Evolution Bass / RR Upgrade

[uselessmind]

I know there are new scripts planned for some of the bass libraries.
But what about upgrades that also include new samples?

Here is my problem:

I like my OT-Basses. A Lot.
They are great for doing those playful, virtuoso , complicated basslines.
And more important, they sound sooo wonderful i can't help fall in love with them every time i use them. Well almost every time.

Because i get really frustrated when i just need a simple, boring repeating pattern where lots of round robin samples are needed.
And since varying velocities etc only gets you so far i always have to abandon my OT basses and use something else in those cases.

So is there a chance of an upgrade that provides 8x RR samples or more?

[vocalid]

Hi Uselessmind,
have you considered changing the velocities of your midi notes randomly by a small amount? Should do the trick....

[Gregjazz]

I agree, it's tough to emulate repeating 8ths or 16ths with pretty much any instrument (well, except for drum libraries). Maybe I can whip up some MIDI files for you, to make things easier. Which CoreBass library/libraries are using, and what generate tempo?

[uselessmind]

I agree, it's tough to emulate repeating 8ths or 16ths with pretty much any instrument (well, except for drum libraries). Maybe I can whip up some MIDI files for you, to make things easier. Which CoreBass library/libraries are using, and what generate tempo?

Thanks. Of course i use all of them.
But mainly Cherry, Cherry Picked and Jaco.

[uselessmind]

Any news on this?

[Gregjazz]

Oops, sorry about that--this slipped through the cracks in my to do list. Thanks for the reminder, I'll get these made as soon as I can!

[Gregjazz]

Here's something using CoreBass Cherry, with a lot of repeating notes in a simple bassline. Let me know if this is along the lines of what you're after and I'll expand on it.

MP3: http://www.orangetreesamples.com/downlo ... tNotes.mp3
MIDI: http://www.orangetreesamples.com/downlo ... tNotes.mid

As you can see from the MIDI file, I was just varying the velocities slightly, to correspond with accents in the groove, and then also varying some of the note lengths slightly, to introduce slight amounts of release samples between some of the notes.

[uselessmind]

Greg, thanks a lot for bothering with this, since i know its not of interest to most of your customers.

Here is a modified,even simpler pattern closer to what i mean:

http://carageon.com/audio_stuff/corebas ... attern.wav
http://carageon.com/audio_stuff/corebas ... attern.mid

Varying the note length didn't even occur to me ,i'll see if that helps a bit.
Varying the velocities still seems like the biggest weapon against the machine gun effect. But i had situations where i didn't want most of the accentuations that come with that.
What to do then?

Also both of these things can't really be done properly (at least not by me) with playing live.
And being playable live is one of the big strengths of your libraries in my opinion.

[Gregjazz]

Honestly, I think the audio file you posted sounds pretty good. If you applied an amp/cab sim (I just used one of the built-in Kontakt effects in mine), that'll help smooth it over, too.

As it is, there is going to be small gaps (which you can vary) between the notes. Basically when you play bass, you alternate plucking with your index and middle fingers. A split second before your finger plucks the string, it naturally mutes it.

When using medium/fast repeated notes with Iconic Bass Jaco, by the way, try slightly increasing the "Humanize" control in the "fingering" section of the interface. One of the things I sampled was the transition between sustain notes that are re-plucked, so if one note starts right when the other stops, it will play that subtle transition.

[standalone]

Before bass libraries with round robin were avaliable a bit of flanger was useful too.

[tman2k (Meathook Audio)]

Here's a post I put in a different thread about eliminating the machine gun problem:

There are a few things I do to avoid this:

1) Vary the velocity. Make sure you don't have two notes together with the same velocity. If making powerchords, change the velocity on each note in each powerchord. Tedious, I know, but it really works!
2) Vary the articulations. For the sustains, you have several to choose from (strike, hard sustain, sustain, and soft sustain). I have made a patch that uses all of these as velocity layers (eg, 121-127 is strike, 111-120 is hard sustain, 101-110 is sustain, and 0-100 is soft sustain). Then, I will accentuate the beat with a slightly higher velocity (and thus trigger a different articulation). For powerchords, I will use the root note as a higher (harder) articulation, and then use the 5th and octave as a lower one. For example, the root I might make a velocity of 123, and then 114 for the 5th and 111 for the octave. Then, for each successive repeating powerchord, I will change the velocity of each note in the powerchord.
3) Get rid of the quantization! Adjust the start time of each note but a tiny bit...some will be slightly before, some right on, and some slightly after the beat. Also change the end times too, so that each note will be a few ms in length different than the one before it. Sometimes I will use a humanize plugin to do this...I really like the Humanize plugin from Frank's MIDI Plugins.

This post is referring to the guitar library, but a lot of it is still valid!
Hope this helps you out!