researching alternative to Live for theater show control

[siriusbliss]

Hello,

I've just downloaded the demo, am still reading manuals and forum posts, etc., but in the meantime I'm investigating finding an alternative, preferably light-weight host for an interactive live performance show I'm co-producing.

Currently we're running the show in Ableton using each scene as a song (playlist) - not using separate projects for each song. As we know Live has limitations, or otherwise unnecessary limitations in MIDI routing and VST handling .

The show involves use of alternative (proprietary) interactive MIDI controllers that trigger MIDI, lights, LEDs, video graphics, and various other media elements such as lasers and even fog machines via DMX.

Currently in Live we have close to 150 channels of various audio routing I/O to numerous speaker placements around the theater, as well as aux busses for effects, etc.

My problem is that Live is so bloated that I've been forced to use external hardware synths in order to get enough MIDI performance note density through the system. Therefore I have been unable to use VST's due to the Live project footprint already pushing 1.6Gigs. Even on a new i7/4G system, I can't get enough horsepower out of the program for my needs.

So - a few questions:

• I'm using MIDI-OX to get a lot more internal routing ports in/out of Live - can Cantibile's MIDI routing capabilities allow me to get rid of MIDI-OX?
  How well does it handle MSB/LSB setups for various VST synth bank preset changes in mid-song. I sometimes need to change instruments during song playback.
  Is there any input quantize feature, or do I have to rely on a 3rd party tool for this?
  Is there a way to see all channels simultaneously - for mixing and minipulating incoming data?
  Is there a MIDI editor feature for changing recorded notes and controller data?
  Can each session (or perhaps song in my case) have distinct bpm?

Anyways, thanks for answering my questions. Looks like a great program.

Greg

[bradr]

Hi Greg,

Thanks for your interest in Cantabile. That's some serious requirements you've got there!

I'm using MIDI-OX to get a lot more internal routing ports in/out of Live - can Cantibile's MIDI routing capabilities allow me to get rid of MIDI-OX?

Depends what you're doing with MIDI-OX, but Cantabile has pretty flexible internal MIDI routing and will handle as many MIDI in ports as your machine has.

How well does it handle MSB/LSB setups for various VST synth bank preset changes in mid-song. I sometimes need to change instruments during song playback.

Not sure exactly what you're trying to achieve here except to say that incoming bank changes will be passed on to plugins and that it mostly depends on the plugin how it will handle it. If you'd like to supply more detail on what you're after then I'll try to answer more fully.

Is there any input quantize feature, or do I have to rely on a 3rd party tool for this?

No.

Is there a way to see all channels simultaneously - for mixing and minipulating incoming data?

Not, though this is planned.

Is there a MIDI editor feature for changing recorded notes and controller data?

No, and not planned.

Can each session (or perhaps song in my case) have distinct bpm?

Yes

Anyways, thanks for answering my questions. Looks like a great program.

Thanks, please get back to me if you have additional questions.

Brad

[siriusbliss]

re: MSB/LSB presets - I mostly just need to change instruments mid-song from a MIDI sequence/preset change (already running inside Cantabile). Currently Live cannot send bank changes to external hardware.

re: bpm's - I need to only load Cantabile project once, and have all songs in the playlist, and have all distinct instrument and backing tracks ready to go at the song bpm.

re: MIDI-OX - I'm using this to run some other programs in parallel that are not VST plugins, but I need to trick the host into routing these programs THROUGH the host. I see that Cantabile only handles physical MIDI I/O, which is OK.

Also, how about automation? Any plans?

Thanks again,

Greg

[bradr]

re: MSB/LSB presets - I mostly just need to change instruments mid-song from a MIDI sequence/preset change (already running inside Cantabile). Currently Live cannot send bank changes to external hardware.

I think the main thing to remember here is that Cantabile doesn't support MIDI editing/authoring/composing so the MIDI sequences would need to be authored in a separate app. Sending bank changes to external hardware or directly to plugins is no problem, but there's currently no way to map MIDI bank/program changes to specific VST presets.

re: bpm's - I need to only load Cantabile project once, and have all songs in the playlist, and have all distinct instrument and backing tracks ready to go at the song bpm.

This is exactly what Cantabile's sub-sessions is all about.

re: MIDI-OX - I'm using this to run some other programs in parallel that are not VST plugins, but I need to trick the host into routing these programs THROUGH the host. I see that Cantabile only handles physical MIDI I/O, which is OK.

Take a look at Cantabile's MIDI routing table - this can conditionally route MIDI based on selected program number. Routing table entries can also be controlled from sub-sessions.

Also, how about automation? Any plans?

Similarly to your first question, there's no MIDI authoring so no real automation support. That said, there is some limited support for mapping MIDI CC (say from a MIDI file) to VST parameters.

Brad

[siriusbliss]

Thanks Brad,

I'll keep testing.

Greg