IK/SR VI HOT BUY - GROUP BUY on eSoundz!!! SampleTank Instruments for $99 + more!

[20_20_Hearing]

Only... we need more shameless name dropping!

OK. I played for Sting once. I don't mean I played with him, which would probably be better, but I was performing and he was in the audience. Also Tom Jones, Larry Hagman, and Mickey Rooney. All true! Not on the same night though. Nothing to do with this thread of course, but since you asked...

Odd, I ate dinner with Sting once, in the same sort of technical but not really way (he: headlining artist, me: lowly intern, but it was a big tent with long tables so it counts!).

[Reverend Rhythm]

Only... we need more shameless name dropping!

OK. I played for Sting once. I don't mean I played with him, which would probably be better, but I was performing and he was in the audience. Also Tom Jones, Larry Hagman, and Mickey Rooney. All true! Not on the same night though. Nothing to do with this thread of course, but since you asked...

Odd, I ate dinner with Sting once, in the same sort of technical but not really way (he: headlining artist, me: lowly intern, but it was a big tent with long tables so it counts!).

It counts for both of you! Please continue the shameless name dropping!

[AnalogDevice]

hey squids, is it possible to buy the SampleTank libraries in this group buy without the IK Virtual instruments ? For people like me having all the instruments would be more attractive...

[no_skill]

Only... we need more shameless name dropping!

OK. I played for Sting once. I don't mean I played with him, which would probably be better, but I was performing and he was in the audience. Also Tom Jones, Larry Hagman, and Mickey Rooney. All true! Not on the same night though. Nothing to do with this thread of course, but since you asked...

Odd, I ate dinner with Sting once, in the same sort of technical but not really way (he: headlining artist, me: lowly intern, but it was a big tent with long tables so it counts!).

Hello 20/20, epointz in your direction for the shameless dropping!

And for the others, another inch toward the 300 barrier.

Regards to all.

esoundz name: gpzecchi

[Krabat]

Guitar Collection: I'm not familiar with the one you have. I know that years ago there was a title called Guitar Collection, but I don't know if your set is that one or something different. (How big is the set? What are some of the parent sample names?)

The original Guitar Collection was first offered as part of the Expansion Tank line. SR also had acoustic and electric guitar sets as part of their Sonik Capsules series.

They split the Guitar Collection into acoustic vs electric and combined them with the Sonik Capsules titles to make the Acoustic Guitar Collection 2 and Electric Guitar Collection 2 titles listed here.

So if the original Guitar Collection turns out to be what you have, then you'll have some of the sounds in the sets listed here, but not all of them. You'll have to check the list of sounds to compare.

Mine is the expansion tank version (342 MB unzipped). Thanks for the info, I'll have a look at the parent sounds.

Also thank you for the other tips as well. Nice idea to take the ethnic drums from the loop collections. But I'm more interested in the melodic instuments. You're right, one wouldn't need them too often, but as you've written in case of the vintage keys, the 'usual' sounds you can get at every corner, so I might go for a wide variety on sounds - happy with the Sampletank L so far (and some add ons). Especially if the ad-ons come free with this GB. I'm not shure if I'd bought them otherwise...

@ squids: Thanks alot for the free Miro outtakes, that makes the decision much easier!

Kind regards, Gunnar
--
esoundz: Krabat

[torgo]

I have that original Guitar Collection too - I had bought the original CD versions of several Expansion Tanks and other libraries (including Squids Tron Collection vol 1, back when it was nearly $200). It's pretty good, but the new versions are much bigger:



Acoustic Guitar Collection 2 = 1.2 gig unzipped
Electric Guitar Collection 2 = 1.16 gig unzipped

They include the sounds from the Guitar Collection plus the acoustic and electric guitar sets from the old Sonik Capsules series. There's more than enough new material to justify getting them, if you think those are the sets you want most.

-torgo (esoundz = bhall1968)

[osidenick]

I'm curious about the Piano Collection 2. I currently have very little in terms of piano sounds. I have the pianos that come with Logic Express, the Steinway in Miroslav Classik and the HQ Free Piano in the free Sampletank. I've tried minor tweaks on all of them, and can't get anything inspiring from the Logic pianos. I was pleasantly surprised by the different sounds I could get out of the Miroslav Steinway by using the Tone plugin. I also like layering the HQ Free Piano with the Dynamic Piano preset. It's nice how just a few quick and easy tweaks can add so much variety. How does the Piano Collection compare with the above pianos? I've listened to the demo sounds for it on esoundz and YouTube, and it sounds great to me.

I'm sure the expensive, multi-GB pianos out there are better, but I don't really understand the how and why. To my ears, every piano demo I listen to sounds great (maybe because they are well over my head in piano skills) Do the multiple velocity levels "smooth" out the sound when playing a dynamic passage? If you just played the same velocity, would the difference between the expensive ones and HQ Free be lessened? Or is the difference most evident in the highest and lowest octaves? I don't want to open up a big can of worms about the complexities of sampled pianos, just wondering if there is a simple explanation.

Thanks,
osidenick (here and at esoundz)

[subtlearts]

short answer: no, there's no simple explanation. It really is a big can of worms. Here are a few thoughts from William Coakley on file size:
http://www.williamcoakley.com/articles. ... bigger.php

... in Sonik Synth there's a 154meg(ish) piano that seems to be the same (correct me if I'm wrong here) as the main/big one in the Piano Collection 2 - I believe it is a Yamaha and it's definitely very clean and quite playable. I had to tweak the velocity envelope as it wasn't playing nice with my controller (a Nord Stage ) for my taste anyway, but otherwise it's quite a decent instrument. I probably won't use it a lot as I'm not a big Yamaha fan and I have the NI ones of which I am particularly fond of the Steinway and the Bechstein. However, if you want to get a sense of the variety of sounds available 'out there' to compare it to, here's a page with a couple of great comparisons, in the form of annotated video:
http://www.vstcafe.com/2011/04/commerci ... rison.html

I think it should be possible to find the MIDI file used (it's by Jordan Rudess), if so I can run it through the Sonik Synth one and post the results for comparison with those on that page.

edit: done. here's the file:
http://tobiastinker.com/demo/jordan_sonik_one.mp3

note: I excerpted the same bit that was used for the demos on the page linked above. The pedal timing seems to be a bit different on this version of the MIDI file, not sure why. Anyway you get the idea. This is a direct output of Sonik Synth 2 (running in Sonar) with The Grandio child preset, which has a bit of verb on it. It's at default volume, with no additional compression or anything.

[Xenobt]

I can give you some insight on the Piano 2 Collection, osidenick.

It's a cool set of keyboards, with some standouts being the just-right-brightness for pop, A Nice Steinway D, Graduation Day, and Shineway Piano for acoustic stuff.
Some of the velocity switching is a little obvious (or nonexistent) in some of the other pianos here, which make them less useful for subtle solo stuff, but one set of layers or the other may be just the thing in a full mix.

The pleasant surprise for me was the other vintage keys in the set. The D6 CLAV is one of the finest I've heard anywhere, and makes me wish my funk chops were better!
The Wurlys are especially nice, and there's tine/DX style Rhodes, upright, honkey-tonk, and a nice, biting harpsichord rounds out the collection.

But if you haven't bought your VI yet or are considering another, I recommend Sampletank XL as best overall for acoustic pianos of all types, from uprights to electric grands. The Piano Collection 2 is nice, but the quality and variety in STXL is hard to beat.

My favorite piano in all of the sets is the EXCELLENT Clean Piano in the Hip Hop Instruments collection!
It's a near sound-alike to the MPO Steinway, so they may share a sample bloodline under the hood.

I know HHI wasn't a first choice for many of us, but once we hit 10x1 in last summers GB, (twice for me!) I gave it a try. I'm SO glad I did! Like the Electronic Drums set, (yes, AGAIN with that!) there's more here than the title suggests.

There's a great set of synths, orchestral elements, beatboxes and some VERY playable guitars that work in many pop/alt/electronica contexts. In fact, if you're considering the SampleArp or the OB collection, you may want to consider this one instead.

There's tons of BIG synth basses, leads, sweeps, a closet full of Roland TRs and a velocity-switched nylon string gtr that's a knockout! And it all sounds huge right out of the box, no tweaking needed (the two synth collections I mentioned do need a bit).

Sorry to digress to a collection review!
About your question concerning piano libraries price/performance, there really IS one. While the Steinway D's I have in Garritan Personal Orchestra, ST and Miroslav are great, they don't sound like their big-buck competition like Ivory or Quantum Leap Pianos, especially in a solo context with a good weighted keyboard controller.

The subtlety and number of the velocity layer crossovers, # of notes an octave sampled and performance artifacts (like hammer/harp/pedal effects) make them truly a cut above.

But they're cpu HOGS and many times you really don't need all that firepower or detail. and I've found that something with less layers will sound more consistent if you're not a great pianist. (I SOO AIN"T!)

And Rev, just to name drop a bit, I've attended talks/QA sessions by super producers Brendan OBrien, Jimmy Douglass and Brian Eno. And a GREAT free seminar from IK on using the T-rackS system with Outkast's Neil Pogue. And I STILL have so much to learn!

Quick note to Krabat (or anyone considering the Vocal Collection), don't forger JavaJ's NICE set of child patches for it here in the Patches and Banks section above, they really make it MUCH easier to work with,,,

KVR/eSoundz: Xenobt

[doubleslash]

I can give you some insight on the Piano 2 Collection, osidenick.

Thanks, I've been playing with that and Vintage Keys today.

Can someone with some vintage synth clue explain the differences in the different libraries? (what does SampleMoog offer that Sonik doesn't, since there is so much content that comes with Sonik). ARPs, the Oberheim library, etc ...

I have a GR-30 I can setup, what kinds of mischief can I get into with that?

[curt1lp]

I'm in - bought Miroslav.

[torgo]

I can give you some insight on the Piano 2 Collection, osidenick.

Thanks, I've been playing with that and Vintage Keys today.

Can someone with some vintage synth clue explain the differences in the different libraries? (what does SampleMoog offer that Sonik doesn't, since there is so much content that comes with Sonik). ARPs, the Oberheim library, etc ...

I have a GR-30 I can setup, what kinds of mischief can I get into with that?

I have differing opinions from the others on the pianos in Piano Collection 2 vs Sonik Synth vs SampleTank XL. But that's a mega-mega post, so it will have to wait a bit...





In the meantime, the shorter answer for the Vintage Synths is that ARP, Oberheim and Moog were three different makers of those vintage synthesizers.

The SampleMoog instrument is a massive library of sounds that came from various Moogs, while the SampleARP Solo and SampleOB Xpander are smaller libraries (and without their own instrument interface) featuring sounds recorded from those instruments.

Yeah, you knew that already... but that's what it really comes down to. Just collections of sounds from different brands, where each brand is known for certain "feels" to some of their sounds.

Sonik Synth is a big catch-all collection of instruments with a heavy emphasis on keyboard and synth sounds. It has the basics like SampleTank, plus a good foundation of Mellotron and related sounds, and a decent sampling of OB/ARP/Moog synths as well.

In general - if you have Sonik Synth, you probably won't have much need for SampleARP Solo, SampleOB Xpander, SampleTron, Squids Tron Collection, SampleMoog, or even Piano Collection 2.





Of the five VI's offered, Sonik Synth and SampleTank XL are the main general-purpose workstations. (I recommend Sonik Synth over SampleTank XL. Or both, if you want more of everything. The samples are different.)

The other three are specialty items: outstanding if you know you want those areas, but not for everyone. Miroslav is tremendously popular for classical/orchestral work. SampleTron (and Squids Tron Exclusive Extras as a bonus choice) is as good as it gets for Mellotron sounds - but most musicians would never use more 'Tron than what is offered in Sonik Synth.

And SampleMoog is outstanding if you want a huge library of sounds from those old Moog synths. The catch is that it's a one-trick pony in that sense - lots of Moog, but nothing but Moog.



More on the pianos coming later tonight...

-torgo (esoundz = bhall1968)

[torgo]

Today's update = 296!

We should hit the 300 mark later tonight or tomorrow!!!




And a reminder: don't forget about the EZ10 coupon code if you're ordering. For one week only (probably running up to whatever Memorial Day Weekend sale Squids has in store for us), that coupon code will save you $10 off anything on the Esoundz web site.

[Xenobt]

Cool torgo, I look forward to it! Your knowledge is vast when it comes to nearly everything IK/SR!

My experience is more anecdotal, what works in an arrangement or session I'm doing. And since that varies from Dirty South to piano/bass/drums jazz trios to midi orchestra for TV, sometimes what works surprises even me!

Often, it's more the player than the sound. I remember some guys who could make beautiful things happen with those AWFUL DX7 acoustic pianos. It was all about touch (which the DX had in SPADES) and knowing the instrument and its sounds, good and bad.

Sometimes when I FINALLY have a midi piano, bass or melody part down, I'll do "patch roulette" and step thru not only instruments in the same family, but synths, strings, guitars, world instruments, even percussion to see what shakes out.
Sampletank makes it so easy...

THAT"S the beauty of collections that may not seem your cupa tea. Sometimes those sounds will take your work to new places. As I've said before (and it bears repeating now that Squids is graciously giving away the MP bonus and opening another choice), if you get ONE song idea from a set or that odd instrument is there when you need it, it's priceless... and at these prices, almost free!

KVR/eSoundz: Xenobt

[torgo]

I already mentioned that I liked layering the big grand piano in the Piano Collection 2 (or the one in Sonik Synth) with the HQ Free Piano (in SampleTank Free or the XT library from last year's group buy) for rock - you hear two different sounds played together in the bass end, but you hear just one piano in the higher end.


For those with nearly all of the piano offerings, here's another combination I like for playing with a softer touch:

Layer the "Whispering Piano YM" sound from SampleTank 2.5 (not sure if it's in the "L" version - it's definitely in XL) with the "Home Tape Piano" from the Piano Collection 2.

Make sure the Zone button is off. Select the Home Tape Piano, click the SYNTH button and turn the Fine knob to 0. Also turn off its Lo-Fi effect. Set the Whispering Piano volume a little louder than the Home Tape Piano - such as 105 for WP and 100 for HTP.

At those settings, Home Tape Piano will be roughly half the volume of Whispering Piano, which is just about perfect. You don't want the HTP to stand out when you strike each note, but rather to widen the sustained sound of the other piano and add to its softness.


Try it and see what you think! And if you have SampleTank L, please let me know if the Whispering Piano is included in that version's library.

-torgo (esoundz = bhall1968)