Waves MaxxBass: freeware equivalent?

[tommy_d]

WOK's plugin adds the so-called psychoacoustic tones. I put it on a bass track. I don't think there's a preset for bass, but if you tweak the knobs a little can add very nice oomph. From the website:
BassPlus is an enhancer for low frequencies. Intended for drums, but works on other signals too of course. It's not a fixed EQ, but has a detector for lower frequencies and enhances them and/or adds a new subtone to it.

That's what the Waves does, except it has no detector/sensitivity control, which is I think if you want to add it to the whole mix.

Hmmmmmm.

Well maybe I'm missing something or being stupid - it does happen - but I didn't have much success with it.

I experimented with different ADDBASS and SENS settings, but the ADDBASS knob either did very little or caused unpleasant distortion And the note added by ADDTONE is controlled by the FREQU knob, rather than by the pitch content of the input* (AFAICT, anyway). Which means unless your bass line is monotonal - or at least very simple - the additional tones generated will be discordant at least some of the time. Which is why I think it's probably better for kick.

*unlike, for instance, the SUB sub-harmonic synthesizer of Voxengo LFMaxPunch

@ATS: Fair point...but since I already own the Voxengo plug the question of whether MaxxBass is cheaper or not is moot. For me, anyway

@DMuzik & Tp3: I hear what you're saying...but, erm, let's not go there! iLok, copy protection (etc.) seems to be a touchy subject round here, and I don't want a productive discussion to turn into a flame-fest

@tetsuneko: Yes, I like the mda plug (I like lots of the mda plugs, in fact; they may be long in the tooth but they still get plenty of use round here). There's another good one by loser (Michael Gruhn) called - I think - 50Hz Kicker. But, again, these plugs produce different effects from MaxxBass.

@kbaccki: I will persevere with the SAT module. LFMaxPunch is a complicated plug-in with lots of possibilities and I haven't fully got to grips with it yet. It's perfectly possible that with further experimentation I could get it to do what I want.

[tommy_d]

So to recap:

- I've found a couple of JS plugs (bassmanager, hugebooty) that can do really nice things for bass (thank you, LiteOn & Mr Stillwell) but not in the same way as MaxxBass.

- I've found a freeware VST multi-effect (Stardust) that can do interesting things to bass, and plenty more besides (thank you, GaryG).

- I've found a payware plug (XBass) that does more-or-less what MaxxBass does, I think (thank you, LeVzi). I'm not very keen on the interface but "like the budgie..." (15euros is almost freeware).

- I've decided to re-visit a payware plug I already own (LFMaxPunch); maybe I just need to delve deeper? (thank you, kbaccki).

...What I haven't found is the thing I was looking for: a direct freeware substitute for MaxxBass. If there really isn't one then I'm genuinely quite surprised. 'Cos as I say, MaxxBass is not new and it seems - in essence, at least - pretty simple

So maybe:

- My understanding of how MaxxBass works is flawed: it's not just an exciter, a compressor and some filtering, it's actually a lot more complicated.

Or:

- The Devil really is in the detail: the principle may be quite simple, but tweaking the algorithm is a major undertaking.

Or:

- The Freeware Hero Devs so beloved of KVRists have a kind of collective "blind spot": they probably could knock up a freeware MaxxBass clone ("BassMaxx"? "FreeBass"?); it just hasn't occured to them (yet).

I dunno Anyway, thanks to everyone who contributed. I'm off to experiment with LFMaxPunch...

[bduffy]

FWIW, I've been in many threads like this over the years, and the conclusion is always the same: Maxx/RBass are in a league of their own.

I think one way they really beat the competition is by not having too many vague parameters, but there is a smoothness to the sound that is very hard to match (probably what you speak of: "the devil in the details".

[Tp3]

@DMuzik & Tp3: I hear what you're saying...but, erm, let's not go there! iLok, copy protection (etc.) seems to be a touchy subject round here, and I don't want a productive discussion to turn into a flame-fest

What, are you kiddin' me ?

I care less about the iLok thingy... I was marely pointing that buying an iLok AND RBass will DOUBLE the plug's price
(for a single, first timer, waves plug).

FWIW, I've been in many threads like this over the years, and the conclusion is always the same: Maxx/RBass are in a league of their own.

I am getting the exact same felling. all over the world, for YEARS, people have been pondering the concept. I
think there were a LOT of ideas flying around as to how to imitate the process. but to no avail.

I guess it isn't for nothing that they patented the concept...

[sunny_j]

Christian Budde also had a go at it. He made a plug to emulate R/MBass. It is called "Bass Extender". Never got it to do what i wanted but if anybody wants to try, go ahead
http://www.savioursofsoul.de/Christian/ ... t-plugins/

Also, be careful when changing parameters. His softwares produce really loud clicks or pops when changing parameters !

Cheers!

[bduffy]

Actually, as I recall, the Crysonic NewB was pretty good at this, came the closest to RBass, I thought. The usual caveats with Crysonic apply.

[Breeze]

As corollary to this thread... Waves LoAir is on sale this month for $19. It can do mono, stereo and 5.0 or 5.1 surround. Cheap if you're already iLoked...

[sinkmusic]

As corollary to this thread... Waves LoAir is on sale this month for $19. It can do mono, stereo and 5.0 or 5.1 surround. Cheap if you're already iLoked...

Too bad it requires Ilok.
Is there no possibility to have C/R or a serial ? Is Ilok the only way ?

[Compyfox]

O-kay... I skimmed through the thread a bit, and I also come to the same conclusion: you want the MaxxBass technology, get MaxxBass.

First and foremost, Renaisance Bass is not an "improved" technology of MaxxBass, it's actually a trimmed down version. Renaissance Bass is made for compressing Bass content (read: bass guitars, guitars in general, vocals), not for adding content that is simply not there.


There are a couple of possibilities, some mentioned already like LFPunch from Voxengo and maybe even SEND from Jeroen Breebaart - but they are still not what you know from MaxxBass. They utilize a similar technique, but through the years that I tested such plugins myself, I always came back to MaxxBass - but ultimately never bought it.


Then to the WOK creation. From my understanding, it's basically adding a sine wave or "low octave" to the original. Not really what MaxxBass is doing (splitting the frequency, adding harmonics to the split signal, mix back). Same with C.Budde's plugin btw.

"Bass Extender" is very experimental, also adds harmonics, but doesn't really come close to what you know and heard of MaxxBass and Renaisance Bass. Christian only created this plugin because he wanted to see what he could do with a similar approach - actually it was due to a discussion I had with him in whether or not it is possible to reverse-engineer the now discontinued Elogoxa Baxxpander. Still usable for something, but not as simple.


MDA's lowend tool is actually adding a sine signal to a percussion. In very basic form it's a sidechained gate that opens if a signal applies (trigger), with a sinewave generator put pre-gate. It's an old trick to add more lowend to kicks or snares.

I can't say much about the rest of the tools - I can only emphasize that if you want MaxxBass's technology/sound, get MaxxBass.


Either that, or create a usable tool yourself. The introduction to that was on page 1 I think. Only that the signal is not bandpassed IIRC, but lowpassed only (up until 225Hz). Can't tell you anything about the waveshaper though. But with so many tools on the market, you can go nuts. Or... grab C.Budde's Chebyshev Waveshaper or Christortion and create your own harmonic fingerprint. The possibilities are endless - you just need to wrap your head around it.

[bduffy]

Hey Compy, I was wondering when we'd hear from you! I was awaiting an endorsement of Baxxpander...

First and foremost, Renaisance Bass is not an "improved" technology of MaxxBass, it's actually a trimmed down version. Renaissance Bass is made for compressing Bass content (read: bass guitars, guitars in general, vocals), not for adding content that is simply not there.

But I'm not sure why you're claiming what you are about RBass. Waves themselves claim RBass is a "significant improvement in the psychoacoustic bass performance", and as far as I know, they both work the same way; by adding harmonics to the signal to increase the perception of the fundamental bass. RBass is simpler, but it does have a couple of improvements, can be used on a whole mix, and is not a compressor. Just wanted to point that out.

[Compyfox]

It is simpler indeed. You lack the crossover and mix. But it's also offering an internal compressor IIRC. This clears why the prices are that drastic.

Of course "significant improvement" is a marketing buzzword. RenBass is newer than MaxxBass (though both are still almost a decade old!). It's long ago that i used Renbass actually.

I still say that MaxxBass offers more for your buck.


I pretty much dropped Baxxpander and X-Citer (developer is deceased) years ago. I actually do not use any exciter anymore either, not even CLAS (Refined Audiometrix), which is surpising if I may say so. Might be due to my changed workflow and/or different tools I have at my disposal now (a lot of them can add harmonic content if needed). Maybe even new tricks I learned over the years.

[bduffy]

It is simpler indeed. You lack the crossover and mix. But it's also offering an internal compressor IIRC. This clears why the prices are that drastic.

Of course "significant improvement" is a marketing buzzword. RenBass is newer than MaxxBass (though both are still almost a decade old!). It's long ago that i used Renbass actually.

I still say that MaxxBass offers more for your buck.


I pretty much dropped Baxxpander and X-Citer (developer is deceased) years ago. I actually do not use any exciter anymore either, not even CLAS (Refined Audiometrix), which is surpising if I may say so. Might be due to my changed workflow and/or different tools I have at my disposal now. Maybe even new tricks I learned over the years.

If you don't need an exciter, that's a good thing!

As for RBass, I own it, and I got the information from the manual. It's quite clear it's an update of MaxxBass designed for simplicity. Nowhere is compression mentioned, so I wonder how you can claim it's only for compressing bass and guitar? I just don't get where that comes from. But anyway, I do agree: MaxxBass is a fine plug-in with more control. To my ears, though, RBass sounds better, even with less controls.

[Compyfox]

I could misinterpret it for RenComp. Like I said, it's been a while since I used these things on Bass/Guitar.

Also.. it's not that much slimmed down either. A quick look at the GUI's shows that RenBass misses the dynamics mode (don't see a reason for it), you can not control the decay of the harmonics but you have a different range for adding the enhanced signal.


Whatever... my 2cents anyway. Though MaxxBass is still on my wishlist. It does come in handy for certain recordings from yesteryear to add more subtle. Though I do know my ways around it.

[sunny_j]

trimmed version or not, i find renBass better than Maxxbass, YMMV tho. the difference between the two also varies, on certain frequencies it is large, whereas on other, it is negligible..

[LeVzi]

Man that iLok issue, it's not the fact I have to use an iLok, its the additional cost of the iLok that annoys me. The plug-ins are reduced in price but throw on £30 more for the dongle from the outset. . .

Maybe Waves should think about free iLok dongles with your 1st purchase for a xmas sale But then arent' waves still stuck in the dark ages and not using 64bit yet ?