yo,
This is probably one of the most used progresions of all time, but what is it really?
Thanks
michael wood : drop zone chord progression
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- KVRian
- 523 posts since 22 Jul, 2008
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- KVRist
- 211 posts since 28 Apr, 2009 from Ft. Lauderdale, FL
OK, I'll take a stab at this one. First, it plays a G minor arpeggio for a long time. Next, it plays G octave notes in a 6 over 4 rhythm for a while. Then comes the part you were probably referring to, which is:
Gm F Bb A Dm C Fm Eb Ab G Cm Bb Eb D Gm
I see this chord progression as a string of several dominant to tonic cadences; F to Bb, A to Dm, C to Fm, Eb to Ab, G to Cm, Bb to Eb, and D to Gm. It's interesting to note that G minor & Bb major, F minor & Ab major, C minor and Eb major are the relative minor/major keys to one another.
I am going to take a wild guess and assume that Michael Woods borrowed this chord progression from a piece of classical music.
I didn't listen past 3:38 in the song; Sorry!
Gm F Bb A Dm C Fm Eb Ab G Cm Bb Eb D Gm
I see this chord progression as a string of several dominant to tonic cadences; F to Bb, A to Dm, C to Fm, Eb to Ab, G to Cm, Bb to Eb, and D to Gm. It's interesting to note that G minor & Bb major, F minor & Ab major, C minor and Eb major are the relative minor/major keys to one another.
I am going to take a wild guess and assume that Michael Woods borrowed this chord progression from a piece of classical music.
I didn't listen past 3:38 in the song; Sorry!
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- KVRist
- 147 posts since 5 Dec, 2009
Thanks psenior, good stuff.
1. Why would you say he borrowed the progression from classical piece?
2. What would be diferent if the same piece was jazz? what would you do it to jazz it up that progression/music?
Welcome back!!!
p.s:I really miss you explanation and analysis.
1. Why would you say he borrowed the progression from classical piece?
2. What would be diferent if the same piece was jazz? what would you do it to jazz it up that progression/music?
Welcome back!!!
p.s:I really miss you explanation and analysis.
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- KVRist
- 211 posts since 28 Apr, 2009 from Ft. Lauderdale, FL
1. It sounds vaguely familiar, like something I was forced to listen to in Music Appreciation class in college. I'm sure there are other forum members (Ogg Vorbis) who might be able to identify it.
2. To turn it into jazz, just convert the tonics & dominants to the chords of your choice. So, for me, that would be Gm6, F7alt to Bb6, A7b9 to Dm6, C7b9 to Fm6, Eb7alt to Ab6, G7b9 to Cm6, Bb7alt to Eb6, D7b9 to Gm6.
I would try to play interesting sounding movements. D minor, F minor and Ab major share the same diminished. C minor and Eb major also share the same diminished so I would definitely keep that in mind as I improvised.
Look at the tonics a little more closely. If you put them all together as a scale, you get Eb major (Eb F G Ab Bb C D) harmonized in triads (Eb Fm Gm Ab Bb Cm Dm). I think whoever wrote this progression took the Eb major scale, started on Bb and skipped every other note in the scale, treated each as a tonic and put it's dominant before it. That's a very interesting composing technique and I intend to apply this to other scales to see how it sounds.
2. To turn it into jazz, just convert the tonics & dominants to the chords of your choice. So, for me, that would be Gm6, F7alt to Bb6, A7b9 to Dm6, C7b9 to Fm6, Eb7alt to Ab6, G7b9 to Cm6, Bb7alt to Eb6, D7b9 to Gm6.
I would try to play interesting sounding movements. D minor, F minor and Ab major share the same diminished. C minor and Eb major also share the same diminished so I would definitely keep that in mind as I improvised.
Look at the tonics a little more closely. If you put them all together as a scale, you get Eb major (Eb F G Ab Bb C D) harmonized in triads (Eb Fm Gm Ab Bb Cm Dm). I think whoever wrote this progression took the Eb major scale, started on Bb and skipped every other note in the scale, treated each as a tonic and put it's dominant before it. That's a very interesting composing technique and I intend to apply this to other scales to see how it sounds.
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- KVRist
- 147 posts since 5 Dec, 2009
Can you explain this with a little more detail? Can you please explian this in a way that a person with not much experience in music theory would understand.psenior wrote:I would try to play interesting sounding movements. D minor, F minor and Ab major share the same diminished. C minor and Eb major also share the same diminished so I would definitely keep that in mind as I improvised.
Thanks.
Can you do the same kind of explanation with chords that share the equal dimished.
How can I use this knowledge to compose, reharmonize?
Thanks again.
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- KVRist
- 211 posts since 28 Apr, 2009 from Ft. Lauderdale, FL
You are asking a very big question. It only took me my whole entire life to start understanding this stuff a little bit!
I have discussed the diminished concepts in previous posts here on this forum in the past. It's been my experience that the vast majority of people do not understand them, regardless of their level of music theory knowledge.
This post of mine discusses what music theory fundamentals I think one should know:
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... d&start=15
Posts where I explain the 6th diminshed scales:
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... diminished
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... d&start=15
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... diminished
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... diminished
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... d&start=15
I have discussed the diminished concepts in previous posts here on this forum in the past. It's been my experience that the vast majority of people do not understand them, regardless of their level of music theory knowledge.
This post of mine discusses what music theory fundamentals I think one should know:
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... d&start=15
Posts where I explain the 6th diminshed scales:
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... diminished
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... d&start=15
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... diminished
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... diminished
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... d&start=15
Drugs and alcohol have never helped me creatively, but for others it seems to be an essential part of the process. 
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- KVRist
- 147 posts since 5 Dec, 2009
psenior let me know what you think about this:
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=266795
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=266795
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- KVRAF
- 26033 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from gonesville
//: [Gm] F Bb / A Dm / C Fm / Eb Ab / G Cm / Bb Eb / D Gm ://
in Bb: [vi] V I / in D: V i / in F: V i / in Ab: V I / in Eb: V I / in G: V i and we've completed a kind of circle.
the goal, 'I or i' in this modulating progression, serves a new function towards a new goal. This modulates by thirds relationship: Bb D F Ab C Eb G. Note that this relationship is diatonic - I mean instead of simply taking major or minor thirds as a single device - abstracting that relationship denotes a V7 9 11 13 in Eb actually. That may be a basis in the composer's idea here.
as per 'classical', the common practice is all about 'dominant/tonic' (V/I) function; when we stray from home (modulate to new key areas) there is the idea to pull back to the original I, home, to be complete.
To obtain a 'jazz' (ie., a 'less cornball') approach to a modulatory progression, there are certain devices that are used.
The idea of taking the I, arrival, as a new point of departure is a starting point in our thought.
How about this: Bb to A, using Bb as if the dominant to A? E7 is the usual suspect for 'dominant to A'. Bebop thinks to make a certain equivalence here, in order to open up new possibiities (ie., obtain more chromaticism, more color choices from the color wheel). The interval from E to Bb is known as a flat fifth (the other way 'round, Bb to E for a classical cat is going to be spelled as 'augmented fourth', but for jazz purposes this is a flat fifth).
So, the thinking was, let's make the fifth of any dominant-functioning harmony a flat fifth; you have A as an arrival point, let's construct a dominant 7th but flat the fifth: E G# Bb D is the same thing as Bb D F Ab in an inversion. Flat five substitution principle.
Now we've Gm F Bb7b5 A7b5 Dm. Gm and F might seem bland in context, so let's give them more interest. Gm7, F7 (of some form; I am ignoring any scale or tune consideration, just an exercise to reveal to you basic concepts of jazz reharmonization. the actual choice is context-dependent, say you're harmonizing a melody), Bb7b5, A7b5, Dm7.
Dm is ii of C. This is typical, I is the new ii. Same thing in the next part of the sequence, Fm is ii of Eb. You can take Ab as a b5 substitute of V of G: Ab C Ebb Gb = D F# Ab C. On to G - Cm, Cm is ii of Bb.
Now: again, Eb can be taken as V7b5 of D, A C# Eb G or Eb G Bbb Db. V - I to Gm, vi of Bb and around we turn.
so we are alternating 'I is the new ii' with 'I is the new V (or bII, by the b5 substitution principle)' but for the turnaround, where it's the new vi to create that turnaround.
in Bb: [vi] V I / in D: V i / in F: V i / in Ab: V I / in Eb: V I / in G: V i and we've completed a kind of circle.
the goal, 'I or i' in this modulating progression, serves a new function towards a new goal. This modulates by thirds relationship: Bb D F Ab C Eb G. Note that this relationship is diatonic - I mean instead of simply taking major or minor thirds as a single device - abstracting that relationship denotes a V7 9 11 13 in Eb actually. That may be a basis in the composer's idea here.
as per 'classical', the common practice is all about 'dominant/tonic' (V/I) function; when we stray from home (modulate to new key areas) there is the idea to pull back to the original I, home, to be complete.
To obtain a 'jazz' (ie., a 'less cornball') approach to a modulatory progression, there are certain devices that are used.
The idea of taking the I, arrival, as a new point of departure is a starting point in our thought.
How about this: Bb to A, using Bb as if the dominant to A? E7 is the usual suspect for 'dominant to A'. Bebop thinks to make a certain equivalence here, in order to open up new possibiities (ie., obtain more chromaticism, more color choices from the color wheel). The interval from E to Bb is known as a flat fifth (the other way 'round, Bb to E for a classical cat is going to be spelled as 'augmented fourth', but for jazz purposes this is a flat fifth).
So, the thinking was, let's make the fifth of any dominant-functioning harmony a flat fifth; you have A as an arrival point, let's construct a dominant 7th but flat the fifth: E G# Bb D is the same thing as Bb D F Ab in an inversion. Flat five substitution principle.
Now we've Gm F Bb7b5 A7b5 Dm. Gm and F might seem bland in context, so let's give them more interest. Gm7, F7 (of some form; I am ignoring any scale or tune consideration, just an exercise to reveal to you basic concepts of jazz reharmonization. the actual choice is context-dependent, say you're harmonizing a melody), Bb7b5, A7b5, Dm7.
Dm is ii of C. This is typical, I is the new ii. Same thing in the next part of the sequence, Fm is ii of Eb. You can take Ab as a b5 substitute of V of G: Ab C Ebb Gb = D F# Ab C. On to G - Cm, Cm is ii of Bb.
Now: again, Eb can be taken as V7b5 of D, A C# Eb G or Eb G Bbb Db. V - I to Gm, vi of Bb and around we turn.
so we are alternating 'I is the new ii' with 'I is the new V (or bII, by the b5 substitution principle)' but for the turnaround, where it's the new vi to create that turnaround.