KVR Audio

Slate · Post by **Slate** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:34 pm

Lenticular wrote:
monkeymanx wrote:So when using this on the master buss is it the first or last in the chain? Also it is first on single tracks and then add your effects? I thought it would come last, as in, you are running effects into your channel on the console. Maybe I'm wrong here.
Don't over think or over complicate this, there several ways you can set it up to function for your particular daw but in general:

Put an instance of the vcc channel on each track channel (doesn't matter first or last if there are any comps/ efects on the channel.)

Put the mixbuss on your master out fader track.

GO!..Start mixing using the settings, groups etc..

Myself I use subgruops- i.e.all guitars to a buss with an instance of the mixbuss, same with vox, main instruments, bass/ drums. I submix these groups to stems then if I want I can put vcc channel on those tracks & to another instance of the mixbuss as well then bounce to the source track ..

Then I master that track w/o the vcc using limiters (FG-X)other comps, lin eq's etc..

+ 1 on everything above.. the key to this plugin is to not overthink things.. toss the plugs on and mix away.. you'll get the sound of the desk

bduffy · Post by **bduffy** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:34 pm

Slate wrote:Guys, please go to USERS area and download yet another update, the 1.06!

The following things were fixed:

- 10.5 compatibility ( MixBuss validation / crash )
- 10.5 Font display issue
- some option problems (strange oversampling config display -
sync beetween option used & option displayed)

To install, simply delete the old 1.05 versoins from your VST, AU,
or RTAS folder.. then replace with the new 1.06 version. The reason
we are not posting the updates as installers is because installers
take a long time to compile and test.. and we want to get you these
updates FAST!

for bug reports: www.slatedigital.com/support

There *should* be a CPU decrease in either this update or the next (I forgot to ask my programmers who are now rightfully passed out after coding for 48 hours straight).

Woo hoo! Thanks for the update Steven! Holy crap, this thing rules. I'm gonna die when the demo runs out.

4damind · Post by **4damind** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:42 pm

Slate wrote:+ 1 on everything above.. the key to this plugin is to not overthink things.. toss the plugs on and mix away.. you'll get the sound of the desk

Hehe

But because the channel has no built-in limiter, it's a good idea to take a closer look to the input levels. It can destroy the sound if the levels are too hot. Btw. eventually it would be a good idea to add in the future a internal limiter? Could be an option for the input stage...

Lenticular · Post by **Lenticular** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 12:09 am

4damind wrote:
Slate wrote:+ 1 on everything above.. the key to this plugin is to not overthink things.. toss the plugs on and mix away.. you'll get the sound of the desk
Hehe
But because the channel has no built-in limiter, it's a good idea to take a closer look to the input levels. It can destroy the sound if the levels are too hot. Btw. eventually it would be a good idea to add in the future a internal limiter? Could be an option for the input stage...

I don't need or want a limiter on each track channel. Start with the all channel inputs to '0' & mix into, if the levels are too hot just turn the knob & level down.

xx JPRacer xx · Post by **xx JPRacer xx** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 3:16 am

Compyfox wrote:b) 249USD is actually quite fair for what you get. Personally I'd have raised that price a tad to go out of the "everyone can get it" reach.

Why limit the reach? Are you saying only rich people can have nice tools?

bduffy · Post by **bduffy** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 3:36 am

Only rich people are tools?

Artgiver · Post by **Artgiver** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 4:52 am

I think he's just saying there's much less "arsenal" for other musicians, competitive-wise, to have in the on-going ego battle of either sounding better or selling more CDs than the next guy. If you're one of the few to own a Lamborghini Contact think of how many more girls you would get instead of the guy with the pickup truck

.

4damind · Post by **4damind** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 10:38 am

xx JPRacer xx wrote:Why limit the reach? Are you saying only rich people can have nice tools?

Hihi, yes it should be sold for $500

But too expensive, more people thinking it must be a very special tool everybody needs to make high quality music and then people finding a way to get this tools...
I think 180€ is a adequate price for such plug-ins.

penguinfromdeep · Post by **penguinfromdeep** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 11:00 am

The price is very fair for what you get!

trimph1 · Post by **trimph1** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 11:22 am

penguinfromdeep wrote:The price is very fair for what you get!

Yes to this...

macmurphy · Post by **macmurphy** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 11:25 am

Compyfox wrote: Personally I'd have raised that price a tad to go out of the "everyone can get it" reach.

why? explain please.

Compyfox · Post by **Compyfox** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 1:31 pm

To all those asking about my comment with "price is too low IMO":

It's because we're talking about an acourate (as acourate as it's possible at the moment) representation of four world class mixing console series.

Take a look at Steinberg for example: NEVE Portico Compressor and EQ, way past 500bucks in terms of pricerange (I seem to remember 799,-) - for two plugins! Why? NEVE as brandname on it, and Rupert Neve helped with the development.

Softube, also pricey for one plugin alone? Why? They are endorsed developers (aka they have PERMISSION to port, so you pay for the name once more). Waves on the other hand is a different issue - you always paid for the name "WAVES". And Universal Audio with the UAD? Well... it's UAD, and since they work together with AMS/NEVE as well - you get what I'm trying to say?

Sure, Nebula (if we want to go that OT once more) is also only 130bucks (just the main "pro" engine) plus packs by third party developers (which brings you to about the same value - for one desk!). But you're not as flexible as of yet(! - not necessarily bad, but let me emphasize on that!), and you're mostly limited to the "fingerprints" you get as presets. Also, no "gang" mode, etc.

249USD (at the moment including an iLok2) is amore than fair, maybe even too fair pricerange for what you get. You get access to the input and mixdown "characteristics" of four desks that cost around 30grand min at small setup (16 channels) EACH! So it's actually peanuts you're spending here.

You can mix and match with Slate's VCC, so it's adding even more value to your spend money. I'm intreagued to say it's a bargain actually. And it will be even more, as soon as the update packs (with even more desks) will be sold.

Think about it for a minute what we can nowadays get for mere pocket money, how much we would have paid for that like... 5-7 years ago. I'm not talking about whether or not we can actually afford it at given time, only at what price it's available. But then think about it if saying "it's a bit expensive" is adjusted in this particular case.

This is my explanation on the "Price" debate.

@STEVEN / FABRICE:
I did some research on the "calibrating mixing desks" part. Since I don't have access to neither the final yet, nor a proper manual, can you maybe go a bit more in-depth what this feature is about?

If I got that right from GearSluts (in terms of calibrating real mixing desks to hosts and AD/DA's), the "calibration" mentioned by bManic ranging from -24dB to -6dB for 0VU is basically only setting up the VU meter RESPONSE (as in "average signal level" aka RMS level, not "digital peak") in terms of reference level. Unless you also shift the headroom space that way.

Pretty much like what PSP Vintage Meter does if you want to calibrate it to the K-System - you only shift the reference point to get a certain maximum RMS level to aim for as final mixdown.

Am I right on that assumption or is there more to it?

bmanic · Post by **bmanic** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 2:01 pm

Compyfox wrote: If I got that right from GearSluts (in terms of calibrating real mixing desks to hosts and AD/DA's), the "calibration" mentioned by bManic ranging from -24dB to -6dB for 0VU is basically only setting up the VU meter RESPONSE (as in "average signal level" aka RMS level, not "digital peak") in terms of reference level. Unless you also shift the headroom space that way.

Pretty much like what PSP Vintage Meter does if you want to calibrate it to the K-System - you only shift the reference point to get a certain maximum RMS level to aim for as final mixdown.

Am I right on that assumption or is there more to it?

Lets say you run a -12dBFS sine wave into the slate plugin while the calibration is at it's default -18. You get a certain amount of harmonic distortion.

If you now turn down the calibration to -24dB you get much more distortion and compression of the same -12dBFS sinewave test signal.

So, as I understand it, it means that you calibrate the input sensitivity reference level. At default calibration a -18dBFS signal in the DAW world corresponds to +4dBU in the analogue domain. Turning down the calibration to -24dB would mean that you are pushing the desk an extra 6dB.

It's possible I have explained this wrong or very ambiguously in my past posts but to simplify it, it's like this:

Turn calibration up, you get less distortion (you push the desk less). Turn calibration down, you get more distortion (you push the desk harder), when using an identical input signal.

Cheers!
bManic

Compyfox · Post by **Compyfox** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 2:20 pm

Hm... this would make sense from what I read from your first post. However 0VU = -18dBFS RMS (not dBFS Peak if we're correct, no?).

So as long as Steven or Fabrice won't clear that riddle completely, I think this one is actually not only adjusting the VU meter, but also the headroom of the desk.

Speaking of the VU on VCC... does it resemble a digital peak meter, or does it show the average level of the signal? In the beta, it did show the peak value.

Which brings me to the next question... if you have a signal (from proper gain staging) of about -6dBFS peak(!, which would, depending on the source signal, somwhat resemble -18dBFS RMS), does the VU on VCC CHANNEL show 0V (aka -18dBFS RMS!) or -6dBFS peak? This is IMO crucial for properly "trimming" or leveling in the input/source signal.

If the VCC CHANNEL/MIX BUSS's calibration and VU works like an analog desk rather than a digital peak meter, it makes much more sense with the calibration option - and is less confusing as well.

This is the very reason why I'm so persistent on that issue. A simple "put it on your channels and mix away" won't work that way.

macmurphy · Post by **macmurphy** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 3:43 pm

compyfox - i agree that the price is fair for the VCC.
to say the price should be raised to get it out of the '"everyone can get it" reach' smacks of elitism.
i am sure you didn't mean it that way but that's how it came across

just because other manufacturers sell their software at very high prices it doesn't mean Slate should follow suit. saying that, VCC is still out of my reach

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