KVR Audio

como baila · Post by **como baila** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 1:52 am

Here's the best question: If a friend asked you today, "I don't want to spend too much, which program would you recommend to try out while I see if I really want to get into this computer music thing?", you'd say?

1. Reaper has/ is a full featured, untimelimited, uncrippled demo.
2. Reaper sells you one future new version.
3. Reaper is priced around the same as the other manufacturers 'ultra'light' 'Artist' type teaser programs.
4. Reaper can cover the same 90-95% of what all the other full-featured daws also cover of what each of their competitors can do.
5. 90% of what you can learn in Reaper will carry over to any other full-featured daw.
6. 45% of what you learn in an 'ultra-light' can carry over ... because a lot of the good stuff is missing.
7. What the hell could you possibly have to lose?

The OP's question is a rhetorical one without any possible meaningful answer. It is good for provocative discussion. I own Reaper 4, Acid Pro 6, Ableton 6 and Cubase 6. 666 is probably not such a bad thing ... except I can't remember the last time I opened Ableton.

I was gung ho on Reaper until I had problems with my UAD2 cards that all the best intentioned help in the world from the fabulous Reaper forums (this meant totally sincerely!) couldn't help me with. I went at the time from Cubase 3SX to 5 and haven't looked back. I rewire Acid from time to time for it's easy peasy pitch shifting, but that's it. I'm not saying Cubase is better, just that it does everything (and more) that I need and the more you get to know a daw the more you know how to quickly do what you want.

But back to my 'better question,' I could have spent a couple of years learning how to use Reaper and if I was dissatisfied gone on elsewhere with an understanding of what tools would be there in my next daw, making it easy to quickly get deeply into it.

If you wouldn't recommend Reaper to your friend starting out who doesn't want to spend a pile of cash, you're probably not a very good friend.

Como

liquidsound · Post by **liquidsound** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 2:29 am

como baila wrote:The OP's question is a rhetorical one without any possible meaningful answer. It is good for provocative discussion.

The question is quite OK because for example I would not buy Reaper if it cost as much as Live which I use and still far from being a power user. When you get to decide to spend quite a sum of cash and you are in a different territory from where you can really choose what you are going to get for that money, YOU WILL begin to set your head straight and see what program makes you juices flow!
If a friend wants to start with computer music, in order to keep him as a friend, I would not recommend Reaper because as you have seen from this topic's posts, many still have quite a challenge with it and from a beginner standpoint it's not a good entry gate.
I would probably recommend energyXT or even better MuLab for its easy entry level and powerful hidden modular system.
I reversed the question because some of us go from negative to positive and some the opposite way.
I personally think Reaper is an amazing attempt to level the market greed but it is facing the usual challenge of trying to beat the opponent rather then just be at its best which eventually could beat any opponent with a more mature and unique outcome.

hibidy · Post by **hibidy** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 2:53 am

DOH!

How does this happen to me so much

VitaminD · Post by **VitaminD** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:08 am

And 93.24% of all statistics are made up on the spot.

I would still take a Cubase 6 license if offered for $60 USD. Not that I'd end up permanently using it, but for 60 dollars it would make a great long term trial. Which is one thing I like about REAPER... the trial never permanently kicks you out. For me, I don't own it yet because it doesn't handle MIDI editing as I'd need it and thus I don't use it.

But things have improved in the past version. So I wait and hope devs add more features. Before anyone (potentially) asks what features.. they're on FR @ cockos forums and thus known.

liquidsound · Post by **liquidsound** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:19 am

hibidy wrote:Wow, you're ruining your own thread

just picking up the pieces...

Maybe I'm wrong but 50/50 of the mood here, Reaper with his $60 has not made an impact as it should. Its amazing features at that price should have seriously bite off a huge chunk of business from the big players, as the Hate/Love Reason has done.
So, for that matter Reaper has to live with a future limited by the very strategy they are using to enter the arena... Price Cap.

hibidy · Post by **hibidy** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:23 am

you bastard! :southpark:

captain caveman · Post by **captain caveman** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:27 am

liquidsound wrote:
hibidy wrote:Wow, you're ruining your own thread
just picking up the pieces...
Maybe I'm wrong but 50/50 of the mood here, Reaper with his $60 has not made an impact as it should. Its amazing features at that price should have seriously bite off a huge chunk of business from the big players, as the Hate/Love Reason has done.

How do you know that Reason has done that and Reaper hasn't?

So, for that matter Reaper has to live with a future limited by the very strategy they are using to enter the arena... Price Cap.

I thought your question was based in the present/past?

VitaminD · Post by **VitaminD** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:31 am

Perhaps part of the problem is it started humble and has slowly built over time.. like a fat man eating baked goods.

The weight doesn't appear overnight.. so he doesn't see much of a change at any given time. But to the person who meets them only when they have become large.. they say WOW you're a big fella!

I suspect if REAPER would have stayed in hidden development mode until recently it would have had more of a 'WOW' impact.

Also, It is competing against a market with very well seasoned competitors.. they have had a 15-30 years to refine and sculpt their products. REAPER has been around for 5 years in commercial form.

hibidy · Post by **hibidy** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:32 am

GOD D....IT.............soab!

I am FAIL

Would people PLEASE stop quoting things I just edited or posting before I can get done..........thanks!

VitaminD · Post by **VitaminD** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:35 am

Same goes for you mr. hibbs.

lotus2035 · Post by **lotus2035** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:36 am

Have we come to a conclusion yet? No?..mkay..

SJ_Digriz · Post by **SJ_Digriz** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:38 am

liquidsound wrote:
hibidy wrote:Wow, you're ruining your own thread
just picking up the pieces...
Maybe I'm wrong but 50/50 of the mood here, Reaper with his $60 has not made an impact as it should. Its amazing features at that price should have seriously bite off a huge chunk of business from the big players, as the Hate/Love Reason has done.
So, for that matter Reaper has to live with a future limited by the very strategy they are using to enter the arena... Price Cap.

It has nothing to do with a "Price Cap".

The amazingly bad interface made it's amazing price/performance advantage a non-starter. It's pretty much that simple. There are quite a few Reaper users, but it is still a very minority program. The converts all scream about how Reaper gets a bum rap about the interface. Well, if you ask almost anyone who decides NOT to use it after trying it, it has almost nothing to do with the capabilities. It ALWAYS has to do with how cumbersome it is and how f**king stupid the set of toggles you have to switch to get it to do any one thing is.

As I've stated a few times. If Reaper were free, I'd continue to pay the going rate for Cubase.

hibidy · Post by **hibidy** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:40 am

VitaminD wrote:Perhaps part of the problem is it started humble and has slowly built over time.. like a fat man eating baked goods.

The weight doesn't appear overnight.. so he doesn't see much of a change at any given time. But to the person who meets them only when they have become large.. they say WOW you're a big fella!

I suspect if REAPER would have stayed in hidden development mode until recently it would have had more of a 'WOW' impact.

Also, It is competing against a market with very well seasoned competitors.. they have had a 15-30 years to refine and sculpt their products. REAPER has been around for 5 years in commercial form.

But see I can't buy that because all of the "seasoned" ones out there suck wads of lint compared to how much better they SHOULD be considering the time out there

Reaper, tracktion, ,eXT, live are the ones I can think of that were outside the box. (two are dead, one has imho become kinda bloated)

hibidy · Post by **hibidy** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:41 am

VitaminD wrote:Same goes for you mr. hibbs.

trimph1 · Post by **trimph1** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 4:11 am

Would you still buy Reaper if it will cost you as much as the other DAWs ?