Your preferred method of copy protection? (poll)

[The Chase]

C/P v. iLok, i'd chose ilok. at least there are some useful benefits to using the dongle.

Like what? With C/R you do the two steps and the product is activated forever, never to be bothered by it again. Like a serial but more effective. With dongles you have potential problems. Broken dongles, crippled products (it was simply embarrassing for Steinberg when Cubase 3 benched faster when cracked because the dongle contained bits of the executable).

I'm not sure why serials win by a landslide. They may be the least intrusive but they offer little protection. Like airport security, it's more of a pisstake, inconveniencing the customer with little gain for anyone. C/R and dongles aren't exactly crack-proof but at least they take more than a googling to get past.

[djanthonyw]

With C/R you do the two steps and the product is activated forever, never to be bothered by it again.

...and when you need to authorize your software on a new computer (and the companies website is gone), what do you do?

[eduardo_b]

C/P v. iLok, i'd chose ilok. at least there are some useful benefits to using the dongle.

Like what? With C/R you do the two steps and the product is activated forever, never to be bothered by it again. Like a serial but more effective. With dongles you have potential problems. Broken dongles, crippled products (it was simply embarrassing for Steinberg when Cubase 3 benched faster when cracked because the dongle contained bits of the executable).

I'm not sure why serials win by a landslide. They may be the least intrusive but they offer little protection. Like airport security, it's more of a pisstake, inconveniencing the customer with little gain for anyone. C/R and dongles aren't exactly crack-proof but at least they take more than a googling to get past.

I would be completely surprised if there were any widespread agreement on one CP scheme. Everyone is mystified at the choices of others, proving why there will never be consensus on this topic. Never.

Did I mention never.

[The Chase]

With C/R you do the two steps and the product is activated forever, never to be bothered by it again.

...and when you need to authorize your software on a new computer (and the companies website is gone), what do you do?

I haven't had any trouble, except from Windows itself, in which case a simple phone call solves it. Nothing compared to a broken dongle.

[hibidy]

Never.

+1

[Compyfox]

C/R has two major disadvantages:
It's bound to your hardware, and mostly to your OS as well.
And... you need to be "online" ("Native Instruments" or "Line6" anyone?!).

So if yu switch HDDs or your OS, or have to roll back a backup, you have to reregister your stuff over and over again. In terms of IKM, you have do adjust yoursef as to why, since they think "three installs are enough".



License Keys have a great advantage of as to "simply install, done".
The disadvantage is clearly the hacking from third parties. While this might not be the case for certain tools (Rayzoon for example), along with iLok, it's the first hacked. On top of that, you have to store these licenses somewhere as well. If they get lost, it's like USB keys - you're screwed.



User embed has the advantage, that you don't have to insert anything.
The disadvantage lies on the side of the developers with taking care of the registration (also after updates). Also, if there is a bug in the program, it's sometimes hard to track down since "every copy is individual". Though yes, I do know that the registration bits are reserved and this particular copyprotection system is mostly trouble free. With emphasis on "mostly".



USB keys (dongles) have advantages and disadvantages:
I guess the majority is against USB keys, since people are turned off by the fact "you lose the key, you lost your licenses, buy them again" (which are the major issues while discussions). Another favourite vote against it is the fact that users use "laptops", and therefore only have a limited ammount of USB ports - which clearly improved over the years, you can store more licenses on the sticks, and they work like a charm on passive USB hubs - yet it's a "space" issue.

Yet another disadvantage might be the fact, that you (in case of the iLok) have to have a global account, and certain developers can simply say "product is now legacy, turn off the license", as it happened with certain plugins (Nomad Factory as example) already. I guess the most negative factor in the whole dongle discussion are the drivers. They are said that they clog the system, eat CPU cycles, etc.

But the main advantage of using USB keys is: plug it in, install your tools, get going. Pace/iLok already offer a 1-year "subscription" for lost/broken USB keys as well. I guess it's only a matter of time that Steinberg offers the same. Personally I'd however see a system for Laptop users, that "shrink" the USB keys like modern USB flash disks (so that they're only a stump). This way you don't accidentally break it off or loose it that easily (even though others might say different).



I'm surpriesed however that one form of copy protection wasn't mentioned yet. An old form actually that Propellerheads uses, also Steinberg back in the day.

I talk about "CD verification". What it does: while installation it checks if the CD is legit and existing, or if it's just some install files on the HDD (which refuses the install in this case). Propellerheads took it that far, that they asked for the Factory Banks CDs of Reason every time on launch (hence the "copy to HDD" trick), and in case of Rebirth, the CD needs to be constantly in the drive, else it won't even boot up.

While this system in itself is indeed cool, it has disadvantages as well:
First of all, if you use software that constantly needs the CD in the drive, and you only have ONE disk drive, you're screwed. Else you need to move on to virtual floppy drives, which then involves "grey area" activity. In case of Steinberg's Wavelab, it is even written in the Knowledge Base, that newer drives simply don't recognize the specific range on the CD anymore, that took care of the copy protection. So if you had a newer rig (including new drive) and you wanted to install Wavelab (sub version 6), you are basically screwed. Same if you wanted to update to WL6 (and now WL7). I'Ve also seen samplepacks (E-MU for Proteus X) that also install some sort of "virtual drivers" to make samples usable. Else the system simply blocks them.




You see, each system has it's benefits, and each has it's disadvantages.
Personally, since I don't have a mobile studio, I prefer the USB key way, even though I need drivers, and free USB slots. But it's so much more hassle free as to dig out a CD/USB key/printout of a key list and try to find out which tool uses which copy protection.


There is one exception however where I don't prefer it: AVID ProTools. Here, the "USB key" is the recording module, and I'm limited to "that" particular module rather than using my own.



So yeah... my .02c on that issue, maybe I opened some eyes for you and showed you that no copy protection is clearly superior.

[Resonator63]

Serial number keyfile is always easy.Embed/pre-rigister is fine too.
No dongles though No way dongles I hate dongles
Did I mention i'm not keen on dongles

[kritikon]

How in the bloody hell are people preferring dongles over C/R by a factor of 3:1

Easy. C/R is totally dependent on A) the goodwill of the company, and B) the company staying in business.

I don't want to change my PC every 3 months, but if I did, then I shouldn't be penalised by the C/R protection. Some companies only offer 3 installs. Some used to offer less. If the company goes tits up you're totally f****ed. What if I was like Ttoz, only with PCs - if I wanted a blue PC this month, then a pink Mac next month, then a purple PC in December? What if I upgrade every time a new processor comes out (some apparently do...) It's none of the s/w company's business, but they make it so with C/R. At least with almost every other form of protection, if a company goes tits up, you can carry on using the last version available on any new computer you choose, as long as you stay on that OS. Personally, I think C/R is quite insidious. I won't buy any s/w with it.

[Badge]

Suggestion:

I think it would be helpful if, in the plug-in listings under "Copy Protection" type, KvR were to adopt the following 2 main labels (followed by more specific detail under each). For example:

1. Non system or hardware-dependent: Serial or Key File (including embedded info but not linked to hardware)

2. System and/or hardware-dependent: Challenge-Response or Dongle (ILok/Synchrosoft/hardware or whatever else)

I think these (or similar) headings would help to make the c/p method clearer in some cases.

The current KvR c/p description system is not always clear and can even sometimes be misleading (albeit unintentionally). For example, Modartt's Pianteq plug-in is described on KvR as having "Key File" c/p. However, to me, "Key File" and "Serial" usually imply "non-system or hardware-dependent" (in that it is re-installable by the purchaser on any new or updated computer, a la Camel Audio, Cockos Reaper etc. without having to "re-authorize").

However, in this case, the "Key File" description on KvR does turn out to be misleading, as further investigation reveals that Modarrt's copy-protection for Pianoteq IS in fact a system-dependent type (i.e. Challenge/Response, which would need re-authorization by Modarrt if and when the user were to change his or her system).

[Jesse J]

I will never buy anything with a dongle. Never.

I've had 2 extremely bad experiences with dongles, one accidentally bent dongle that rendered the whole studio useless for over a week... and another one that required an extra 450km trip to get the forgotten dongle + drive back to the remote session, seven people waiting 5 hours for a dongle... Those two experiences alone are worth NEVER to buy anything with a dongle.

Copy protection is just like when buying a DVD vs. downloading a pirated movie. The pirates can immediately enjoy the movie, but the paying customer watches unskippable FBI warnings, trailers, more warnings and then after 20 minutes gets to the movie selection screen.

I pay for my software so I know I will get support, updates and that the development continues. I hope not to get punished for that with too much hassle with copy protections, because from what I understand, pirates don't have to fill in any registration forms...

[sauli]

Voted pre-registered, but it's really a tie between it and serial number/key file.

I don't see any reason why someone would vote for challenge / response or dongle, they are both very unsecure options for customers

C/r is mostly fine for big companies, but really not a good option for small players (Kjaerhus anyone?)

Dongle depends lot of companies.
If it breaks you propably have to pay for a new overpriced dongle, if you lose it you might have to buy all your expensive software again, which is really f**ked up considering that (at least here) insurance companies laugh at you if you want to get insurance for your dongled software licenses.

[Roger-S.]

For those, who refuse dongles:

1. My favorite example of a f**ing bad company)
ProTools: I saw several cases of crashed ProTools interfaces, mostly MBox. You'll have to buy another interface and/or you're unable to work on projects until it's back from service.

2. Logic: Almost worse. Your copy protection is the Mac. Ever needed service? You easily pay more for service than for a dongle and you're unable to work on projects until it's back from service.

3. I was using a software from a VJ company with challenge/response, but I only got three authorizations. There is one left and I don't dare to use it. After that I'd have to buy another licence of almnost 400 euros. Or I have to buy it, because I changed my hardware, maybe because I only changed the soundcard or added another hard disk. Did I mention that I will not buy another licence of this company?

By the way, IK Multimedia offers 5 authorizations. What happens after the fifth? There's no information of what to do after the fifth authorization. Or what to do if the company disappears. I use some of their software and I really like some of their products, but this...

4. Some companies offer registering their dongle-protected software at the company's webpage and you will be able to recover your licences. I helped some people out having trouble with their Steinberg licences at broken or burned dongles. I consider this a move into the right direction.

5. Serial number or keyfile is comfortable, but it's not sure for the company. Let's face it: A company needs to protect their investment. Cubase for example has 25 years now, I am sure, it would never had arrived to be that "Mature" without proper protection.

Seeing all this. I prefer to have a dongle as second best option to put it INSIDE my computer or a serial. But never (again) Mac-protected or interface-protected.

All the best

Roger

[midilance]

Honest musicians and engineers. Then you wouldn't need copy protection. The problem is us. I read a post somewhere that said "The only thing worse than a pirate is a musician pirate.

[hibidy]

copy protection shmappy protection, quit gripping and make some music!111one!!!'

There, does that solve the problem?

[ZINO]

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 96#4067296