Irritating problem with Cantabile and keystation pro88

[Steviebone]

my two cents here... forget USB connections of midi equipment. It's problematic. USB is a polled device and there can be all kinds of weird stuff going on when multiple things happen on USB.

For one thing, Ive found that sending and receiving heavy MIDI data over a single USB connection can be very problematic. Hooking up the devices using midi cables has always solved those problems for me.

What's more, I've also found that for some reason using USB power is not a great idea. Try getting an A/C adapter. Unplug the USB cable, run the unit from direct power and used MIDI cable connections rather than USB. I give you a hundred to one you're likely to get better results.

I'd be rather curious to see if eliminating USB in the scenario doesn't solve your issue.

[TiUser]

... Hooking up the devices using midi cables has always solved those problems for me.

And where to plug these "midi cables" into your pc? You need any separate midi interface then. There are good an bad ones out there as well.

Using classical midi is definitely slow, even if it works. This creates easily timing issues. One midi command at classical midi HW speed takes approximately 1 ms to be transferred.

I can feel a difference if I use one 64samples buffer or one 128samples in A/B comparison. That's talking about 1.5ms... I wouldn't say it's unplayable or does not work but it feels different and music is a lot about feel, isn't it? But compare to classical midi speed... a simple chord needs 3ms to be transmitted. It's not a great solution if timing matters.

[TiUser]

Just to link to another thread - hope Steviebone will not mind, but that's why separate midi interfaces are "better" than usb connections...

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=297389

[Edit:]
It turned out that steviebones main goal and recommendation is to prefer a built in PCI card - PC midi interface. It's a bit hard to understand his arguments without knowing more about his studio installation, type of use and need.

But basically I agree to prefer PCI cards. It's not different with audio interfaces.

However that does not mean either that USB setups do not work at all. Especially the timing issues by inaccurate midi timestamps isn't a big deal for typical Cantabile users - means live players. However in a recording scenario especially with mixed midi / audio recording it can really be an issue.

Another hint may be that there are some users (including myself) that have made good experiences with Edirols dedicated FTP midi - USB technology which consists of dedicated USB drivers supporting Edirols proprietary HW.

Be prepared that especially the praised plug&play - means win drivers - introduce these timing stamp problems.

[chopsxxx]

I also have a keystation pro and VERY OFTEN it seems to "lose comunication" with cantabile (like Tombuck's problem).

I have found, like TIUser suggests, that unchecking and rechecking the midi in port sometimes (more often than not) solves the problem. Other times I have to restart Cantabile.

I also have had this problem with a Keystation 88es.

My setup: XP profesional 32, 4GB Ram, dual core, keyboards run from USB cable, 5 to 10 plugins.

This really is a serious problem for me, as I play live.

Try using as short a USB cable as possible, or use an external power supply. I've found that cable length/quality can affect whether or not I see midi disconnects and other weirdness. Alternately, build/buy a dual-port USB cable that utilizes two ports to double the power available to the bus-powered unit.

But I vote for the All Midi inputs disconnect/reconnect button too!

[tombuck]

i'm now on my 3 powered USB hub, which means i now have to go back in every session and re-assign all my usb controller assigments to the new usb device names. this madness has to stop. it would also be nice if usb hubs were actually reliable, but either way, it seems we should be able to quickly swap hardware with minimal effort in reconfiguring cantabile. after all, hardware failures do happen.

[TiUser]

... but either way, it seems we should be able to quickly swap hardware with minimal effort in reconfiguring cantabile. after all, hardware failures do happen.

I absolutely agree...

I've suggested this many times too - as "device virtuality" - means using virtual device names in sessions and having one global assignment to real midi devices.