Apple was right, Adobe get over it?

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whyterabbyt wrote:
xh3rv wrote:And to reiterate a point I really want to emphasize, I think people have long accepted hardware conflicts on PCs, but I just don't see people being that tolerant of hardware conflicts on phones. It's a phone, it should make calls and not require a whole lot of maintenance.
The iPhone is a phone. The iPod and iPad arent. They're 'mobile devices'. And Apple have already put them in the some sort of frame of mind of being something that gets OS updates and application installations and suchlike, just like their computer. The culture is that its a device you do maintain, unlike the 'non-smart' mobile phone model. Hell, it even mandates a certain amount of 'maintenance' on your 'real' computer in that you may need to even keep iTunes up to date...
I read one article the other day that made a lot of sense. The author said that devices need to become simpler, not more complicated. They need to do less things and do them very well, not many things but not very well or in need of a lot of knowledge.

The iPad is not a device to replace a PC. It's a device for people who want to do a certain task without having to go through a struggle to make it work properly. And if you think the other devices work properly already and people have no problems with them, you are very wrong. Go to any tech support line and see for yourself. You may all be tech-minded and good at getting this machines going, but most people aren't. And the last thing they want is to fight a platform or hardware.

People are trying to judge the iPad as a personal computer as we know it, but there is no one-to-one comparison possible. It's a new sort of device and people are clearly having problems grasping it.
Last edited by spaceman on Wed Apr 14, 2010 12:35 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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whyterabbyt wrote: The iPhone is a phone. The iPod and iPad arent. They're 'mobile devices'. And Apple have already put them in the some sort of frame of mind of being something that gets OS updates and application installations and suchlike, just like their computer. The culture is that its a device you do maintain, unlike the 'non-smart' mobile phone model. Hell, it even mandates a certain amount of 'maintenance' on your 'real' computer in that you may need to even keep iTunes up to date...
I literally have not spent more than 10 minutes (cumulative) dealing with any kind of software update for my iPod over 6 or 7 years. I have never heard anyone ever complain about integration with iPods or iPhones (who knows with the weeks-old iPads).

I'm not sure I've spent much more time on iTunes, either. Other than than the 10.x updates, OS X has a brilliantly smooth framework for updating it's core software, it's literally the second menu item (right under 'about this computer') and it's just, click yes to upgrade, no to wait, then reboot. Never more complicated than that.

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xh3rv wrote:Here's an interesting chart:

Image
I don't know what to make of this. By that I mean it doesn't say anything as to what satisfaction means, what the criteria of the survey were and what the issues might be. The iPhone rating is not surprising given the number of generations, the huge (but not necessarily useful) number of apps and the overall mentality of Apple customers. As for the others, a lack of satisfaction might be the feeling that there aren't enough apps or certain features, or that network availability is an issue (but not a fault with the phone itself). And it doesn't tell us what the degree of "dissatisfaction" is and why. I don't even know who paid for this "survey."
We escape the trap of our own subjectivity by
perceiving neither black nor white but shades of grey

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xh3rv wrote: I think people have long accepted hardware conflicts on PCs, but I just don't see people being that tolerant of hardware conflicts on phones. It's a phone, it should make calls and not require a whole lot of maintenance.
I have yet to hear of a hardware conflict that does not allow you to make phone calls.

The chart is indeed very interesting. Satisfaction isn't all about the operating system. It even shows in the chart, that does not qualify phones by platform but rather by maker. Apple has always had high customer satisfaction because admittedly they make very nice products. But that's not really what is being discussed here. What I am claiming is that Android devices can overtake the iPhone over the next couple of years.

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spaceman wrote:The iPad is not a device to replace a PC. It's a device for people who want to do a certain task without having to go through a struggle to make it work properly. And if you think the other devices work properly already and people have no problems with them, you are very wrong. Go to any tech support line and see for yourself. You may all be tech-minded and good at getting this machines going, but most people aren't. And the last thing they want is to fight a platform or hardware.
Dont forget I work in a Mac-centric site. Problem with what you're saying is that is that we already get people turning up at our door with problems with getting iPhones or iPods to do what they want...
An idiot on Set Theory:
"In some cases there is an object called red that contains everything that is red. In much the same way a pot is a plate."

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TristezaOrange wrote:What I am claiming is that Android devices can overtake the iPhone over the next couple of years.
They certainly can, but looking at the track record of the companies involved (Google being the difficult one as they're so new to the game) they're going to have to start doing things very differently very soon. And Apple is not standing still in the meanwhile either.. as we know.

I can't think of any device comparable in form and function to an iPhone that works as well. HTC as a manufacturer is getting closer with their Android models but read the reviews.. they've got some things to sort out yet. But at least Android is a platform to potentially shame Apple's OS4.

And Microsoft, as always, seems to be on track of missing the mark by some margin with Phone 7. You'd expect them to at least give Apple the finger by including multi-tasking and copy/paste right from the start.

I'm not sure what Symbian is getting up to these days. Can't say I know of an iPhone/Android phone-like device based on Symbian.

And there's Palm of course. It's awfully quiet around Palm. I guess their latest offering isn't quite making the waves they expected.
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whyterabbyt wrote:
spaceman wrote:The iPad is not a device to replace a PC. It's a device for people who want to do a certain task without having to go through a struggle to make it work properly. And if you think the other devices work properly already and people have no problems with them, you are very wrong. Go to any tech support line and see for yourself. You may all be tech-minded and good at getting this machines going, but most people aren't. And the last thing they want is to fight a platform or hardware.
Dont forget I work in a Mac-centric site. Problem with what you're saying is that is that we already get people turning up at our door with problems with getting iPhones or iPods to do what they want...
Surely not to the same extend as there are problems with PC or other platforms? No one said it's fool-proof. The day a fool-proof platform is released we'll also have the perfect DAW. Not very likely.
My other host is Bruce Forsyth

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spaceman wrote:Surely not to the same extend as there are problems with PC or other platforms?
course not; there are a damn site more macs and pcs to have problems in the first place. ;)
An idiot on Set Theory:
"In some cases there is an object called red that contains everything that is red. In much the same way a pot is a plate."

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spaceman wrote:I can't think of any device comparable in form and function to an iPhone that works as well.
HTC's latest models (Legend and Desire) kill the iPhone in all aspects, except the number of available applications. The Desire is widely considered to be the best mobile phone available right now. The only thing needed now is more developers and apps, which is bound to happen in the following months. Hardware- and OS-wise, HTC and Google already surpassed the iPhone, and I doubt Apple can keep up without seriously breaking backwards compatibility.

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eduardo_b wrote:
xh3rv wrote:Here's an interesting chart:

Image
I don't know what to make of this. By that I mean it doesn't say anything as to what satisfaction means, what the criteria of the survey were and what the issues might be.
Hang on. I have no stake in this argument because i think that all those smart phone devices are the scourge of society, the downfall of humanity and basically for people with a severe Capt. Kirk fetish, but you're doing the EXACT same thing about that graph that you're accusing me of doing with the whole jam survey/video bs you were peddling in the past, ed. And this one seems more cut and dry, they asked people if they were satisfied with their cell phone. While I'm always interested in finding more particulars about these type of studies and I can agree that I'd like to see more data on this one too, I think you can draw a lot more conclusive data from that graph than you could from a very rambling video from a researcher telling you about conclusions drawn from what sounds like a flawed test, at least from someone that at least has basic statistics knowledge anyway.

jm2c
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Goratrix wrote:
spaceman wrote:I can't think of any device comparable in form and function to an iPhone that works as well.
HTC's latest models (Legend and Desire) kill the iPhone in all aspects, except the number of available applications. The Desire is widely considered to be the best mobile phone available right now. The only thing needed now is more developers and apps, which is bound to happen in the following months. Hardware- and OS-wise, HTC and Google already surpassed the iPhone, and I doubt Apple can keep up without seriously breaking backwards compatibility.
yes, I read the reviews. The Desire came out best, whereas the Legend apparently has horrible battery life. I don't understand your statement about Apple having to catch up and breaking backwards compatibility though.
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Deb, surely you know that jam and phones are very different animals and you can't make a comparison here because Apple customers are a separate species?

Don't you know anything?

Sheesh!

:hihi:

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robojam wrote:Deb, surely you know that jam and phones are very different animals and you can't make a comparison here because Apple customers are a separate species?

Don't you know anything?

Sheesh!

:hihi:
Oh right I forgot. All us customers that own Apple products are exactly the same. Gee, I better go get an iPhone and an Ipad so I can fit in with my people, even though I have no use for either device. :hihi:
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debra1rlo wrote:
robojam wrote:Deb, surely you know that jam and phones are very different animals and you can't make a comparison here because Apple customers are a separate species?

Don't you know anything?

Sheesh!

:hihi:
Oh right I forgot. All us customers that own Apple products are exactly the same. Gee, I better go get an iPhone and an Ipad so I can fit in with my people, even though I have no use for either device. :hihi:
Once you buy that first Apple device you suddenly become an 'Apple customer' and you you no longer have any identity of your own and you just blindly buy any Apple product that comes on the market.

I really regret buying an iPod years ago - I haven't been able to be counted among people who are giving true opinions in surveys ever since. :cry:

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Last edited by BLynx on Tue Aug 19, 2014 12:02 am, edited 1 time in total.

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