headquest wrote:after being quite negative about Record since the beta testing time, I have finally given in and ordered it.
I'm surprised... You don't find Record cluttered anymore?Record: New DAW from Propellerheads
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- KVRist
- 282 posts since 11 Jul, 2005 from The Netherlands
I'm surprised... You don't find Record cluttered anymore?-
- KVRAF
- 7489 posts since 6 Jul, 2004
I may well doruud07 wrote:headquest wrote:after being quite negative about Record since the beta testing time, I have finally given in and ordered it.
The reason I'm getting it is because I've been housekeeping old projects and basically realised most of my vaguely inspired moments have involved Reason. I'm buying Record so that when I use Reason I can take projects over to Record should I wish to - for me its Reason 5, no more, no less. I certainly don't see it replacing Cubase any time soon!
The biggest thing I dislike in Reason is the mixer, and Record provides perhaps the best mixer around. Plus multicore support and some other bits. There's parts of it I definitely wish they had done differently, such as the general ergonomics of three windows... But there are some benefits which may outweigh those things. We'll see. Maybe I'll be selling it in the marketplace in a few months time
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- KVRist
- 282 posts since 11 Jul, 2005 from The Netherlands
The mixer in Record sure is one of the best improvements for Reason users. For me personally the On Screen Piano Keys (Computer Keys) is a nice feature. And you will soon be used to hitting the F5, F6 and F7 keys to change between windows.headquest wrote:I may well doruud07 wrote:headquest wrote:after being quite negative about Record since the beta testing time, I have finally given in and ordered it.
The reason I'm getting it is because I've been housekeeping old projects and basically realised most of my vaguely inspired moments have involved Reason. I'm buying Record so that when I use Reason I can take projects over to Record should I wish to - for me its Reason 5, no more, no less. I certainly don't see it replacing Cubase any time soon!
The biggest thing I dislike in Reason is the mixer, and Record provides perhaps the best mixer around. Plus multicore support and some other bits. There's parts of it I definitely wish they had done differently, such as the general ergonomics of three windows... But there are some benefits which may outweigh those things. We'll see. Maybe I'll be selling it in the marketplace in a few months time
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- KVRAF
- 7489 posts since 6 Jul, 2004
I'm sure I will, yes. The default view of all three elements squashed together is surely one of the most pointless and confusing GUIs ever. But once seperated they are fine... I'm guessing that I'll stay in the sequencer window for composing, the rack for sound design, and the mixer for mixing...ruud07 wrote:The mixer in Record sure is one of the best improvements for Reason users. For me personally the On Screen Piano Keys (Computer Keys) is a nice feature. And you will soon be used to hitting the F5, F6 and F7 keys to change between windows.headquest wrote:I may well doruud07 wrote:headquest wrote:after being quite negative about Record since the beta testing time, I have finally given in and ordered it.
The reason I'm getting it is because I've been housekeeping old projects and basically realised most of my vaguely inspired moments have involved Reason. I'm buying Record so that when I use Reason I can take projects over to Record should I wish to - for me its Reason 5, no more, no less. I certainly don't see it replacing Cubase any time soon!
The biggest thing I dislike in Reason is the mixer, and Record provides perhaps the best mixer around. Plus multicore support and some other bits. There's parts of it I definitely wish they had done differently, such as the general ergonomics of three windows... But there are some benefits which may outweigh those things. We'll see. Maybe I'll be selling it in the marketplace in a few months time
...I guess time will tell whether I get used to the workflow or not, but it does seem worth having Record as a Reason update. Some people who's views I respect a lot seem to have adjusted to it and love its workflow, so I think my initial negative impression is clearly not the only view: however much I thought the workflow in Record sucked during the beta testing, it is clear from the comments of its users that once it clicks into place it is great in use. Obviously I hope so...
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- KVRAF
- 3374 posts since 2 Oct, 2004
Guys what's wrong with the 16 channel Reason mixer? It's constantly under attack on various music forums. With many posters advising people to bypass the mixer entirely and rewire the outputs to another DAW. But I've never really understood why. It sounds pretty clear and transparent to me?
Orion Platinum, Muzys 2
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- KVRist
- 282 posts since 11 Jul, 2005 from The Netherlands
The problem is that the 16 channel Reason mixer only has 14 channelsv1o wrote:Guys what's wrong with the 16 channel Reason mixer? It's constantly under attack on various music forums. With many posters advising people to bypass the mixer entirely and rewire the outputs to another DAW. But I've never really understood why. It sounds pretty clear and transparent to me?
There is nothing wrong with the Reason mixer, it's okay. But the mixer in Record is awesome (infinite channels, lots of possibilities per channel).
I only would rewire the outputs from Reason to another DAW for external mixing purposes.
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- KVRAF
- 7489 posts since 6 Jul, 2004
They say that some beauties take time to reveal their charms... but I just can't believe how wrong I was about this one initially (I guess that the timing of the release was just wrong for me, coming hot on the heels of me buying Cubase 5). Whatever Record's shortcomings - and I've mentioned a few! - two days since receiving my copy and I feel more inspired to make music than I have done in months. So all I can do is to eat my words!
I was concerned during earlier testing about the CPU hit, but the Props certainly nailed that. The track counts possible are very impressive indeed, as is the rock-solid stability. And in those senses, this really is "Recording Done Right". The CPU efficiency - and the truly awesome timestretching - make my previous scratchpad Ableton Live look pretty stupid in direct comparisson. And having the Reason rack integrated right there gives Record a level of power that you won't find in other music software, which definitely compensates for the obvious things that Record won't do.
Certainly Record is not about to replace Cubase - which I still think is absolutely the way to go for a full-on DAW host - but Ableton is going - going - gone (anyone fancy buying Live 7 Suite download edition?)...
Record/Reason absolutely rocks.
I was concerned during earlier testing about the CPU hit, but the Props certainly nailed that. The track counts possible are very impressive indeed, as is the rock-solid stability. And in those senses, this really is "Recording Done Right". The CPU efficiency - and the truly awesome timestretching - make my previous scratchpad Ableton Live look pretty stupid in direct comparisson. And having the Reason rack integrated right there gives Record a level of power that you won't find in other music software, which definitely compensates for the obvious things that Record won't do.
Certainly Record is not about to replace Cubase - which I still think is absolutely the way to go for a full-on DAW host - but Ableton is going - going - gone (anyone fancy buying Live 7 Suite download edition?)...
Record/Reason absolutely rocks.
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- KVRian
- 1110 posts since 30 Jan, 2004 from UK
Record named as Music Radar DAW of the year;
http://www.musicradar.com/news/tech/in- ... /5#content
http://www.musicradar.com/news/tech/in- ... /5#content
Given its reluctance to refer to Record as a DAW, Propellerhead might not want this award, but it's getting it anyway
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- KVRist
- 288 posts since 18 Jul, 2005 from Somewhere
I watched all the Record-bashing going on in the internet, it wasn't until i tried it i was blown away with what it could do. The mixer is astounding, i can shape sounds to the way i want them very quickly, and at-a-glance it works very well.
With asio4all and virtual audio cable, you can route audio to/from any other application, and use a virtual midi port to sync record to another host.
I've found myself just hitting record in Record, and playing some sounds in another app (or external hardware) and it works very well.
The bass/guitar amps are pretty good as well, not much of a selection of cabs but you can expand those easily by getting other software by line 6 (just got pod farm platinum)
This really has poopooed max for live for me, i'm totally addicted to Record for now, maybe this is only a honeymoon period, but if they release 1.1 (or 1.5) and it has a load of other cool stuff built-in it will blow the competition away no problem.
Reason 5 is on its way with a load of cool new stuff as well, so its bonus time when that comes about as well.
What did it for me:
F4 - keyboard control (yes!!)
Audio Recording (yip)
The limitless width/height racks
The Mixer (OHMYG)
Comp Editor (take slices of audio from multiple takes to get the result you want)
Line 6 integration
Licensing (believe it or not, i would rather buy a dongled/internet protected product than see it on the net cracked after i bought it - i believe in buying software)
All the cool reason devices which are now useable within a cool new environment.
Ok i will shut up now
With asio4all and virtual audio cable, you can route audio to/from any other application, and use a virtual midi port to sync record to another host.
I've found myself just hitting record in Record, and playing some sounds in another app (or external hardware) and it works very well.
The bass/guitar amps are pretty good as well, not much of a selection of cabs but you can expand those easily by getting other software by line 6 (just got pod farm platinum)
This really has poopooed max for live for me, i'm totally addicted to Record for now, maybe this is only a honeymoon period, but if they release 1.1 (or 1.5) and it has a load of other cool stuff built-in it will blow the competition away no problem.
Reason 5 is on its way with a load of cool new stuff as well, so its bonus time when that comes about as well.
What did it for me:
F4 - keyboard control (yes!!)
Audio Recording (yip)
The limitless width/height racks
The Mixer (OHMYG)
Comp Editor (take slices of audio from multiple takes to get the result you want)
Line 6 integration
Licensing (believe it or not, i would rather buy a dongled/internet protected product than see it on the net cracked after i bought it - i believe in buying software)
All the cool reason devices which are now useable within a cool new environment.
Ok i will shut up now
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- KVRAF
- 8519 posts since 7 Apr, 2003
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- KVRist
- 408 posts since 17 Mar, 2005 from Cumbria, England
If they made the synths sound better* and gave it midi out I would consider it. But until then I'll keep going with Live and VSTi.
* Aliasing, Thors weird filter behaviour, slewing of virtual CVs.
* Aliasing, Thors weird filter behaviour, slewing of virtual CVs.
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- KVRAF
- 7489 posts since 6 Jul, 2004
I'm kinda done with Live. v8 has been a huge disappointment - I've had it in the shopping basket on their site for months, but no way am I paying Euro 199 to upgrade from 7 Suite to 8 Suite, which is what they want, even with 20% discount! That really is plain greedy, and quite out of touch with the market as it now is. Also, there's the potential cost of Max4Live if I wanted to be a die-hard: another Euro 249. Oh, and I could always pick up a Launchpad for another 150, or perhaps an APC for 400...
Combined with the massive high cost of staying up to date with Ableton and its "partners" there's the point that v8 has been by far the most buggy major software release of recent years (perhaps since Tracktion 3). After a dozen or so point updates, there are still people for whom it just doesn't work well. And Max4Live seems to be in the same boat.
When I bought Live 2 it was awesome, and remained rock solid for me through versions 4 to 6. With 7 it began to feel a bit bloated, less inspiring, and less stable too. Ableton built their reputation on developing a rock solid reliable software that musicians can trust even on stage in front of a big crowd. It seems to me they have become a bit too enamoured with the big time, while Live has become bloated, buggy as hell, and overpriced. And the high CPU ...
One thing that really impresses me with Record is just how rock solid it is - and such a low CPU hit too. Whatever its shortcomings and disadvantages, Propellerhead have really pulled a rabbit out of a hat here and given us something we can really rely on to just work. In terms of cost too, they stand as a real contrast to Ableton now - a major new product that took 5 years + to develop... and I bought it for less than £100! Amazing value...
As for aliasing synths etc, if you use any hardware and record audio, check out the audio mix engine in Record, using its brand new mixer... compare that to the audio "quality" in Ableton. Try the timestretch... everything just sounds much better in Record because the mixer effects are superb and the timestretch is ground-breaking, significantly raising the bar compared to any alternatives I have heard in a DAW.
Combined with the massive high cost of staying up to date with Ableton and its "partners" there's the point that v8 has been by far the most buggy major software release of recent years (perhaps since Tracktion 3). After a dozen or so point updates, there are still people for whom it just doesn't work well. And Max4Live seems to be in the same boat.
When I bought Live 2 it was awesome, and remained rock solid for me through versions 4 to 6. With 7 it began to feel a bit bloated, less inspiring, and less stable too. Ableton built their reputation on developing a rock solid reliable software that musicians can trust even on stage in front of a big crowd. It seems to me they have become a bit too enamoured with the big time, while Live has become bloated, buggy as hell, and overpriced. And the high CPU ...
One thing that really impresses me with Record is just how rock solid it is - and such a low CPU hit too. Whatever its shortcomings and disadvantages, Propellerhead have really pulled a rabbit out of a hat here and given us something we can really rely on to just work. In terms of cost too, they stand as a real contrast to Ableton now - a major new product that took 5 years + to develop... and I bought it for less than £100! Amazing value...
As for aliasing synths etc, if you use any hardware and record audio, check out the audio mix engine in Record, using its brand new mixer... compare that to the audio "quality" in Ableton. Try the timestretch... everything just sounds much better in Record because the mixer effects are superb and the timestretch is ground-breaking, significantly raising the bar compared to any alternatives I have heard in a DAW.
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- KVRist
- 408 posts since 17 Mar, 2005 from Cumbria, England
I know what you're saying here. If you remember it was you who recommended me to jump to Live when we had all that bother with T2 all those years ago. I went in at Live 5 and I was dead impressed - excepting the ruddy midi editor and Live's midi timing which I had hoped would improve, which it hasn't.headquest wrote:I'm kinda done with Live.
But I have flirted with other DAW software over the last few years. The one I liked the most was Podium but then I'd have to buy a decent sampler like Kontakt and whole raft of new VST FX. And in the end I get the job done in Live so I am trying not to be too seduced by the greener grass on the other side.
And yes Live's updates aren't terribly cheap. Thankfully, the last update for me was sort of free as I managed to sell Live 7 before the announcement when I moved briefly to Sonar 7PE, and then once I realised I hated Sonar with a passion, I bought a cheap licence for Live 2 and upgraded to 7 with a free 8. Fortunately, 8.0.9 is running well on my new i5.
I hear what you say, but without midi out I am kind of stuffed.headquest wrote:if you use any hardware and record audio, check out the audio mix engine in Record, using its brand new mixer... compare that to the audio "quality" in Ableton.