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Cyforce wrote:if you would take the code of the dsp synth and would put it 1 to 1 on the pc, you will need a quad-core with 4x3 Ghz to get 4 voices out of the synth!
This is one of the most common myths about DSP. It was probably true, like, 20 years ago, but now general-purpose CPUs are much, much faster than DSPs. Even if you compare theoretical performance from chip specs, you'll find that a typical CPU is ~50-100 times faster than a typical DSP (for example, Motorola 56362 used in Virus is capable of about 100 MIPS, while my Core 2 Duo E6700 can do about 10000 MIPS). This difference can also be seen in practice with plugins that are available both as native VSTs and as plugins for hardware DSP platforms. For example, I've done an experiment with Sony Oxford Inflator plugin which is available in DSP-powered PowerCore and native PC versions, and I've been able to load only 8 or so instances in PowerCore before it ran out of DSP power, but for native version I simply tired of adding more and more instances; I finished on about a hundred instances and they took together only ~20% of CPU power.
The reason why DSPs are still used in hardware synths is that they are cheap, and with hardware you always need to cut costs as much as possible. No one uses DSPs because of their power; actually, to make the device cheaper, the simplest and slowest possible DSPs are used, with performance just necessary to do the job.

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I think EVERYONE interested should write in to Waldorf and ask for a Demo Largo. I maybe wrong but It seems like it would jump start their sales. In fact I just did it myself. Here are my exact words.

I sincerely request that you release a downloadable demo of your software synth Largo. Of course that would mean more work for you but it would increase your sales considerably and that what business is about.

Maybe if many people write in, they may do it. We can make history!!!!!!! LET"S DO IT!!!
Johann Da Man

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@Megakazbek

Interesting.

It's true that modern general purpose CPUs are powerful, certainly. And that they have instruction sets that include stuff for optimising DSP type operations.

But I'm not so if modern DSPs haven't kept pace. DSPs are optimised for certain tasks. When you talk about MIPS it will depend on what the 'I's are. For DSP work MFLOPS are more relevant.

Also which PowerCore model do you have, how recent is it and are you sure it didn't run out of storage space or DSP RAM before it ran out computing cycles? Another thing to consider is what is their threshold for acceptable latency? In native processing this is usually considered less crucial, i.e. it's up to the user so there won't be some imposed limit where you would otherwise need to increase buffer sizes. This isn't a reflection on how fast the processor can do the calculations.

Basically I agree with you though. It's not really an issue any more and it is unlikely plugin designers are cutting back on what their algorithms are doing because something is running on a general purpose CPU.

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Actually looking at manufacturer benchmarks it is pretty crazy how fast modern CPUs are. But then dedicated DSPs don't have to do much else, and there are often several of them.

The fastest SHARCs seem to be rated at about 2.7 GFLOPS but Intel reckon the top i7 does over 50. Yikes!

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Well, face it .. todays DSPs are rather for copyprotection and marketing than anything else. The whole concept is outdated and I'll never support it.

But lets get back to the Largo ... could someone try to make a demo with a just real "pleasing" sound?

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Nokenoku wrote:Well, face it .. todays DSPs are rather for copyprotection and marketing than anything else. The whole concept is outdated and I'll never support it.
That's an interesting conspiracy theory but I don't think it applies to stand alone instruments.

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george freeman wrote:I think EVERYONE interested should write in to Waldorf and ask for a Demo Largo. I maybe wrong but It seems like it would jump start their sales. In fact I just did it myself. Here are my exact words.

I sincerely request that you release a downloadable demo of your software synth Largo. Of course that would mean more work for you but it would increase your sales considerably and that what business is about.

Maybe if many people write in, they may do it. We can make history!!!!!!! LET"S DO IT!!!
+1

btw this topic is really close to my heart :D Largo->demos->views on importance of different kinds of synthesis->demos->demo->DSPs->theories :D add some console vs pc, mac vs pc, rickroll, warez and the perfect topic is ready :D

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george freeman wrote:I think EVERYONE interested should write in to Waldorf and ask for a Demo Largo. I maybe wrong but It seems like it would jump start their sales. In fact I just did it myself. Here are my exact words.

I sincerely request that you release a downloadable demo of your software synth Largo. Of course that would mean more work for you but it would increase your sales considerably and that what business is about.

Maybe if many people write in, they may do it. We can make history!!!!!!! LET"S DO IT!!!
It's a great idea. There's no way i'd buy it without trying a demo version first. I feel a poll coming on. :evil:

Not really but writing to them can not hurt! I'd love to know their logic for not releasing a demo. The y are being quite secretive about it; i got no clear answer as to why when i asked on the list, just that it hadn't come up. :|
Latest release and Socials: https://linktr.ee/ph.i.ltr3

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musikmachine wrote:
george freeman wrote:I think EVERYONE interested should write in to Waldorf and ask for a Demo Largo. I maybe wrong but It seems like it would jump start their sales. In fact I just did it myself. Here are my exact words.

I sincerely request that you release a downloadable demo of your software synth Largo. Of course that would mean more work for you but it would increase your sales considerably and that what business is about.

Maybe if many people write in, they may do it. We can make history!!!!!!! LET"S DO IT!!!
It's a great idea. There's no way i'd buy it without trying a demo version first. I feel a poll coming on. :evil:

Not really but writing to them can not hurt! I'd love to know their logic for not releasing a demo. The y are being quite secretive about it; i got no clear answer as to why when i asked on the list, just that it hadn't come up. :|

I'd really like to bet it has to due with their distribution contracts. I'd also hazard a guess that, after a demo is petitioned, an option to buy direct will follow. This could really screw up in store distribution.


I guess, in store distribution, is the safest bet that you will move a large number of products. Not only are you marketing your own brand, the shop is pushing products on its shelf as well.

The whole, "no demo," makes quite a bit of sense to me. Not that I enjoy it, but it does make some sense.


Anyways, I'd like to buy this product before 2009 ends. This most likely will be my software for the year. I've really got to upgrade my audio card to a high end Konnekt, and I kind of want an axiom pro, or a Kx 61, so I'll be doing that first.

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ckatrun411 wrote: I'd really like to bet it has to due with their distribution contracts. I'd also hazard a guess that, after a demo is petitioned, an option to buy direct will follow. This could really screw up in store distribution.


I guess, in store distribution, is the safest bet that you will move a large number of products. Not only are you marketing your own brand, the shop is pushing products on its shelf as well.
There is this new thing called "the internet" where a product is easily accessible by every person on the planet who has access to this network. :lol:

The new business model is getting rid of in store sales and selling direct - that way every bit of revenue goes to the developer instead of a large percentage going to a retail chain. Furthermore, if I buy online, normally it is authorized immediately, so I don't have to wait for the latest update. I can even buy used software on KVR for a fraction of the street price and normally get the same quick activation service. High street stores are a waste of time when it comes to software and I hope Waldorf will sell direct so we can all get instant access to the new technology.
I invented coffee

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^Good point. They should follow Fxpansions lead and go download only. Or at least offer the option. When i have money i always try a few demos of the type of synth i'm interested in and spend a few days trying out the demo, seeing how it works in a project, how easy it is to program, how good the fx etc. Without that it's shooting in the dark and i know better than to rush out and buy a vst because everyone says it's good, even if it does sound like a virus.:hihi:

Just give us a demo Waldorf dammit! :lol:

Please!
Latest release and Socials: https://linktr.ee/ph.i.ltr3

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dmacintyre wrote:
ckatrun411 wrote: I'd really like to bet it has to due with their distribution contracts. I'd also hazard a guess that, after a demo is petitioned, an option to buy direct will follow. This could really screw up in store distribution.


I guess, in store distribution, is the safest bet that you will move a large number of products. Not only are you marketing your own brand, the shop is pushing products on its shelf as well.
There is this new thing called "the internet" where a product is easily accessible by every person on the planet who has access to this network. :lol:

The new business model is getting rid of in store sales and selling direct - that way every bit of revenue goes to the developer instead of a large percentage going to a retail chain. Furthermore, if I buy online, normally it is authorized immediately, so I don't have to wait for the latest update. I can even buy used software on KVR for a fraction of the street price and normally get the same quick activation service. High street stores are a waste of time when it comes to software and I hope Waldorf will sell direct so we can all get instant access to the new technology.


I don't disagree with any of this. I'm just giving ideas as to why I think there is no Largo demo. Anyways, this is futile.

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filterfilter wrote:
drmesmer wrote:A good demo from largo with 3 patches:

http://www.buda.jazztel.es//demo_largo.mp3
the filter sounds really good!!
I noticed as well!

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Igro wrote:
filterfilter wrote:
drmesmer wrote:A good demo from largo with 3 patches:

http://www.buda.jazztel.es//demo_largo.mp3
the filter sounds really good!!
I noticed as well!
I still think v-station sounds much better. Even its very old. Their filters are superb. Also Karmafx synth and Rob Papen Predator got nice filters. So again, this synth gets too much hype.. It's just synth with bad filters and bad sound.. Dont even wait that demo :roll:

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keel wrote:
Igro wrote:
filterfilter wrote:
drmesmer wrote:A good demo from largo with 3 patches:

http://www.buda.jazztel.es//demo_largo.mp3
the filter sounds really good!!
I noticed as well!
I still think v-station sounds much better. Even its very old. Their filters are superb. Also Karmafx synth and Rob Papen Predator got nice filters. So again, this synth gets too much hype.. It's just synth with bad filters and bad sound.. Dont even wait that demo :roll:
Did you get Largo already and trying to review?

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