I think I finally hate amp sims!

[hibidy]

Not in my lifetime

[Hink]

Reality check - for most guitarists, recording consisted of taking whatever stage amp they had with whatever speaker cab they happened to tour with, placing it in an overpriced and usually inadequately designed studio acoustic space wherever the drum kit wasn't, taking whatever mic was left after the vocals and drums were properly mic'ed up, running it through an indifferent analogue board into a poorly aligned multitrack tape machine with lifed out heads to second hand tape stock. If your amp sim improves on that situation, believe me, you really are up.

Reality Checks bounce in KvR

However to your point, having both not only means you're up, but you're full from the bottom to the top too

[hibidy]

Reality Checks bounce in KvR

The quoted out of context "out of the quoted out of context" post.

[Hink]

Reality Checks bounce in KvR

The quoted out of context "out of the quoted out of context" post.

huh?

[zerocrossing]

Maybe I'm lazy, but most of the time I really don't want to bother with launching and tweaking more than one plug in to get a guitar sound. That's just me though.

what confuses me is that you say you don't want to bother launching and tweaking more than one pluggin, but you swear by AT3 which is indeed a pluggin that has a whole lot of smaller pluggins inside of it. AT3 and GR4 are both very bloated (not a bad thing) and takes a lot of think unless you just use presets. That is precisely what this thread is about, it was a tongue and cheek point about being tired of having to go through so many steps and choices to get one's sounds and that describes AT3 to a 'T'..no?

Now again there is nothing wrong with that because as strangedogs says sims allow you all the pleasure one could ask for with limitless possibilities. But you have to admit, in most sims it's very easy to get lost in that and emerge with nothing but a lot of knowledge gained and some presets made. (again, far from a bad thing)

I am exactly the same way as you, I get it 1000% because when I am in the creative frame of mind I do not want too much think or it's like a bucket of ice water dumped on me. But as I see it there is already a delicate balance between 'creative' and 'critical' thinking, but the goal is 'productive' thinking. When using something as technical as a computer to be creative one really blurs the line even more. The key is to maximize your efficiency between 'creative' and 'critical' thinking so that you can be lazy (as I am as well) or be productive. Productive of course being a very relative term in this case, if you sit down and jam for a couple of hours in pure bliss with no buckets of ice water dumped on you...that is imho very productive. However there are many who need to spit out as many songs as they can to feel productive and that is of course just as valid because that is relative to their goals.

In other words in order to get the most of my creative time I have to maximize my think time and possess the wisdom to know when is the best time to be critical or creative. Would you agree with that? (not that it matters if you don't)

I really will never understand why people are so polarized on this subject

I think what I meant was that I enjoy having all my guitar orientated effects (including amp simulation) in a single unified UI. To me, GR4 and Amplitube 3 are almost "no brainers" at this point because I spent years and years using all the gear (most, as I worked for years in music retail) they purport to be emulating. Other than for a few "fine points" I've never once read a manual for either. I fly in both those apps... though GR4 is a bit trickier... as it's more flexible too. Regardless, I can go between sound in my head to sound I'm hearing really quickly.

Don't get me wrong, I do put bits together when I feel it's important. In a sparse mix that features a stereo chorus guitar with some reverb, I may use Amplitube for the amp sim part only and go with Audio Damage's Vapor and Virsyn's REFLECT for effects. It's not not that big of a deal. When I hear about the guys who use one app for amp sim, another for an impulse response based cab sim and then separate plugs for effects... that starts sounding like too much to quickly deal with. I guess fine if you basically get a set up that you use all the time. I just don't think it really gets you that much more in terms of the final product. At least not in any of the stuff I've heard.

[Hink]

Maybe I'm lazy, but most of the time I really don't want to bother with launching and tweaking more than one plug in to get a guitar sound. That's just me though.

what confuses me is that you say you don't want to bother launching and tweaking more than one pluggin, but you swear by AT3 which is indeed a pluggin that has a whole lot of smaller pluggins inside of it. AT3 and GR4 are both very bloated (not a bad thing) and takes a lot of think unless you just use presets. That is precisely what this thread is about, it was a tongue and cheek point about being tired of having to go through so many steps and choices to get one's sounds and that describes AT3 to a 'T'..no?

Now again there is nothing wrong with that because as strangedogs says sims allow you all the pleasure one could ask for with limitless possibilities. But you have to admit, in most sims it's very easy to get lost in that and emerge with nothing but a lot of knowledge gained and some presets made. (again, far from a bad thing)

I am exactly the same way as you, I get it 1000% because when I am in the creative frame of mind I do not want too much think or it's like a bucket of ice water dumped on me. But as I see it there is already a delicate balance between 'creative' and 'critical' thinking, but the goal is 'productive' thinking. When using something as technical as a computer to be creative one really blurs the line even more. The key is to maximize your efficiency between 'creative' and 'critical' thinking so that you can be lazy (as I am as well) or be productive. Productive of course being a very relative term in this case, if you sit down and jam for a couple of hours in pure bliss with no buckets of ice water dumped on you...that is imho very productive. However there are many who need to spit out as many songs as they can to feel productive and that is of course just as valid because that is relative to their goals.

In other words in order to get the most of my creative time I have to maximize my think time and possess the wisdom to know when is the best time to be critical or creative. Would you agree with that? (not that it matters if you don't)

I really will never understand why people are so polarized on this subject

I think what I meant was that I enjoy having all my guitar orientated effects (including amp simulation) in a single unified UI. To me, GR4 and Amplitube 3 are almost "no brainers" at this point because I spent years and years using all the gear (most, as I worked for years in music retail) they purport to be emulating. Other than for a few "fine points" I've never once read a manual for either. I fly in both those apps... though GR4 is a bit trickier... as it's more flexible too. Regardless, I can go between sound in my head to sound I'm hearing really quickly.

No doubt, that's because you learned to do that and so it's easier for you but that didn't come without a lot of think along the way and the is precisely what my point is. There are quite a lot of us who can fly through their rig no matter how large or small and go between a sound in our heads to the sound we are hearing. But do not be mistaken, there is nothing wrong with changing that sound at a later time and the flexibility to do so is great when composing (however I finish songs slower than anyone).

Hearing is one seriously mind blowing sense, as it gets more acute it gives us more issues. On top of that it can be different in so many subtle ways in the same environment at different times. In fact the more accurate our hearing becomes I believe the more inconsistent our hearing is. You not only hear what's right but you start to hear more of what's wrong. For me the quickest cure for that is like anything of that nature, contrast.

[blueman]

tbh i believe that the average music consumer will never be able to tell the difference.

The point may be moot; the "average music consumer" is an endangered species by now. I think we're what's left of those who are actually still listening to music in the foreground, intentionally. Were a dying breed folks

[blueman]

but for me it's playing for my cat and posting an mp3 every now and then.

Ha! I feel ya there brother For me, it's an audience of 2 dogs and occasionally, I drag the wife in to listen to a riff or two

[hibidy]

but for me it's playing for my cat and posting an mp3 every now and then.

Ha! I feel ya there brother For me, it's an audience of 2 dogs and occasionally, I drag the wife in to listen to a riff or two

You guys should feel lucky, Maple runs for cover.

[Hink]

Were a dying breed folks

speak for yourself, I'm thriving as a result...

[blueman]

Were a dying breed folks

speak for yourself, I'm thriving as a result...

Good way to flip the perspective...point taken

[Hink]

yeah but the down side is I'll never have screaming girls chasing me tearing my clothes off

[Dean Aka Nekro]

Hink mis-matched 4x12" and 50 mic's on said cab (give or take) will sort the screaming girls out or in reality bore them to tears when attempting to explain it all when they say "nice guitar"

[man-T]

Were a dying breed folks

speak for yourself, I'm thriving as a result...

Hey! i didn't say that! you quoted the wrong person..

[Hink]

Were a dying breed folks

speak for yourself, I'm thriving as a result...

Hey! i didn't say that! you quoted the wrong person..

I know, my bad *lays head on chopping block*