Something like FL sytrus?

[glokraw]

The whole preset management system is poor anyway (esp if you don't have the Fruity version)

In contrast, I find Rhino's preset management brilliantly thought out.

There ought to be a standard developed for preset management for all soft synths. An online petition is in order, me thinks.

a dozen thicknecks with rented tazers and nightsticks would be needed to enforce a standard

[himalaya]

The whole preset management system is poor anyway (esp if you don't have the Fruity version)

In contrast, I find Rhino's preset management brilliantly thought out.

It's OK but I never use the library aspect - too much work (when you have hundreds of 3rd party presets) to drag everything over to categorise it when it really should be pre sorted but people making the presets.

Rhino sounds much nicer than Sytrus though and at least has a human sized gui instead of one designed for mice.

Actually, it is a fair point. However, as far as I remember this is the way Rhino is designed. I mean, there is no way to have presets fall automatically into sound categories ? Or is there ?

[himalaya]

The whole preset management system is poor anyway (esp if you don't have the Fruity version)

In contrast, I find Rhino's preset management brilliantly thought out.

There ought to be a standard developed for preset management for all soft synths. An online petition is in order, me thinks.

a dozen thicknecks with rented tazers and nightsticks would be needed to enforce a standard

I know!

But it is so needed, in my opinion. There are still soft synths which use one of the worst possible preset browsing systems ever designd: a long thin list that needs to be scrolled down.

[aMUSEd]

The whole preset management system is poor anyway (esp if you don't have the Fruity version)

In contrast, I find Rhino's preset management brilliantly thought out.

There ought to be a standard developed for preset management for all soft synths. An online petition is in order, me thinks.

a dozen thicknecks with rented tazers and nightsticks would be needed to enforce a standard

I know!

But it is so needed, in my opinion. There are still soft synths which use one of the worst possible preset browsing systems ever designd: a long thin list that needs to be scrolled down.

Well Sytrus can at least have a nested list but it's broken and has been for ages:

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... sc&start=0

imho everyone should use a Kore compatible system. Even with Rhino instead of using the built in librarian I just import everything into Kore to manage.

[himalaya]

I've just checked in Rhino (it's been a while since I used it) and even the factory presets don't fall into the library sound categories. So, I venture a guess, it is not the sound designer's fault that presets don't fall into sound categories, but the way Rhino's library is designed. If so, it is definitely something that can be improved.

But in all other respects, I love Rhino's preset browser. I can see the whole bank on the left, the library sound categories on the right. All presets are fully accessible for renaming, deleting, etc. I can add folders right in the browser...etc. This point is, it is all done right within Rhino, without having to mess about with opening extra windows, or having to access Windows Explorer (this is a huge 'no no' for me). There are synths released in 2009 that don't allow me to rename or delete presets in their own browser! Grrr!

I haven't used the Kore system, perhaps it is something I would need to invest in.

[aMUSEd]

But in all other respects, I love Rhino's preset browser. I can see the whole bank on the left, the library sound categories on the right. All presets are fully accessible for renaming, deleting, etc. I can add folders right in the browser...etc. This point is, it is all done right within Rhino, without having to mess about with opening extra windows, or having to access Windows Explorer (this is a huge 'no no' for me). There are synths released in 2009 that don't allow me to rename or delete presets in their own browser! Grrr!

Yes that is great. Also that it can do this while remaining compatible with basic VST preset standards (too many devs go the route of developing their own - which then causes me problems importing them into Kore).

My point about the library aspect though is no-one is using it. It wasn't used for the factory presets or any of the third party addons and by the time you have accumulated a few of those it would take too long to set up anyway so imho it's pretty redundant.

[himalaya]

Yep. You have a point. Big Tick we are after ya with a request !

Another improvement is tagging each preset with a a few descriptive words like:
Pad - bright, smooth, VA
Pad - dark, vocal, choir
Pad - rhythmic, glassy, additive

Rhino has a keyword mode, but it looks for sound category names only. Not the 'mood' or any other description.

This should be part of each synth ! In Rhino there is some blank space below the preset comments window. Let's have a search feature there.

Anyway, sorry for hijacking the thread.

[Sequent]

I think creating and enforcing some sort of standard across all the developers would be a bit of a nightmare at this point. It should have been thought of when the vst standard was being created. There is also the worry that such a thing might be too subjective and maybe too restrictive... too close maybe to the gm thing? Which kind of has a 'bad taste' for many people, doesn't it?

Anyway, I think Rhino is definitely a great alternative. Well... Rhino came first before Sytrus anyway, didn't it!

I think the main focus for Tick now is to make Rhino cross platform. Being a PC user on the music side... I really don't care, ha! But... at the same time, I think it will be great to see this synth natively opened to the Mac community. Maybe it will bring in some extra sales for Tick too. The more users, the merrier, I say. Also, I want to see this synth stay around for a while and continue to be supported. I'll be interested to see what BT has up his sleeve beyond the Mac compatibility!

In terms of setting up some sort of patch categorization standard - at least within Rhino. That can have some sort of usefulness. At least there can be a set of loose standards like pad, organ, brass, string, seq... maybe something like motion pad, etc. I don't know. I haven't really thought about it enough to say these are the categories we need. Just that it's something that could be very useful. Too, I think that that's the kind of thing that could probably use the input of the master programmers like Daniel and Himalaya. Having created as many commercial banks as you guys have, I'm sure you've seen certain patterns begin to emerge.

As far as the original gist of this thread... I DO think that Rhino is something to look at if you're looking for a close alternative to Sytrus.

Should we reply now to the other Sytrus thread that Reflected started in the "Line Plug" forum?

[zerocrossing]

Here's a funny story. I probably shouldn't admit it, but I once came here and asked, "I want to replace my Virus C..." and one of the first answers I got was "Sytrus."

While it's resemblance to any Access product is highly questionable at best, I tried the demo and loved the sound. Is it without flaws? Nope. Is it aggressively developed? Not really.

But it sounds great. I bought it almost immediately, probably with the proceeds of the Virus C. Of course drunk with the power of a full paypal account the other "usual suspects" were purchased as well. Sylenth1, KLC1, etc. I never found Bit Tick to do the trick for me. Not bad but I just never took to it like I did other instruments.

So that's my response. No one VST is ever going to be everything to everyone. Each has strengths and weaknesses. Learning what they are and what instrument to go to for a desired result is part of the fun. I'd love to see another Sytrus but I'm not going to cry about it or hold my breath for it. The garden's got a lot of well fruited trees in it. Pick the ones you find tasty.

[Reflected]

I found something that got tons of improvments since the last time I were using it ^^

Thanks for the responses...

[Caine123]

[jens]

I've tried Rhino long time ago...maybe I will check it again to see if there are new updates...

EDIT: http://bigtick.pastnotecut.org/index.php?action=NEWS

What's new
29/05/2006 : Rhino 2.04 update
The long-awaited Rhino update is finally here. This version adds many more effects, dual morphing waveshapers in the filter section, improved performance, sound quality and usability enhancements.

more ?

there will be a significant update for Rhino within the next few days or weeks.

[LeVzi]

No one VST is ever going to be everything to everyone. Each has strengths and weaknesses. Learning what they are and what instrument to go to for a desired result is part of the fun.

QFT

Hence why I am looking at a set of synths atm.

But regards the OP, why does a synth need regular updates if it works ? As far as I can tell Sytrus works, but then I use 1 preset, it's called default, and thats the only one I use. So if there is a problem with the preset manager, then i've no clue about that.