually knew how to make decent music.

CAN I USE IT AS MY SIGNATURE ??

Sure after my copyright expires 70 years after my death (as if you had to ask).

Those sun-glasses look scary, and the grin is somewhat threatening too. Don't you guys dare to try to kill me now just to make that go faster (you may freely attempt to kill me for other reasons though, I think).

Are you saying we should call off the boys then? Jean-Claude Van Damme is on his way as we speak...

[Tp3]

Oh well.. I wish I actually knew how to make decent music.

CAN I USE IT AS MY SIGNATURE ??

Sure after my copyright expires 70 years after my death (as if you had to ask).

Just being polite...

It's just that this line alone encapsulates so much, IMO.... prob more then what one might think...

You did a good deed, dude

Thanks !

[sureno]

LMAO i wish i knew how to make music, what im doing still comes under the noise category

[Tp3]

LMAO i wish i knew how to make music

You have to let it all go, sureno.... fear, doubt and DISBELIEF....

F-R-E-E____Y-U-O-R____C-O-M-P-R-E-S-S-I-O-N

RELEASE your mind from the ATTACK of the processors... The GAIN you'll MAKE UP from it, will far surpass all
you will ever need...

Man, I don't know who struck first, us or them (the processors).... But I know that it was US that scorched
the sky [points up]

Throughout music history, we have been dependent on processors to survive...

Hehe [bitter smile---> ]... [looks up to the sky] fate, it seems, is not without a sense of irony