KVR Audio

Caco · Post by **Caco** » Wed Jun 02, 2010 9:33 pm

V'ger wrote:Thx for the update, this is one nifty verb.

Still hoping it can modified so that it can be used freely in an insert chain, as now it will only through sound to some other plugs after it, others not.

I just tried this in Reaper and it is working fine for me. I added MVerb as an fx on an audio channel containing a drum loop and then added a few of Reaper's built in fx and everything worked as expected here. Anything else I should try to reproduce this?

V'ger · Post by **V'ger** » Wed Jun 02, 2010 11:01 pm

I have this bass track made up of several VSTi's but I want some dry and some wet so I stuck Xhip reverb in the middle and it works fine, but replacing that with Mverb there's no sound coming from the synths after that. The chain is like this:

Oatmeal
EVM Ultrasonique
IDJ 3-OSC
Xhip reverb
Ilbit
massTURBOtar

Here is the Reaper FX chain: http://www.box.net/shared/9yg5t9z6dz

thankyou · Post by **thankyou** » Thu Jun 03, 2010 4:23 pm

Bravo!

I love that you did this. I love that you shared the source code because I too have been curious about the dark arts!

thankyou · Post by **thankyou** » Thu Jun 03, 2010 4:26 pm

V'ger wrote:I have this bass track made up of several VSTi's but I want some dry and some wet so I stuck Xhip reverb in the middle and it works fine, but replacing that with Mverb there's no sound coming from the synths after that. The chain is like this:

Oatmeal
EVM Ultrasonique
IDJ 3-OSC
Xhip reverb
Ilbit
massTURBOtar

Here is the Reaper FX chain: http://www.box.net/shared/9yg5t9z6dz

this is because effects don't normally pass midi data through. its just not necessary or useful. easier to do routing. plus you get more control over your mix.
put Ilbit and massTURBOtar on their own track and route the midi to that track.

you just gave us an idea i think...
it would be really cool if mverb was the first reverb that responds to midi!
imagine, midi notes controlling the reverb algorithm in subtle to extreme ways!

V'ger · Post by **V'ger** » Fri Jun 04, 2010 6:39 pm

No that's the brilliant thing with Reaper, you can stack whatever you want on one track to keep things simple and configurable. Synth to effect to synth, whatever, and then change the order by dragging them higher or lower.

In rare cases synths won't pass sound through to the next in the chain, as do some effects like MVerb now which is a bit of a shame as it's so kind on the CPU that it can be used on all tracks individually as inserts.

thankyou · Post by **thankyou** » Sat Jun 05, 2010 12:54 am

V'ger wrote:No that's the brilliant thing with Reaper, you can stack whatever you want on one track to keep things simple and configurable. Synth to effect to synth, whatever, and then change the order by dragging them higher or lower.

agreed.

V'ger wrote:In rare cases synths won't pass sound through to the next in the chain, as do some effects like MVerb now which is a bit of a shame as it's so kind on the CPU that it can be used on all tracks individually as inserts.

MVerb is an effect, and by definition will pass the audio stream. What's not making it through MVerb is the midi information. The plug needs a midi input and midi output. I won't criticize your creative choice to layer the track that way, but it is widely thought that reverbs are best used as send effects. Also, by stacking 4 synths on one track, you are missing out on a lot of control.

So I recommend for Mr. Eastwood (Caco) to add a midi in and midi out so the other synths will function. For that matter, Mverb could also have a bunch of dummy audio ins and outs so it will pass all audio, even if its coming after a sampler and before another multichannel effect. It doesn't have to use all the channels, but it will be more 'future proof' in terms of your kind of problem.

What do the others think? Is this superfluous?

V'ger · Post by **V'ger** » Sat Jun 05, 2010 1:21 am

Yes of course, midi information, what was I thinking.

But about reverbs as sends vs inserts, there've been threads to prove people are split on this issue. Put as insert there's that much more control as to where in the chain it is plus automation etc. Having it as send I think has maybe been the norm as the possibility to have inserts on each track were not there. With super low CPU-using and nice sounding verbs like MVerb, using inserts only is possible.

As for stacking synths, configuration is not really suffering as any synth in the chain can be set to a midi controller via Reaper's nice learn function, so all will respond to a single automation lane etc. Certainly much easier than several tracks with one on each and nightmare editing. Of course I prefer a single synth on tracks, but this is a freeware project and stacking can anyway be quite interesting.

thankyou · Post by **thankyou** » Sat Jun 05, 2010 2:00 am

I wouldn't want to work that way myself, but since it's hard to predict how people will use a plugin I guess they should all pass midi and auxiliary audio channels 3/4 just to be safe for things like passing signals for later effects that use sidechaining.

It could very well be that I am mistaken as to the cause of this nitpick, we'll see I guess.

ronergeist · Post by **ronergeist** » Sat Jun 05, 2010 5:41 am

@V'ger: you can right click on in/out settings in the MVerb window in Reaper and go MIDI output/ Merges with MIDI output, and you should be OK

V'ger · Post by **V'ger** » Sat Jun 05, 2010 4:07 pm

Thx, but can't find that option anywhere?

ronergeist · Post by **ronergeist** » Sat Jun 05, 2010 4:16 pm

V'ger wrote:Thx, but can't find that option anywhere?

Im not very good at explaining, a picture should do a better job

V'ger · Post by **V'ger** » Sat Jun 05, 2010 4:25 pm

Ah there it was.. So well explained..

That setting fixed the issue, cheers. Now MVerb can go anywhere in the chain and also others that was blocking too (like Minimonsta).

thankyou · Post by **thankyou** » Sun Jun 06, 2010 12:28 am

V'ger wrote:Ah there it was.. So well explained..

That setting fixed the issue, cheers. Now MVerb can go anywhere in the chain and also others that was blocking too (like Minimonsta).

does reaper remember the setting, even when you use the plug in a different project?

V'ger · Post by **V'ger** » Sun Jun 06, 2010 8:51 pm

Unfortunately not, so still hoping some kind soul will add the midi output/thru..

Caco · Post by **Caco** » Mon Jun 07, 2010 1:18 pm

Blurk has kindly ported the GUI version of MVerb to OS X VST and AU!! They should also now work on OS X 10.4 upwards. HUGE thanks to you blurk

For people who installed the GUI-less version of MVerb on OS X please note blurk's installation instructions below

blurk wrote:If you have already installed the GUI-less version of the MVerb AU, this new version of the AU will probably fail AU validation (and possibly crash your host) unless you reboot after installing the new AU. We apologise for this, but don't know of any other reliable work-around. As far as we know, this is due to OS X caching the details about the AU, which includes where to find the UI (so OS X keeps thinking there is no UI until it refreshes its cache, which happens at boot time).

Still lacking a Linux version. I thought this would be more likely than OS X as Linux generally seems more aligned with the whole open-source idea and presumably there aren't many reverb VSTs on Linux?? Nobody want to have a go at it???

www.martineastwood.com

MVerb - A Free Open Source Reverb