Record: New DAW from Propellerheads

[zion7]

strawman argument. Waves might not be your answer, but surely Reason cannot be the end be all of everything you will ever need, ever!

Ok. I have a friend who records what I think is outstanding music with reason alone. He's putting vinyl out, and he's getting quite a bit of attention. I think he's mad talented. Hmmm. He only uses reason. So based on your statement, he needs something else... but for what? Why does he need something else? Can you explain that to me? Because you are basically saying he can't do it all in reason. When all is said and done, he hands the wavs over to an engineer for mastering. What else does he need? I'm listening.

I think at this point everybody knows its the artist more than the tools. But both matter
to understand my perspective, I will have to share my experience. I used to be 100% Reason and my first completed song got more success than I could have dreamed of. I started collabing with other artists and before I knew it, I got exposed to Cubase. Almost immediately my sound took off to new levels, even though I had years of experience with Reason. Then it became much easier and quicker for me to put stuff on labels. SO yeah, of course its possible to be successful with Reason alone. But you can't prove that he wouldn't get even MORE success if he used better tools. Until I got GURU, Reason was my sketchpad for putting down beats and ideas quickly. I loved it for that. But then I always had to move the ideas to a serious DAW to get that big sound to compete with the fulltime pros putting out music. Trust me, its much harder with Reason. I think Liam Howlett of the Prodigy has made similar arguments too about Reason (cheapo-testimonial argument by me lol)

[neverfall]

and I swear "competes" is the most overused term on KVR's host forum. There is no finish line here. There will never be a winner.

I think you're right.

Who "competes" only to half-ass the effort?


Surely not a winner. Maybe a finish line does exist...but as long as there are willing customers to pay for updates/expansions for features that REALLY should have been included in V1.0 judging by what the competition already offers...


I'm not convinced developers have any such hope of "finishing" anything.

[Jeremy_NSL]

I'm not bashing you but I really think that you need to reconsider the sound quality available in Reason/Record. For the most part its 95% ok. I think before the debut of the MClass devices you may have had a point, but right now things are pretty competitive.

Tons of albums have been completed entirely in Reason and the sound quality is quite acceptable. If you need that extra 5% of mixing quality then you'll need to pay for it - either from an engineer or with expensive plugins yourself.

PS: one of the faulty assumptions I make is assuming all producers here are Electronic music recording artists. In my genres, sound quality is as an integral and important part of the producing process as the actual writing. I tend to forget there are people who just write ideas down and are done after that phase

[zion7]

I'm not bashing you but I really think that you need to reconsider the sound quality available in Reason/Record. For the most part its 95% ok. I think before the debut of the MClass devices you may have had a point, but right now things are pretty competitive.

Tons of albums have been completed entirely in Reason and the sound quality is quite acceptable. If you need that extra 5% of mixing quality then you'll need to pay for it - either from an engineer or with expensive plugins yourself.

PS: one of the faulty assumptions I make is assuming all producers here are Electronic music recording artists. In my genres, sound quality is as an integral and important part of the producing process as the actual writing. I tend to forget there are people who just write ideas down and are done after that phase

I mean we will have to agree to disagree. I have used Reason up through version 3.5 and in my opinion, the M-Class suite is not even on the same league as many of my VST plugins. Forget Waves, theres are tons of companies making superior quality FX for pennies (or even free). The only thing I will give credit for is Scream. Its one of the best if not the best distorts I have heard.

[Ubiety]

So is that pronounced record or record?

Neither.

It's "räkörd", and only natives of Hälsingland, Sweden can pronounce it correctly.

Best post of this thread so far!

As far as Hälsingland, Sweden is concerned, it may just be -- or not.

But I don't know what a Swedish/Portuguese cookie contest has to do with Record.

[lotus2035]

The only "toyish" aspect of any music software is maybe the ability of the monkey at the controls.. Go props!!

[headquest]

Well the one thing I find quite hard to do well in Reason is actually mixing. I think Record will address that, big time...

Bu everyone has to start someplace. For me it was largely Reason too (and Tracktion). And yes, I progressed to Cubase too (and Live, Audition... ). But Reason is still great for what it is, and I'm pretty sure that Record will be equally great.

[Jeremy_NSL]

Fair enough. The MClass stuff sounds acceptable to my ears but I'm not one that's overly concerned with having the best EQ anyway.

I will say that if you are that dependent on a good EQ/Comp then you may really like Record. The SSL Mix Compressor sounds amazing on the master bus. Its an instant improvement. And of course there is the channel EQ and Comp too. I'm not enough of an expert on these things to compare those, but its safe to say if you are a EQ/Comp junkie you will definitely have some stuff in Record that's a level up on the Mclass stuff.

I mean we will have to agree to disagree. I have used Reason up through version 3.5 and in my opinion, the M-Class suite is not even on the same league as many of my VST plugins. Forget Waves, theres are tons of companies making superior quality FX for pennies (or even free). The only thing I will give credit for is Scream. Its one of the best if not the best distorts I have heard.

[spaceman]

I think yadayadayada sums it up nicely

[pdxindy]

Bear in mind that you could use Soundflower on OSX (there must be a PC alternative!) to route audio signals into Record... thus... if your VST has a standalone option, you can launch that, and record directly into Record; just set the tempo to the same as record, and then slice off the latency that there will be... if you can zoom in that far of course

Just an idea....

Yeah I've already suggested people could use ReRoute (from Reaper) or another virtual audio cable option (of course on my Creamware system I can do that natively anyway)

Actually I *think* I might be able to use my Profire control panel to do the same thing, by using the software returns. Will have to investigate.

The whole point is that it is supposed to be easy and simple... having to jump through hoops to be able to record a softsynth means it is less easy than existing hosts

[headquest]

The whole point is that it is supposed to be easy and simple...

Yes, but it's not supposed to be for people who want to record VST synths... clearly! That's why it is not as easy as hosts that Are aimed at VST users. Erm... obviously! If you are keen to record VST instruments then you are obviously not the target market for this product

[bobbybland]

High end D/A Converters + good monitors may indeed show you that Reason's sound quality isn't that bad.Coupled with a good set of ears.For alot of things it's just fine,I think thats the point,some are completely fine with the sounds they can get out of reason..

I will admit,alot of junk was offered in the form of refills in reason's earlier days,but the newer stuff is actually pretty damn decent,if certain aspects of your gear are up to par..my 2cts'

[pdxindy]

The whole point is that it is supposed to be easy and simple...

Yes, but it's not supposed to be for people who want to record VST synths... clearly! That's why it is not as easy as hosts that Are aimed at VST users. Erm... obviously! If you are keen to record VST instruments then you are obviously not the target market for this product

My comment was in the context of a couple posters thinking about how they can record the audio of a standalone synth into Record. My point is why bother if its main claim is simplicity.

[aMUSEd]

Bear in mind that you could use Soundflower on OSX (there must be a PC alternative!) to route audio signals into Record... thus... if your VST has a standalone option, you can launch that, and record directly into Record; just set the tempo to the same as record, and then slice off the latency that there will be... if you can zoom in that far of course

Just an idea....

Yeah I've already suggested people could use ReRoute (from Reaper) or another virtual audio cable option (of course on my Creamware system I can do that natively anyway)

Actually I *think* I might be able to use my Profire control panel to do the same thing, by using the software returns. Will have to investigate.

The whole point is that it is supposed to be easy and simple... having to jump through hoops to be able to record a softsynth means it is less easy than existing hosts

It's no more "jumping through hoops" than using Rewire would be really. It's just using your softsynth host as an audio input which is no more or less than you would get if you could use Record as a Rewire master to a softsynth host. Not as good as it loading plug-ins natively true but that's just not on the cards.

[Pete C]

It is also probable that the audio engine has been improved over R4 for Record. Using R4 within Record might improve the sound quality right off the bat. I believe that R4's audio engine was already improved over 3 as well, so I am not sure R3 can be relied upon as a baseline for what Reason is capable of today. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.