[Prog rock] [Linux] Lovatnet, Parts 1-4: kinda WIP instrumental

[Lost_Highway]

Here's something I've been working on lately. It's a symphonic progressive rock instrumental, influenced to a large degree by some of the moody Scandinavian bands of the past couple of decades.

What's presented here is essentially finished: I feel the writing and recording for these sections is complete and I'm now content with the mix, for the time being at least.

I daresay I might feel the urge for a few tweaks here and there if I take a break from it for a few weeks and come back with fresh ears, or if anybody points out any glaring howlers that I've become deaf to (quite likely, I'm sure). (Probably why it takes me ages to get anything finished, ceaseless tweaking )

But it's a work-in-progress in the sense that I don't know where it's going next (I have a few ideas). Plus, I've done no post-processing/mastering beyond a touch of limiting just to raise the level a bit. I'll probably get around to doing a bit of mastering at some point to polish it up a bit (I know, I know, you can't polish a turd ).



The working title is Lovatnet and so far there are parts 1-4 (in true prog fashion they will probably end up each with their own sub-titles). I probably ought to warn that it starts off very quietly but does get a fair bit louder in places:

FLAC: 22.7 MB

OGG-7: 6.6 MB

MP3 224 kbps: 7.2 MB



It was all done under Linux, but using copious quantities of VST instruments (M-Tron/Pro, VSM, Oddity, B4 II, Elektrik Piano) running under Wine. Oh and I had to GSnap one instrument into shape!

It was recorded in Ardour, drum programming done in Hydrogen, a tiny bit of MIDI sequencing in Rosegarden, a couple of Giga files in Qsampler (Linuxsampler frontend) and the pipe organ is the wonderful Aeolus synthesizer.

No 4/4 time was harmed during the making of this music, but 13/8 was given a damn good thrashing

I shall don my silver cape, stand on my Persian rug and await your comments and constructive criticism. Enjoy

[duncanparsons]

ace write up! Just bookmarking to return (need to concentrate on some other things for a while and don't want to miss this!)

I like the Mellotron paragraph

[TankEyes]

hehe entertaining write up. A "mystical prog/metal" vibe going on here. Heaps of detail (stunning), strange time sig and you make it flow well. It's a good arrangement, but I do feel like it ends at a point where you really need to crack on with a GTFO heavy bit. It doesn't NEED it per se, but it would work imo.

The woodwindy isntrument at 3:30 would do well with a bit of articulation, little breathy moments or slides etc to make it sound a bit more natural.

The bass could be a bit deeper or louder too (after the timpani), to help with the track's spectrum dynamics.

The mix is great, quite clear and a nice volume during the action. (hehe, the subtle bass probably helps here)

ty for teh epicness.

[Lost_Highway]

ace write up! Just bookmarking to return (need to concentrate on some other things for a while and don't want to miss this!)

Thanks! I thought I was probably being too verbose as usual and made an effort not to go on too much. Personally I like to read a lot of background info about music, it helps with my appreciation of it. Not that I feel I put that much backstory about it -- if anyone wants more, just ask and I'll spread my typing diarrhoea around

I like the Mellotron paragraph

There was a thread recently over on ProgArchives about the entries for Progressive Rock, the Mellotron and even some bands (the Crimso one is hilarious) on Uncyclopaedia. I don't think I finished reading them; I couldn't take any more hysterics sat at work on my lunch hour My sig is part of the Mellotron entry.

I hope the music lives up to the writing... See you soon.

[Lost_Highway]

hehe entertaining write up. A "mystical prog/metal" vibe going on here.

Thanks!

Heaps of detail (stunning)

Wow, thanks again . Collectively, the details have probably taken up a disproportionate amount of time to get right, but then I think that if they are done right they can add a disproportionate amount to the sound, punching above their weight. Layering 8 second Tron FX water sounds was a bit of a pain in the arse, as was programming a passable sounding harp gliss. Mind you, hand crafting drum parts a bar at a time, so every one is different, is a ballsache too!

strange time sig and you make it flow well.

I've had fun shaking things up with the time signatures, which are all over the place, there literally isn't a single bar of 4/4 (though there is some 8/8 and some 8/4 I didn't realise was there ).

The first bit is mainly 8/4 and 8/8 with bars of 12/8 and 6/8 chucked in here and there.

Part 2 goes [(7/4, 6/4) x 2, 7/4, 9/4] x 2

Part 3 is in 13/8 and I'm very pleased with the way it's worked out, flowing nicely with a bit of a bounce to it.

Par 4 is in 8 time and varies between 3, 4, 6 and 8, most being 3/8 or 4/8.

Getting it to flow is always a worry, so that it doesn't end up sounding like a shotgun marriage of disparate musical ideas. Someone else somewhere else also said it had the element of surprise but flowed well, so I'm pleased.

It's a good arrangement, but I do feel like it ends at a point where you really need to crack on with a GTFO heavy bit. It doesn't NEED it per se, but it would work imo.

Parts 2 and 4 are probably about as heavy as I get . I'm not into prog metal, mainly symphonic but I do like a few bits of heavy prog; think Red-era Crimson (which it could be argued is proto-prog metal rather than a cross between prog and hard rock which is pretty much the definition of heavy prog) and the multitude of bands that are based in that style, like Anekdoten, Morte Macabre, Liquid Scarlet etc.

I must admit I misread the acronym and thought you were talking about Yes , that's not an album I have. The sort of sound I have in mind is the likes of Änglagård, Sinkadus, Wobbler and Scandinavian symph bands like that.

The woodwindy isntrument at 3:30 would do well with a bit of articulation, little breathy moments or slides etc to make it sound a bit more natural.

That "woodwindy instrument" is my actual, real flute playing godsdamnit! Shite, isn't it?

You can't have any more articulation because I can't play any better than that How I ever got Grade 7 I'll never know and a dozen or more years of not practising hasn't helped either. I've been trying to work on my tone a bit lately but I don't practise anywhere near often enough (nowt new there then!) and I never did develop any vibrato.

That's also my flute playing at 1:36, 1:43, 2:00 and 2:06 -- it's perfect, buried in the mix where it can't really be heard

The bass could be a bit deeper or louder too (after the timpani), to help with the track's spectrum dynamics.

I've tended to err on the side of caution with bass, especially as I don't have a sub. I've tried to go for "you'd miss it if it weren't there, but not so prominent that you'd notice it unless you were specifically listening out for it". I might experiment with bringing it up a little.

The mix is great, quite clear and a nice volume during the action. (hehe, the subtle bass probably helps here)

Thanks. I'm pleased with the mix, but always long for it to be clearer and with better separation. I'm probably leave it as it is for the time being, but perhaps in future I need to experiment with the technique of carving out one unique, non-overlapping freq for each instrument thing, or whatever the correct technical term for it is.

ty for teh epicness.

Yes, I shall definitely try going for The One

But don't hold your breath, I work at the speed of a snail on Mogadon...

[TankEyes]

Snail on mogadon!

Your Flute! A dozen years! Haha man - don't listen to me, I don't even know how to hold one... You've voiced your thinking behind your decisions well, so I'm much more partial to agree that the tune is all but finished.

I might have to explore some of the influences you've mentioned - all new names to me.

Can you tell us more about how you recorded and processed the guitars and flute in this track? Is that a steel guitar? And the "vinyl strings"?

[Lost_Highway]

Snail on mogadon!

Your Flute! A dozen years! Haha man - don't listen to me, I don't even know how to hold one... You've voiced your thinking behind your decisions well, so I'm much more partial to agree that the tune is all but finished.

I might have to explore some of the influences you've mentioned - all new names to me.

Can you tell us more about how you recorded and processed the guitars and flute in this track? Is that a steel guitar? And the "vinyl strings"?

No worries, I'll reply at length in a bit -- I don't want to sound like I'm boasting, but I've had a reasonable amount of very positive feedback on a Linux mailing list as well and it's all getting a bit overwhelming

Regarding the flute, what I meant to say was a dozen or more years of never actually picking it up and playing it at all, never mind practising.

Regarding the guitar: which guitar parts did you have in mind -- the acoustic (right at the beginning and all the way through Part 3) or the electric in Part 2? (There's a small amount of electric well buried in the mix in Part 4 too.) Or both?

And what do you mean by the "vinyl strings", can you give me a time reference?

[TankEyes]

Both Guitars! and the strings @ 1:00 have a kinda "vinyl record sample" quality to em, don't you think? Or is it not strings at all?

[Lost_Highway]

Both Guitars! and the strings @ 1:00 have a kinda "vinyl record sample" quality to em, don't you think? Or is it not strings at all?

Thanks Tank Good job I asked as I thought you probably had an entirely different strings part in mind.

Okay, guitars first, easiest one first.

Electric guitar
The electric guitar is my Gibson Les Paul Studio I think. I know I started off on my Blueshawk but I either couldn't get quite the tone I was after or was struggling with the 'Hawk's slightly longer scalelength (Fender length) to be able to play it cleanly enough. I think in the end I opted for the LP. I really oughta make better notes when recording

It's played through a Marshall JCM2000, I would guess on the crunch channel. Recorded with an SE Electronics SE2200A condenser, I think somewhere near halfway along the radius of the cone, pretty close-miked (couple of inches max), through a Focusrite TwinTrak Pro (no compression).

All processing is with Linux-native LADSPA plugins. High-passed at 100 Hz. Reasonable degree of compression, about 6 dB gain reduction, 2.5 ms attach, 55 ms release, 4.5:1. Bit of EQ -- 3 dB out around 500 Hz, a couple up around 3 kHz and a broad hump around 5.6 kHz. Finally, a saturator type plugin emulating tape distortion, to give it a bit more of an upfront, in-your-face character.

Acoustic guitars
Part 1
The 6-string is my Freshman FA300JEM -- it's a beautiful superjumbo, single-cut in a natural finish (not glossily varnished) with a Fishman pick-up. It was recorded simultaneously with the SE200A and the pickup. The pick-up doesn't sound great, a bit flat and lifeless, but it adds a bit of body to the sound and by panning the two tracks slightly apart it made the guitar sound a bit bigger and hence nearer -- I wanted it to be fairly quiet but very close-by sounding. Not quite sure where I miked it -- again, must. Make. Better. Notes.

Both tracks highpassed at 50 Hz. Very mild compression just to tame a few peaks and make it a bit more consistent sounding, identical compression on both tracks. Saturator again, for the same reason as above. Different EQ on the two tracks: bit of a boost at 245/228 Hz; a large suck at 546 on the mic, 577 and a smaller one at 533 on the line-in; huge peaks around 10 kHz, broad and high.

Part 3
Okay, the section driven by acoustic guitar. Recorded in the same way, mic and pick-up, there are two parts. There are also three 12-string parts, which were mic only as it has no pick-up (the guitar is a Freshman FA1DC12).

Each pair of 6-string tracks again were panned slightly apart for size and sent to a buss so the same effects are applied to both mic and pick-up. High-passed at 100 Hz. Much stronger compression -- the playing was a bit more variable and needed to be much more consistent in level: low ratio (3:1) but much lower threshold, attack around 12 ms. Lots sucked out around 500 Hz, lots boosted very high up, a few tweaks in the middle. Saturator again.

The two 6-string busses were in turn sent to a single buss where they were thrust outwards with mid/side processing to widen the stereo spectrum of the track and also makes them sound like they're sat right at the side of you.

The 12-string tracks were individually processed with similar plugin settings to the 6-string ones. Two of the tracks were the same parts as the 6-string, but panned to the other side (with a tad of delay to push them back a little). The third is a lower harmony part panned centrally. I've just listened to all the parts soloed together and they sound well cool, albeit with very dodgy timing Sod it, here's an MP3 of it.

Tank's "vinyl strings"
The strings at the 1. 00 mark are "Mk II Vintage Violins" from M-Tron (with the tone backed off quite a way) i.e. it's the Three Violins sound on a Mk II Mellotron recorded using a vintage mic IIRC. Tron cello comes in a second or two later as well. I see what you mean now about vinyl sounded -- the wonderful bandwidth (or lack of) of the Tron's tape system!

The strings are the very first instrument that comes in. At that point a number of automated changes occur:
(a) the volume comes up a lot
(b) the wet/dry ratio on a stereo chorus/flanger is automated to 100% dry (I was using the chorus to push it way back in the mix and make it hard to pin down location-wise)
(c) the bandwidth of a bandpass filter increases from ~2300 Hz to 20 kHz (again, the filter's job is to make the strings sound much more distant)
(d) the strings were sent to a buss with an L/C/R delay to make them sound wider and less spatially distinct early on; the fader on this buss comes right down to leave just the dry sound panned fairly narrowly around the centre

I hope this helps. If you've any more questions, please, feel free to keep them to yourself No, seriously, just ask if there's owt more you want to know.

[TankEyes]

You mentioned the M-Tron in your post + your signature, I should have known. I can hear the strings waiting in the background for their big moment now I dig the way you've used FX as well as volume to alter it's position in the mix-space. Good tip there.

You're a fan of tape's dynamic presence gain I see. I was reading an article the other day that explained how a tape recording gently compresses the signal by different amounts through the spectrum (as well as adding harmonics). I found that fascinating. Reminds me a bit of Voxengo's Soniformer.

The 12 string harmonies are beautiful man. When you're pan-multi-tracking fuzzy timing can be a blessing instead of a curse

Thanks for sharing your techniques with us. Especially your insight into getting the close proximity clean sounding guitars. I'm usually much less subtle with my dance synths - chuck some high boost on it a compress it to all hell. But I'm getting there.. slowly.

[duncanparsons]

Just realised I never came back to say thank you!

Thank you! This is a really nice bit of music, and captures something of the feel of those old LPs

*hat off*

DSP

[Lost_Highway]

Hi Duncan

Thanks for listening and many thanks for taking the trouble to comment, no matter how belatedly - that's really made my day, glad you enjoyed it

Sadly, I'm not making any further progress with the piece at the moment. I've ended up teaming up with a German prog musician from the Linux Audio mailing list I follow - he commented on the track there and we got talking... We're working on an abandoned project of his now and having great fun. Actually, it's possibly a good thing to take a bit of a break from the piece.

Anyway, thanks again for commenting * doffs flat cap in return *