KVR Audio

nineofkings · Post by **nineofkings** » Mon Dec 26, 2011 1:46 am

I'm a little confused as to the relationship between the three. The way I understand it is that the sound card has a buffer which gives the CPU a certain amount of time to go through all of the buffers and process the audio. If the CPU can't keep up, that too-familiar crackling and popping happens. So crackles happen if
a) your CPU is too slow or
b) your sound card is too slow
So improving either will allow for lower latencies?

Also when searching for "low latency sound cards" there are actual ASIO cards that replace your existing sound card, and their are USB audio interfaces. USB audio interfaces only are low-latency with the audio going through them, though, right? If I'm playing softsynths will USB interfaces help with latency in that regard, or only if I'm directly monitoring audio going into their inputs? I ask because I'm on a laptop and it will be more efficient to upgrade my sound card than my CPU. I don't know how to change a laptop sound card, and the cheapest ASIO card that will allow lower latencies is $100, but I can get an interface for slightly less.

ford442 · Post by **ford442** » Mon Dec 26, 2011 2:22 am

the main concern is your CPU - all DSP processing happens at the CPU level - unless you have a dedicated DSP card such as UAD or Protools.. so, buying a different interface often won't help with crackles..

what you do want is an ASIO driver - i am guessing that right now you have a normal sound card - you can download a free program called ASIO4all in order to use your normal interface with ASIO connectivity - that will give you low latency and reduce crackles from what you get using plain old DirectX or MME windows audio..

as far as USB - they are very similar in what they can do vs PCI cards - often more expensive since you are paying for the housing and external features.. if you bought a USB interface then you could expect superior, higher fidelity audio, but no more overall processing power... again, a sound card is not a dedicated DSP - that is why we have the Receptor featured at this site - a rack computer dedicated to DSP..

i hope that i am being clear - i have a bad cold..

and Merry Christmas!

RunBeerRun · Post by **RunBeerRun** » Mon Dec 26, 2011 2:26 am

Crackles happen if your cpu load is too high from plugins. I mean, I have a single core computer, an M-Audio card, and it runs smooth at the lowest latency it offers.

But I'm running optimized stuff when I use that computer, and cpu runs at around 30-50% for full projects.

ford442 · Post by **ford442** » Mon Dec 26, 2011 2:30 am

oh you are 15? that is great! i was barely using computers at 15..
i am assuming you know - DSP = Digital Signal Processing - the computation of real time audio..
once you have ASIO4all installed then you can select it in your host as the output driver where now it says something like (Directx AC'97).. you will then have low latency and hopefully less crackles..

hope this helps..

nineofkings · Post by **nineofkings** » Mon Dec 26, 2011 3:11 am

I have ASIO4ALL it's just weird because with nothing in the background and synth1 (!) running I still get crackles unless my buffer setting is up in the 800's with 5 ms of "buffer offset" (whatever that is). The CPU has Reaper set to High priority. Couldn't the load just increase and not crackle? Instead of having crackles at 20% total CPU load, why don't I just have no crackles and 25% CPU load? That's why I thought a sound card would help.

ford442 · Post by **ford442** » Mon Dec 26, 2011 3:39 am

are you aware that a VST runs on one core at a time? if you use up 20% of a quad core then you have most of one core at capacity.. that can be one issue.. i don't want to recommend that you spend $100 on an interface that may or may not help the crackles.. so, we should diagnose further..

nineofkings · Post by **nineofkings** » Mon Dec 26, 2011 3:47 am

I have a dual-core and my host can use both cores for itself even if single VSTs can't.

ford442 · Post by **ford442** » Mon Dec 26, 2011 3:48 am

yes, but i guarantee that each VST is assigned a process on one core by the host..

timobrien · Post by **timobrien** » Wed Dec 28, 2011 3:26 am

nineofkings wrote:I have ASIO4ALL it's just weird because with nothing in the background and synth1 (!) running I still get crackles unless my buffer setting is up in the 800's with 5 ms of "buffer offset" (whatever that is).

ASIO4all is a great hack, but it only SIMULATES asio, and you are still battling a built-in soundcard with 40cents worth of parts that was only made for beeps, boops and light gaming, not audio production.

Step #1: Get a real asio soundcard/interface.....

nineofkings · Post by **nineofkings** » Wed Dec 28, 2011 4:05 am

That's what I was asking. Is the problem my CPU or soundcard? I'm not just gonna spend $100 on a whim without some informed opinions first.

VitaminD · Post by **VitaminD** » Wed Dec 28, 2011 4:17 am

It's both CPU and audio driver

well its CPU

but if the audio driver isn't efficient, it will crackle under less CPU load...

eventually you'll get crackles no matter what, depending on how low a latency you chose (and thus a smaller buffer size). And ALSO based on CPU load over all... (some ASIO drivers+hardware are better with not crackling under higher CPU load than others)

If you don't have an audio interface with a dedicated ASIO driver, you'll want to start there.. ASIO4ALL only goes so far.. but, as already mentioned by others, it's a generic implementation so it isn't really efficient.

That said.. I've read a lot of complaints on cheapy Audio Interfaces even with dedicated ASIO drivers that they crackle and they end up using ASIO4ALL..

This is a situation where you might have to spend a little money (150+) to get decent ASIO support (if going external USB)

I'd research specific Audio Interfaces in which you might be interested and go from there...

ford442 · Post by **ford442** » Wed Dec 28, 2011 4:17 am

you should not have crackles at 20% CPU load.. that is unacceptable for music - it is hard to diagnose without the computer in front of us, but getting a good interface is always a good step - you will get better quality listening even at the same sample rates..

devaram · Post by **devaram** » Thu Dec 29, 2011 12:14 pm

IM following this thread as I have the same crackling problem on my core 2 duo lenovo laptop and wondering if I need to buy a new computer with i5 or i7 in order to produce music?
Is it simply a matter of getting a better audio card and how do you know which one to get for a specific computer?
By the way I downloaded asio4 all and it did not help at all.

Rangtangtang · Post by **Rangtangtang** » Thu Dec 29, 2011 12:40 pm

It can be realy comfusing whith the amount of things around to choose from and the continual changes of technology. Im still using a 32bit system, an M-audio card and Tracktion which Im still very happy whith. All I can say is if your running too many tracks at once and at the highest sample rate you might run into some problems. Iv been recording guitar at 44k and have not had any real problems. Only thing I can suggest is you need to realy get to know the settings whith your card. Iv got a control panel whith my M-audio card where I can adust the sample rate and latency, so I can get the best compromise. I find its more crucial whith recording guitar as opposed to recording synth. Traction is a very good compared to other programs in regards to sound cards and midi devices. Iv been using the USB port lately for the keyboard controller and have had no problems whith Tracktion recognising it.

nineofkings · Post by **nineofkings** » Sat Jan 07, 2012 3:14 am

Is an interface selectable as an audio device like ASIO4ALL or like a regular sound card?

Sound cards, audio interfaces, and latency