KVR Audio

sinkmusic · Post by **sinkmusic** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 9:57 pm

Hlis93 makes amazing GUI work, and so are Scott Kane and LimeFlavour.
Leslie is a very nice guy and has made several good stuff gui-wise on various projects, and Antto is also quite skilled (even if he works on a 640x480 resolution screen so his gui are sooo small ;P ).
Mr Bungle, your friend's artwork looks good, too.
It makes plenty of handy helpful skilled people !

synthgeek · Post by **synthgeek** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 9:57 pm

ford442 wrote:does anyone else feel this is a major drawback of traditional 303-style sequencing?

Yes. Though I also like the idea of having an onboard sequencer- one that doesn't require triggering via midi, but that does sync to the host transport. Useful for live use in a modular host.

antto · Post by **antto** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 10:02 pm

sinkmusic wrote:and Antto is also quite skilled (even if he works on a 640x480 resolution screen so his gui are sooo small ;P ).

nooooo! ;]
i'm on a big fat 17" Philips monitor @ 1152x864 / 75Hz

i just happen to have a Televisor which supports 800x600 max (i probably mentioned somewhere, that my GUI looks good even on such a "monitor" ..)

btw i love pixel art, so this might explain why i mess so much with the pencil and the zoom tool

Music Engineer · Post by **Music Engineer** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 10:33 pm

ford442 wrote:i wish that i could see my pattern in its entirety somehow on the 303.. just the steps with note values somehow all at one time.. then i could make variations on the pattern more easily i think and also i would have an easier time seeing how the pattern fits with the other tracks

personally, i like to create 303ish sequences in a standard piano roll editor - slides are done by just overlapping notes, accents are set via velocity. this seems quite natural to me and is probably more intuitive than 303 alike sequencing. so - i would say - internal sequencing has currently low priority. something like that would then also be intimately linked to GUI stuff which is currently also not yet the first priority.

...currently i'm just trying to get the sound right.

Music Engineer · Post by **Music Engineer** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 10:38 pm

mr.bungle wrote:My friend modeled a 303 for my web-303-thing that was never finished. You can check the graphics here: http://www.rinki.net/pekka/webirth/

mmhh, somehow the 303 websynth doesn't seem to load over here (in Opera and IE)

btw.:
My black metal name is: Darkahl Robinrduk

..or: Nokturhl Robinahl !

Music Engineer · Post by **Music Engineer** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 10:54 pm

Robin from www.rs-met.com wrote:...currently i'm just trying to get the sound right.

...soo the first concrete thing that could be done would be to obtain some samples from a real 303 showing the naked oscillator signal (filter fully open, resonance zero, EnvMod zero) for the saw and the square and for various notes. from that, we could see the exact shape of the waveform and amplitude envelope. i preliminarily matched these things to the ABL (the waveform is actually pretty close, the amp-env only a rough sketch - i'd really like to see samples from a real 303 for tweaking those)

autodafe · Post by **autodafe** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 10:59 pm

Robin from www.rs-met.com wrote: ...soo the first concrete thing that could be done would be to obtain some samples from a real 303

I can do it if you want. What exactly do you need?

Music Engineer · Post by **Music Engineer** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 12:04 am

autodafe wrote:
Robin from www.rs-met.com wrote: ...soo the first concrete thing that could be done would be to obtain some samples from a real 303
I can do it if you want. What exactly do you need?

cool, thanks!

i would first like to find out what the cutoff of the filter is when it's fully open - to see this, i would need a sample with full resonance, no envmod and the cutoff fully open (decay and accent also zero). the resonant peak will then show me where the cutoff is. ahh, and it's probably best to use the saw waveform for this.

then, turn the resonance fully down. play long notes at various pitches with saw and square and with and without accent (connect them with slide, if they are too short otherwise). this will show me the basic waveforms as well as the amplitude envelope for accented and non-accented notes.

ah, do you have a device with devil-fish? if so, the mods should be set to neutral values as well.

thanks in advance, robin

edit: ah i forgot: for the accented notes, let's now also turn the accent pot to 100%

mistertoast · Post by **mistertoast** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 12:14 am

Ooh. This is exciting. I want those files, too.

mistertoast · Post by **mistertoast** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 2:12 am

Does the 303 have free-running oscillators? I assume so, since you can slide between notes.

But if not, you can decide the phase when you start a note. And that might have some affect on whether the note-on "clicks" or not.

mystran · Post by **mystran** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 2:13 am

Fully open by cutoff pot might not be fully open when fully envelope modulated, not to mention accent boosting it even further... just saying.. in case it actually even matters all that much where the exact limits are

antto · Post by **antto** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 3:41 am

OSC is free runing, waveform is (IMO) 99.9% plain SAW, the Square can be achieved just by two of these SAWs (one inverted) with a little phase offset
don't be fooled by what you see on the audio samples, the waveform there has been filtered by the filter (which has the highpass filters and this is what makes both waveforms look wierd)
if you can hack-in and get the signal of the OSC before it gets in the filter to an Oscilloscope - i think you would get just dissapointed/bored.. i believe it's pretty simple there
probably there is a little ugly thing about the negative peak of the square (i just think so, not sure) but otherwise it's really nothing special there..

be aware that when ENVMOD is zero, you still have envelope modulating the filter! no matter where the Cutoff knob is..

the peak of the filter (i mean the resonance seen on an FFT) when Envmod=0 Cutoff=100% is about 3.2 to 3.3KHz

antto · Post by **antto** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 4:14 am

Robin: i looked into your sources a little bit
damn, never saw a VST SDK code, i was thinkering about it..
you have written this so beutiful, i was expecting something quite confusing (since that's what my stuff looks like)
you really gonna make me download the SDK and try do stuff myself finaly! ;]

Hlis93 · Post by **Hlis93** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 6:46 am

Just my 2cents:
I cant speak to the code or any of that as its completely beyond me, but please no 303 look-a-likes!!! I find I'm so tired of that look...same goes for the 909 & 808 they are far to over done now. Besides if you do it, it needs to be so over the top photo realistic you run the risk of Roland being irked. If you try for the sort-a-like-it it just doesn't work and looks like a lame duck. Encouragement to whom ever handles the GUI, please break the mold and do something creative and different

.

If a sequencer is added at some time please don't emulate the 303's! Something more efficient with direct visual feedback on the whole sequence.

brambos · Post by **brambos** » Thu Sep 10, 2009 8:20 am

Hlis93 wrote:If a sequencer is added at some time please don't emulate the 303's! Something more efficient with direct visual feedback on the whole sequence.

That seems to be a religious discussion and you won't please everyone unless you implement both the oldschool 303 sequencer and a more visual representation. Many people argue (and I'm kind of on that side as well - in the case of the 303 at least) that part of what makes the 303 so special is that the sequencer-from-hell actually helps you come up with unexpectedly cool acid-lines you didn't intend in the first place.

Open303 - open source 303 emulation project - collaborators wanted