KVR Audio

s_sibs · Post by **s_sibs** » Fri May 29, 2009 10:12 pm

hibidy wrote:good god, the amount of kit pieces is insane!

The demos are excellent, but I don't/can't do all that heavy stuff. That kit must require x64 with like 32 GB or ram

The kits are quite well optimized. Some of the Combined Presets can get a little crazy (up to 3+ GB) but I tested them on my regular studio audio computer (a single core P4 3gHz with 2GB of RAM). I set the 'Layer Limits' to 'small' or 'smaller' and was able to load even those large Combined Presets on my old, but reliable, computer. There's lots of ways to optimize S2 to fit just about any computer.

pattonfreak1 · Post by **pattonfreak1** » Sat May 30, 2009 1:13 am

All I needed to see was...

Gene Hoglan

Dewdman42 · Post by **Dewdman42** » Sat May 30, 2009 8:43 pm

yea that is gonna be great expansion. I will be forced to get it, can't even consider not. If you do rock of any kind, its a no brainer. I was starting to lust after Steven Slate drums, but not now.

I wish TT would improve their software usability though. They are way ahead of BFD in the sound dept, but BFD2 usability is ahead of TT. The Ezplayer kludge is just one aspect. I find it entirely annoying and un-intuitive to interchange snares from different kits. I should be able to click on a kit piece such as a snare and see a list of ALL snares that are currently installed from any of the expansions. instead, I only see the snares that were included with the current kit, and in order to use another snare I have to do some BS about creating an X-drum and when mapping the midi note over to that instead of the snare, etc.. What a hassle that is. BFD's piece browser is way more intuitive and actually enjoyable to use.

I also find it annoying that different kits have different midi drum maps

Cyrosis · Post by **Cyrosis** » Sat May 30, 2009 10:40 pm

Dewdman42 wrote:I should be able to click on a kit piece such as a snare and see a list of ALL snares that are currently installed from any of the expansions. instead, I only see the snares that were included with the current kit, and in order to use another snare I have to do some BS about creating an X-drum and when mapping the midi note over to that instead of the snare, etc.. What a hassle that is.

I for one wouldn't want that, as you would eventually have a list that drops down the entire screen, and all of their names would have to be extended as well, to include the kit they are from. There's no right or wrong here, but I like it the way it is.

However, there is one large thing that makes the X-Drums required in my eyes. Each expansion has it's own unique drum, and percussion layouts that make loading a single kit and gaining access to all of the instruments literally impossible. You could for example load Avatar, and have access to it's 10 cymbal positions, but what if you wanted one of the extra cymbals from the Metal Foundry expansion, which has 13 cymbal slots? Or some of the percussion from DFHS? You can't have the empty slots required for all the kits on screen at once, and X-Drums allows easy access without loading a second instance of Superior. Of course even if you could load from all the current slots, you would still have to assign the microphones properly to the mixer, considering each expansion is completly different in that regard as well, and each users mixer setup is likely different on top of that.

Dewdman42 · Post by **Dewdman42** » Sat May 30, 2009 10:44 pm

no, it doesn't have to drop down the entire screen, that is another weakness in their GUI design. Have a try at BFD2 somtime and you'll see what I mean.

Dewdman42 · Post by **Dewdman42** » Sat May 30, 2009 10:48 pm

regarding x-drums, its not bad that you can add extra x-drums to create monster sized kits. I don't have a problem with that. What i have a problem with is that I can't simply select any one of the snares that I have bought and paid for, easily from the snare piece. I have to go monkey around with creating an extra x-drum piece and then I have to tell Superior to use that instead of the normal snare piece. Its not intuitive and its not easy to browse my different snares and hear them.

Give BFD2 a run through sometime. Honestly, FXPansion did a much better job of some of these aspects. I'm not meaning to diss on Toontrack, the sound of Superior2 is to my ears better so I use it and will muddle through the GUI I don't like. But I wish they would improve it.

susiwong · Post by **susiwong** » Sat May 30, 2009 11:04 pm

While I don't have the slightest problem with EzPlayer being separate, I have to admit X-Drums are a royal PITA.
I'd not only like to choose kitpieces of a certain class from one single list across all expansions, imho what would be needed on top of that would be a simple, one sound preview (say 90% velocity, most typical articulation).
The GUI apparently is big enough for the MetalSDX, all others are smaller, so where's the problem ?
The only half valid argument I can see pro X-Drums atm is the fact the kits are recorded with different rooms, though personally I haven't had any problems yet.
Ymmv,
susiwong

Dewdman42 · Post by **Dewdman42** » Sat May 30, 2009 11:09 pm

There is another problem between various kits which are that different kits may have different capabilities in terms of hi hats and some of the other pieces in the way midi is handled. For example, hi hats in the Avatar kit can use CC4 to crossfade between different amounts of openess. EZX expansions do not really have that capability.

But personally, I don't think that should matter. TT should simply allow me to build any kit I want, with as many pieces as can fit on the screen and for any one of them, I should be able to pick and choose from all the other similar pieces that i have installed, across all expansion packs that I have installed. The fact that they keep them segregated so much into seperate kits is a royal PITA.

Cyrosis · Post by **Cyrosis** » Sun May 31, 2009 12:41 am

susiwong wrote:The only half valid argument I can see pro X-Drums atm is the fact the kits are recorded with different rooms, though personally I haven't had any problems yet.
Ymmv,
susiwong

It's not only different rooms however, it's channels like Avatars sub kick, and guitar amp, compared to the metal SDX's trash snare channel, studio reverb chamber, and multiple snare mic's, not to mention some of the abnormal stuff in the EZX's. I am downloading the BFD2 demo atm, but I really have no problem with the X-Drums.

Dewdman42 · Post by **Dewdman42** » Sun May 31, 2009 1:20 am

you're missing the point.

There is nothing wrong with having xdrums feature.

What is wrong is that TT *requires* us to use the xdrums feature to do simple things that could be handled more elegeantly and in a way that makes it more intuitive to browse through your sounds and assemble a kit.

Dewdman42 · Post by **Dewdman42** » Sun May 31, 2009 1:22 am

regarding audio routing, etc...that is something they can handle all under the covers. There is no reason I should have to wade through all that just to, for example, browse ALL the snares I have installed and pick the ones that works for me. If they use inconsistent audio routing than that is either bad planning on their part or something that can be handled behind the scenes. I just wanna browse all the snares and pick one and have that be the snare, in an easy way, like BFD2 does it.

Cyrosis · Post by **Cyrosis** » Sun May 31, 2009 2:05 am

Dewdman42 wrote:regarding audio routing, etc...that is something they can handle all under the covers. There is no reason I should have to wade through all that just to, for example, browse ALL the snares I have installed and pick the ones that works for me. If they use inconsistent audio routing than that is either bad planning on their part or something that can be handled behind the scenes. I just wanna browse all the snares and pick one and have that be the snare, in an easy way, like BFD2 does it.

It does already route the mic's that are exactly the same, just leaves the extra ones unrouted.

I have the BFD 2 demo open at the moment, and as near as I can tell, you can set it to a few kit sizes, and change each piece to a drum type, say kick, and then choose a kick drum from there? I can't say I find that more intuitive for my needs, just different. Not as if there is any reason to debate this anyway, you don't like it, I like it, simple as that.

Dewdman42 wrote:you're missing the point.

Not missing the point, we just have different needs.

Dewdman42 · Post by **Dewdman42** » Sun May 31, 2009 2:10 am

ok, great. TT software is perfect for you. I wish for it to improve. But TT sounds rock!

susiwong · Post by **susiwong** » Sun May 31, 2009 2:12 am

In this case I have complete confidence in TT, they have always delivered in the past.
Look at the "bounce through mixer" topic, enough users complained and now it's here.
Exactly that's what we're doing atm, make a complaint about something that should be improved, in a constructive way, I hope.
Btw, I see Cyrosis' points quite well, only my conclusions are different.
Cheers,
susiwong

Cyrosis · Post by **Cyrosis** » Sun May 31, 2009 2:14 am

susiwong wrote:In this case I have complete confidence in TT, they have always delivered in the past.
Look at the "bounce through mixer" topic, enough users complained and now it's here.
Exactly that's what we're doing atm, make a complaint about something that should be improved, in a constructive way, I hope.
Btw, I see Cyrosis' points quite well, only my conclusions are different.
Cheers,
susiwong

Yeah, I would never be against changes that would improve it for other users, as long as they kept all of the options open.

Toontrack announces The Metal Foundry SDX