looking for a "cheat sheet" that lists drum programming for different genres?

[Shabdahbriah]

My idea is that instead of a visual template or chart, to internalize these tendencies by doing it by hand, is going to inform your music in a way that some mechanized way of approach might not. That is to say, someone who has played a beat is going to be able to program it with authority versus someone who has just connected the dots on a graphic.

Though I would support the OP's request/desire, and certainly encourage it as a "learning aid" (as far as it goes), I agree with your statement.

There are tons of books, and other resources on producing all manner of music, but DOING IT is different, and if you are trying to learn "the rules" and/or "techniques/secrets/structures" for a particular "market" (key word) the idiosyncracies can be overwhelming.

The simple fact is, that "genre's" and "styles" ARE "formulas" which by their nature are constrained within certain expected and/or anticipated parameters. The moment someone "innovates" (deviates), it is (seemingly) either incestuously rejected, or praised as the next "NEW" thing (formula).

While "PLAYING" the beats manually (whether recording it to audio and/or MIDI track) rather than "programming" affords one the "naunce" that (IMHO) only live performance affords. Cleaning-it-up afterwards is just another aspect of "production", which even with the MOST "sterile" programming, is a continous process, of "choices" made, compensated for, played-on, or embellished.

Though you can get "close" with "humanizing" your beats/programmed-riffs (etc.), I've always found that term rather amusing from the standpoint of BEING A "HUMAN", particularly when using a DRUM MACHINE!!!...

(maybe it helps to be a drummer though)

[2c]

[normalson]

Though I would support the OP's request/desire, and certainly encourage it as a "learning aid" (as far as it goes), I agree with your statement.

While "PLAYING" the beats manually (whether recording it to audio and/or MIDI track) rather than "programming" affords one the "naunce" that (IMHO) only live performance affords. Cleaning-it-up afterwards is just another aspect of "production", which even with the MOST "sterile" programming, is a continous process, of "choices" made, compensated for, played-on, or embellished.

Though you can get "close" with "humanizing" your beats/programmed-riffs (etc.), I've always found that term rather amusing from the standpoint of BEING A "HUMAN", particularly when using a DRUM MACHINE!!!...

(maybe it helps to be a drummer though)

[2c]

thank you for the post, and i think the learning aid wording is better then cheat sheet.

i think that part of this need (for me) to program over manually play is my lack of experience in most things instrumental. i shouldn't let that stop me from trying that way.

OFFTOPIC but on topic sortoff, isn't it amazing how differently you hear the same music when you are listening for how it was made vs just listening carefree?

[Shabdahbriah]

... and i think the learning aid wording is better then cheat sheet.

"Cheat-sheet" works for me. I think it just freaks-out some people for different (personal) reasons. Like "dance music" isn't "real music" to some, and "instant/easy" music packages/programs are "cheating" to others, some of whom would insist on entering each 32nd note on a sequencer by hand, for it to be "real". Others wouldn't touch a sequencer if there life depended on it...etc., etc., etc... DO WHAT WORKS FOR YOU!!!

The current technology and the unlimited resources available are ALL fabulous, as it gives EVERYONE who might be in any way inclined, or desire to make/give "music" a shot, an opportunity (vehicle) to TRY. Do it for YOU.

... i think that part of this need (for me) to program over manually play is my lack of experience in most things instrumental. i shouldn't let that stop me from trying that way.

No you shouldn't. Having a good (subjectively/objectively) sequencer, and SEEING/hearing the MIDI notes play, will help you LEARN it "visually". Simple.

"MIDI FILES" of the styles you're most interested in DOING, will give you this, as well as let you modify them sequentially, and then "A/B" (compare) them, so you can get a feel for it.

... OFFTOPIC but on topic sortoff, isn't it amazing how differently you hear the same music when you are listening for how it was made vs just listening carefree?

Yes... there is a ZEN to it... to be sure.

[ZooTooK]

I guess this is what Band-in-a-Box http://www.pgmusic.com/products_realdrums.htm is all about. Giving you a sketch pad using cliches from different styles.

[robogone]

You offered no hope or help to a guy that just wanted a few pointers.

Exaggeration seems to be your forte.

"forte"?
you pretentious git.

[mistertoast]

You offered no hope or help to a guy that just wanted a few pointers.

Exaggeration seems to be your forte.

"forte"?
you pretentious git.

I love the discussion under "usage," basically saying that no matter how you pronounce "forte," you'll irritate someone...

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/forte

[gambaytheunspoken]

To try and answer the original question. I believe there is a site called drummmer.org or some such variation where they give drumming lessons, in addition to which you can download different styles and patterns in pdf format to practice and do your own sequencing. I have these aforementioned pdfs in my possession on my hard drive, and if you like I can send them to you.
Also, check your local library. Roland has a book, a little bit old, on drum programming in different styles.
Ciao!

[normalson]

thank you for the post, although i'm not find the website which you are talking about. if i can't find the websites, it would be nice to see those pdfs you have.

[drunken jesus]

if you have fl studio just look in the scores section theirs tons of midi drumloops in every different style, if you don't have fl studio just download the demo and load up fpc & theirs a browser that you can flip through the different loops, imo thats the easiest way you could see all the different styles and what not

imo drum programming in a genre isn't all that exclusive, some have distinct rhythms & percussion choices but most simple patterns could be used in any genre without anybody even noticing and saying "hey that sounds like (insert genre here)"

[jancivil]

My idea is that instead of a visual template or chart, to internalize these tendencies by doing it by hand, is going to inform your music in a way that some mechanized way of approach might not. That is to say, someone who has played a beat is going to be able to program it with authority versus someone who has just connected the dots on a graphic.

Though I would support the OP's request/desire, and certainly encourage it as a "learning aid" (as far as it goes), I agree with your statement.

There are tons of books, and other resources on producing all manner of music, but DOING IT is different, and if you are trying to learn "the rules" and/or "techniques/secrets/structures" for a particular "market" (key word) the idiosyncracies can be overwhelming.

The simple fact is, that "genre's" and "styles" ARE "formulas" which by their nature are constrained within certain expected and/or anticipated parameters. The moment someone "innovates" (deviates), it is (seemingly) either incestuously rejected, or praised as the next "NEW" thing (formula).

While "PLAYING" the beats manually (whether recording it to audio and/or MIDI track) rather than "programming" affords one the "naunce" that (IMHO) only live performance affords. Cleaning-it-up afterwards is just another aspect of "production", which even with the MOST "sterile" programming, is a continous process, of "choices" made, compensated for, played-on, or embellished.

Though you can get "close" with "humanizing" your beats/programmed-riffs (etc.), I've always found that term rather amusing from the standpoint of BEING A "HUMAN", particularly when using a DRUM MACHINE!!!...

(maybe it helps to be a drummer though)

[2c]

all this of course gets beyond the newcomer OP's idea, but just for the world, intermediate or what-have-you:

I think that to click on a button - on a machine - labeled 'humanize' is just perverse. To me, it's 'do you want your own personality to govern the track, or not'.

As far as the visual aid, I think using a midi part, say on cycle for x amt of bars is a fine thing to do. But if you don't get your hands dirty and feel what it's like to hit the beat, or not, you're really allowing a robot to do your part from the very outset. There is nothing wrong per se with doing that, if that's what you want in the track. There might be people 'born genius' enough with rhythm to never have to do this manually, but I don't know about it myself.

In terms of what a beat and a rhythm looks like in the piano roll or drum editor, trust me when I say this, real funky rhythms don't look all that tidy, and it takes tons of experience to get a handle on where things fall; so looking at great drum parts as midi files could be a very useful exercise. I just caution tho', that mechanical, shortcut approaches tend to tell on you as sounding like just that. But a lot of people seem to prefer the cookie cutter tidiness, a non-lumpy shape above all, so total YMMV.

[breakmixer]

Hi, if this is the wrong area, could a mod move this thread to the best place for it? thanks.

so i haven't really seen it before but i think it would be extremely helpful for beginners to have a sort of cheat sheet that illustrates common drum programming of different genres, and their respective BPM

for example house, kick on 1,2,3,4 snare on 2,4, high hats on .....etc.

graphically listed like you would see it on a sequencer or tracker would be great. I could do the graphics if others could help with the info.

even better would be additional info, like common fills, common breaks, ways to change the programming to give it life would be most excellent.

thanks.

Import some loops(of different genres) into your daw and emulate them in midi using drum hits/sample player! You will learn what they did!

[Terror Twinkie]

Learn to play drums from the keyboard or get a midi controller with pads designed for tapping out drums. Play along with your favorite songs until you get the hang of it. More fun and satisfying in the end than "programming" drums or using canned loops.

[breakmixer]

Learn to play drums from the keyboard or get a midi controller with pads designed for tapping out drums. Play along with your favorite songs until you get the hang of it. More fun and satisfying in the end than "programming" drums or using canned loops.

I did actually mean for him to play them in and not draw them btw! Just said loops because it's free of music and other clutter...

[normalson]

i hope this doesn't color me the biggest newbie but are you guys saying to play even the 4 to the floor dance beats?

from the reading i have been doing my impression was these were pretty rigid timing wise and gave the "anchor" of dance music.

it makes sense to me to "play" the other percussion.

just trying to understand, thank you for all the help!

[breakmixer]

i hope this doesn't color me the biggest newbie but are you guys saying to play even the 4 to the floor dance beats?

from the reading i have been doing my impression was these were pretty rigid timing wise and gave the "anchor" of dance music.

it makes sense to me to "play" the other percussion.

just trying to understand, thank you for all the help!

Yes, In cubase you can also auto quantize the playing in so it auto corrects it to the nearest 16th(what ever your setting is), but even snares and claps are sometimes played slightly early or late(using 64ths), but it's a good way to learn....Obviously a 4x4 kick in house etc is on the beat, but you mentioned other genres, learning to play it in live will make you work faster and groove with it, you can always edit it afterwards, I now work alot with rex files and layering to make my drums fuller and phatter, lots of different ways to do drums but first you need to get a feel for the direction you want to go in and choosing the right sounds/layering/eq is another important factor, ps I'm still learning myself....just what I've learned so far....