Record: New DAW from Propellerheads

[FaX]

Sorry - but to clarify the question:

Just an underlying concern that Record *might* record this super-timestretch audio (and store it embedded within its proprietary song file format) in its own proprietary audio format, not as a .wav.

If this is so then those audio files will be impossible to edit in a wave editor, and quite possibly the audio track would only host files in the proprietary format. So any other audio file would need to be imported via DrRex or NN-XT - as is the case with Reason.

This would be a HUGE limitation, so I hope my vague concern is unfounded. But I don't see anywhere in the Propellerhead blurb where it lists supported audio file formats such as .wav, .aiff, .mp3, etc. Obviously some of these are available as export options (but which?)... but how about import?

Perhaps blank/diod of somebody else who has an early beta copy could confirm?

IN .wav & aiff




You can apparently alter bit rate and depth, tempo etc for multiple takes and it remembers the embedded data when reopened also.

[blank/diod]

When you purchase Record you no longer need to use Reason. Because all the regular Reason functionality and more still are available in Record itself.

No, that's incorrect.

Record exclusive devices:

ID8 (simple playback sampler, or "rompler")
Line 6 guitar amp
Line 6 bass amp

Overlapping devices (originally Reason exclusive devices that Record-only users will also get):

MClass (4 devices)
Combinator
RV7000 reverb
Scream 4 distortion
CF-101 chorus
DDL-1 delay
Spider Audio
Spider CV
14:2 mixer
6:2 mixer


Reason exclusive devices:

Thor
Subtractor
Malström
NN-XT
NN-19
Dr. REX
Matrix
RPG8 Arpeggiator
BV-512 Vocoder
Redrum
UN-16 Unison
PH-90 Phaser
D-11 Distortion
RV-7 Reverb
COMP-01 Compressor
PEQ-2 EQ
ReBirth Input Machine


If you have both, you will have access to all of the Reason exclusive devices in Record.

If you're a strict drums/bass/guitar band with no electronic stuff going on you can buy Record for $299 (that's the recommended list price, but we all know what will happen there once Guitar Center and others start selling it...) and not have to pay for a bunch of synths and samplers you don't need. Conversely, if you're a strict electonic musician who doesn't want audio tracks, you can buy just Reason and not pay extra for superfluous audio recording functionality. And trust me, those users exist too -- there are people over at Props' forum who are pissed that they spent time on audio track functionality instead of making Reason even more of an electronica toolbox...

[nuffink]

How's the integration with the samplers, blank? Is it a simple drag and drop to get your takes into nn-xt/nn-19?

[v1o]

When you purchase Record you no longer need to use Reason. Because all the regular Reason functionality and more still are available in Record itself.

No, that's incorrect.

In actual fact it is correct and well documented, I even have it confirmed with somebody working with Props. When you own Record you no longer have to launch Reason because you can use all of Reason's functions (Devices, Effects, Midi) within Record itself. Notice my post was at directed someone who is already using Reason and using something else to record.

[blank/diod]

When you purchase Record you no longer need to use Reason. Because all the regular Reason functionality and more still are available in Record itself.

No, that's incorrect.

Notice my response was at directed someone using something else to record with Reason.

Yes, that was my assumption about what you were going for, but with the wording "When you purchase Record you no longer need to use Reason" it's bound to be misunderstood by some as "Record stand-alone includes all of Reason", which is not the case. I've already explained it to a dozen people who were under this misapprehension.

[Compyfox]

ID8 (simple playback sampler, or "rompler")
Line 6 guitar amp
Line 6 bass amp

Get GearBox/PODFarm for the Line6 Stuff

Overlapping devices (originally Reason exclusive devices that Record-only users will also get):

MClass (4 devices)
Combinator
RV7000 reverb
Scream 4 distortion
CF-101 chorus
DDL-1 delay
Spider Audio
Spider CV
14:2 mixer
6:2 mixer

The only thing out of that list that'd interest me is the Scream4. If that'd be native VST, that'd be cool. Else it's not worth getting a "recording tool" just for that purpose.

Reason exclusive devices:

Thor
Subtractor
Malström
NN-XT
NN-19
Dr. REX
Matrix
RPG8 Arpeggiator
BV-512 Vocoder
Redrum
UN-16 Unison
PH-90 Phaser
D-11 Distortion
RV-7 Reverb
COMP-01 Compressor
PEQ-2 EQ
ReBirth Input Machine

If I remember correctly, the COMP-01 looks and works like the old KWIK Compressor, which was freeware.

If you're a strict drums/bass/guitar band with no electronic stuff going on you can buy Record for $299 (that's the recommended list price, ...

Sorry, but for an "add on" to make reason record-ready (which somehow even runs via ReWire?!), that's a bit too expensive IMO. But the "reason only" users might definitely appreciate it.

[v1o]

They should integrate this into Reason...otherwise use Audacity or something

When you purchase Record you no longer need to use Reason. Because all the regular Reason functionality and more still are available in Record itself.

Which begs the question, why not just call it Reason 5?

They can call it whatever they wish thats not important. Notice the upgrade path from Reason is just $150? The important thing is that it gives Reason users the ability to record. I don't see Record as a standalone product, you can certainly use it stand alone, I see it as an expansion of Reason. You now get recording, audio, time stretching, a new Mixer and effects. For Reason users its a very attractive upgrade.

[blank/diod]

Get GearBox/PODFarm for the Line6 Stuff

I was listing what's included in the different applications to avoid any confusion, I wasn't making an argument for buying this or that.

Sorry, but for an "add on" to make reason record-ready (which somehow even runs via ReWire?!), that's a bit too expensive IMO. But the "reason only" users might definitely appreciate it.

ReWire has nothing to do with it (It's for third party apps only). On a technical level the Record/Reason integration isn't an "invisible cable", the integration is tighter than, say, between a VST host and its plugins.

[headquest]

Anyway, I may have missed this but another important question about Record:

Can you or can't you import your own audio files and loops directly into an audio track (i.e. without using ReCycle, Dr Rex or NN-XT), and if so,
* do they automatically timestretch?
* what audio file formats are supported?

Yes, you can import WAV or AIFF to your tracks, and yes, they timestretch just like anything you recorded in Record. If you want them out of Record again, you can bounce all the tracks with a single menu command. So in case you want the Record timestretch goodness but for some reason want to mix the files in another application, just import them to Record, change the tempo, bounce and you're done.

Thanks to you - and FaX - for the confirmations. This is good news indeed. Just one other question on this subject if you will indulge me... does it have MP3 export?

Regarding timestretch quality - Ableton Live, in spite of the comments a few others have made - has a timestretch that is often embarassingly poor. I have owned and used Live since version 2, each version up to 7 Suite, and beta tested the last four versions including 8.0. And even the latest CPU-intensive algo added in v8.0 is incapable of producing good results in many cases. Generally speaking, a mix in Ableton where some tracks at least are audio which has been timestretched will sound very grainy, and even though the overall audio quality of Live is great (as has been well documented) the grainy timestretch lets it down significantly, and is almost certainly the reason that a lot of people have criticised Live's audio quality in general.

The demos of the Record timestretch so far available are WAAAYY superior to the timestretching capability of Live as I know it as a long-time user. Some of the clips released are stretched by very large tempo changes, far above what a user would normally want to acheive. Certainly at the extreems the graininess begins to show, which is presumably why they went to such tempo extreems (i.e. to show how far you could go before the graininess appears).

I agree with John Vulich that using a real-time timestretch in a production context is not a very good idea. But I wonder whether Record might change that... and I'm guessing that the technology behind it may be something other developers start wanting to license from Propellerhead if they get the chance.

If this has really been around in Prop Headquarters for a while, it begs the question, why haven't Ableton put more development into improving their timestretch before now, considering the huge number of user requests to do something to make it credible.

This aspect of Record could indeed be a significant breakthrough, provided results are consistently as good as in the released examples.

[nuffink]

I'll try again...

How's the integration with the samplers, blank? Is it a simple drag and drop to get your takes into nn-xt/nn-19?

[nuffink]

When you purchase Record you no longer need to use Reason. Because all the regular Reason functionality and more still are available in Record itself.

No, that's incorrect.

Notice my response was at directed someone using something else to record with Reason.

Yes, that was my assumption about what you were going for, but with the wording "When you purchase Record you no longer need to use Reason" it's bound to be misunderstood by some as "Record stand-alone includes all of Reason", which is not the case. I've already explained it to a dozen people who were under this misapprehension.

"Record stand-alone includes all of Reason" is clearly true. Notwithstanding the fact that you need a copy of Reason passively sitting on your hdd in order to uncripple it.

[Amberience]

I'll try again...

How's the integration with the samplers, blank? Is it a simple drag and drop to get your takes into nn-xt/nn-19?

I doubt it. That would involve re-working the samplers themselves, surely?

[ludwig]

If you're a strict drums/bass/guitar band with no electronic stuff going on you can buy Record for $299 (that's the recommended list price, but we all know what will happen there once Guitar Center and others start selling it...) and not have to pay for a bunch of synths and samplers you don't need.

And how much will the Record/Reason bundle cost?

Is there any info about midi routing? I know that there is no midi out, but does this have midi in and can I for example rout 1 midi channel to a Thor + 1 to a Redrum, etc and record all this at the same time (I don't think that this is possible in Reason, but correct my if i'm wrong).

[lotus2035]

"CONFORM CONFORM CONFORM!!!"

Why do so many bitch about lack of VST support?... If you want VST support buy any one of the other million tools available..what's the problem?

I say "props to the props" for trying to do something different...The Swedes like to be different (stubborn?) and as a foreigner living in Sweden I have a love/hate relationship with that particular aspect..For example it drives me crazy that the Swedes wont adopt the Euro..haha.. But in the case of music software I'm glad they are trying a different approach...

[v1o]

If you're a strict drums/bass/guitar band with no electronic stuff going on you can buy Record for $299 (that's the recommended list price, but we all know what will happen there once Guitar Center and others start selling it...) and not have to pay for a bunch of synths and samplers you don't need.

And how much will the Record/Reason bundle cost?

Is there any info about midi routing? I know that there is no midi out, but does this have midi in and can I for example rout 1 midi channel to a Thor + 1 to a Redrum, etc and record all this at the same time (I don't think that this is possible in Reason, but correct my if i'm wrong).

The bundle suggested price $629. Cheaper than the Ableton suite which is $699. Street price will probably b cheaper.