Hearing Chords

[neueliteratur]

Hello people,

I've been trying to hear each note, when a chord is played.

Like, I'd play Cmaj and try to hear C, E and G.

Nobody told me to, I just thought it would be a good thing to be able to do.

I'm not seeing much improvement, and I'm wondering if it's worth working at.

It's like those pictures that contain two different pictures, and depending on the perspective, you see a rabbit or an old woman. And nobody practices doing that. And you'll never see the rabbit and the woman at the same time.

Is it the same thing with the chords? Is it possible to hear all of the different notes that form the chord at the same time?

When I concentrate on the C, I hear the C. When I focus on the E, I hear the E. But I can't hear all of them at the same time.

Is it better to learn to recognize the color of different types of chords, than to hear the notes?

Thanks for your advises.

[Melkor]

1st up, focus on the 3rd.

Listen to CMaj and then Cm.

Soon you can hear the 3rd "sandwiched" between C and G.
It wont be long before you can easily hear if its E or Eb.

Do this with all keys.

Then compare C with Csus4

Its soon easy to hear that 3rd moving up.

Comparison with the Major Triad is your ticket.


Exhaust all the possibilities between 1 and 5 (ie compare sus2,dim etc etc with Major) and then move on to comparing 7ths once you have mastered this.


Also, practise hearing intervals, both melodic and harmonic.
It goes hand and hand with this.

Good luck

[aquar]

halfstep,
Assuming you haven't already done so start with an ear interval trainer.
http://www.musictheory.net/trainers/html/id90_en.html

For intervals it helps to have some references.
Here's some I used during training that helped me a lot.
Obviously you can find your own from songs that you've played to death.

m2 Jaws
M2 Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer - Silent night
m3 Smoke on water - Greensleves
M3 Oh when the saints
P4 Auld lang syne - We wish you a merry christmas
DIM 5 Simpsons
P5 Star wars
m6 Love story
M6 MY way
m7 Star trek
M7 AHA take on me.

Once you are sorted and it shouldn't take long move onto the scale trainer.
http://www.musictheory.net/trainers/html/id91_en.html

and finally move to the chords.
http://www.musictheory.net/trainers/html/id92_en.html

I used a similar method with chords as I did with intervals.

Hope it helps.

[Ogg Vorbis]

I took 4 semesters of classes called "Aural Skills" which focussed on hearing rhythms, intervals, melodies and harmonies. These are lifelong skills and one should never stop practicing them, I think. So you are doing the right stuff.

In that class the prof would play a triad with all notes simultaneously, then separately (one after the other from the bottom up). What I learned to do is to sing them just under my breath. I still do this to the present day - when I hear something I will sing it mentally or just under my breath to figure out what it is.

I recommend trying to sing the intervals within a harmony that you hear. It trains you so that you can isolate different intervals one at a time.

There are a lot of software packages out there that will help you train your ear. I think it would be good to look for one that plays a harmony one note at a time and then simultaneously.

Someone might recommend a website that doesn't charge money too or you can Google some of them.

After a while you'll be able to hear a harmony with all notes played together and you will be able to mentally separate the individual notes. Learning to sing them is somehow key to this ability. I'm not sure how that works, but singing the notes is an important part of learning to hear.

[jancivil]

Is it better to learn to recognize the color of different types of chords, than to hear the notes?

I think so.

I don't think it's a good use of your time to do exercises and try to abstract notes from chords in any practical sense.

It's a better use of time to learn songs off recordings, with no other aids. Learn to hear what's happening, in the context of everything else that is happening, and recreate it by ear. Learn the bass part, learn the keyboard, guitar, learn the whatever part. This academic approach to 'ear' I think is some bullshit. Jeezis, I never had 4 semesters of anything in my life. *1 semester* of that interval recognition from tunes that feature 'em routine, and keep learning tunes

If one is having a lot of trouble recognizing major vs minor quality in a triad after some time, maybe music isn't the best choice of something to waste time with anyway though. I mean, there are people who really can't tell you 'yellow' vs 'orange' but are they trying to paint, you know..

[groovesys]

Is it better to learn to recognize the color of different types of chords, than to hear the notes?

I think so.

I don't think it's a good use of your time to do exercises and try to abstract notes from chords in any practical sense.

It's a better use of time to learn songs off recordings, with no other aids. Learn to hear what's happening, in the context of everything else that is happening, and recreate it by ear. Learn the bass part, learn the keyboard, guitar, learn the whatever part. This academic approach to 'ear' I think is some bullshit. Jeezis, I never had 4 semesters of anything in my life. *1 semester* of that interval recognition from tunes that feature 'em routine, and keep learning tunes

If one is having a lot of trouble recognizing major vs minor quality in a triad after some time, maybe music isn't the best choice of something to waste time with anyway though. I mean, there are people who really can't tell you 'yellow' vs 'orange' but are they trying to paint, you know..

I tend to agree with this because that is the way I learned. I listened to records and figured out the chords, melodies, and harmonies. I learned theory much later and that just helped me solidify what I already knew.

I can't fully understand not being able to hear notes inside a chord since that ability has always felt natural to me. For that I'm fortunate. As Jancivil states, if you're having trouble recognizing major vs minor chords, then music may not be your thing. It's perfectly fine to like music and appreciate it, but I think all musicians have a natural ability that they were born with.

Musicians hear music differently than non-musicians. A non-musician can learn theory and, perhaps, learn an instrument, but he'll never really "get it" like a musician.

[aquar]

For that I'm fortunate. As Jancivil states, if you're having trouble recognizing major vs minor chords, then music may not be your thing. It's perfectly fine to like music and appreciate it, but I think all musicians have a natural ability that they were born with.

Musicians hear music differently than non-musicians. A non-musician can learn theory and, perhaps, learn an instrument, but he'll never really "get it" like a musician.

Its exactly that type of pompous attitude I'd expect to hear from the music establishment not a musician as you call yourself.
I disagree that all musicians were born with some type of natural ability. Some were some weren't. The ones that weren't thankfully didn't listen to people like you otherwise the world of music would be a much poorer place.

Halfstep if you love music and love making it and want to learn keep at it dude, try to ignore anyone that tries to tell you otherwise.

[yellowfever]

A non-musician can learn theory and, perhaps, learn an instrument, but he'll never really "get it" like a musician.

I consider myself a musician, but think your attitude is a very 'closed club' one and is wrong. I write music and couldn't tell you if Cmin7 was a black note, white note or a pound note! Am I in the wrong game? What an idiot.

[tehlord]

As Jancivil states, if you're having trouble recognizing major vs minor chords, then music may not be your thing. It's perfectly fine to like music and appreciate it, but I think all musicians have a natural ability that they were born with.

Musicians hear music differently than non-musicians. A non-musician can learn theory and, perhaps, learn an instrument, but he'll never really "get it" like a musician.

Utter bollocks

[Tony Ostinato]

theres no denying thats theres artists who have hit songs out now on the charts who have no clue what key their songs are in. and thats cool a lot of that stuff is cool regardless.

moving on...

i play by ear and also do arranging and transcription for the horn sections in the bands i play in on an all too frequent basis.

once when i was joinin a horn band they had to see for themselves the process so they sat and watched me transcibe the horn section from a tune from the vinyl record and they saw what a boring process that was. still once the charts done its done and memory can be re-allocated on the players lol.


its a lot easier nowadays you can get reaper and a keyboard vsti and loop sections and slow em down, i probably wouldve gotten better at this much faster.

and then enter the notes into finale which will actually play back your score so you can listen for wrong notes. its almost like a video game.

the thing thats often said about theory , reading etc is that it stunts the creativity. i dont think thats absolutely true but i think what often happens is you realize the chord progressions and tunes you were writing are actually hundreds of years old with only slight variations which are themselves quite old etc and it can be a bummer whereas not knowing that is blissfull and the audience sure doesnt care so....

all that said i love music and at the beginning of the day im always glad i can speak her language, at least a little.

[yellowfever]

@ groovesys - I see you're in Los Angeles

[jancivil]

I wasn't born with any great ear for pitch, not_at_all. I had to work for the relative ear I do have today. A little bit of talent can go a long way.

But, major vs minor chord, that is an obvious different color. If one has been around music or heard a good deal of music and is, a grown person, and this is a problem, this, music isn't the field for them. You see an orange and a lemon, one is orange, the other isn't. There are people this distinction is lost on. These people are not going to become visual artists.

If one does j'accuse!: 'elitist!', one has to charge it equally to all things. Not everyone has all abilities. That is not true.

Whether or not one recognizes the words 'major' vs 'minor' is a different question, a question of language, of naming. I know people who make good and even great music who do NOT know what stuff is called, but their ear knows what it is. But if one knows what these things are and cannot distinguish, this is likely a lack of talent for the activity.

[groovesys]

@ groovesys - I see you're in Los Angeles

Does living in LA make me an "elitist"? Would it make you happier if I lived in Boise?

[Ogg Vorbis]

@ groovesys - I see you're in Los Angeles

Does living in LA make me an "elitist"? Would it make you happier if I lived in Boise?

LOL

[tehlord]

@ groovesys - I see you're in Los Angeles

Does living in LA make me an "elitist"? Would it make you happier if I lived in Boise?

That depends if you pronounce it 'boy-zee' or 'bwasay'