piano lessons slow going, methods to memorise?

[leighbeynon]

Ive been having piano lessons for around 4 years and while i can read music im not very fast, my aim was to play my own basic chord progressions and
create my own music,

all im doing is playing music by sight, and while im playing chords in songs im not learning chords,

im trying to figure out whats best for me, scale drills just keep doing them daily till i have them all memorised or i have a book that tells you to memorise all root positions of the triads memorise maj, then min, then learn intervals for all other chords, this is a method without using scales

im trying to figure out which one would help me the most?

[wrench45us]

The vast majority of people who pick up a guitar and learn to play start out by learning to strum chords and play songs. But piano instruction continues to insists that everyone who takes up piano wants to read sheet music. Years later some of those students find they can't play anythoing without sheet music.

So I'd suggest learningto play piano like most people lesrn guitar -- by chords and chord progressions and coming up with songs on your own.

at the very least some kind of balanced approach.

[Ogg Vorbis]

im trying to figure out which one would help me the most?

Do both! Be an "and" musician.

[shankfiddle]

im trying to figure out which one would help me the most?

Do both! Be an "and" musician.

YES!

AND pick up a guitar, why the hell not? learn as many instruments as possible, in music everything is interrelated and developing new skills will only help/support your growth.

[Nystul]

You aren't learning scales as part of your piano lessons in four years? It seems like you are being taught in a very strange way. Can you look at sheet music and tell what key the piece is in?

The key of a piece is really what ties everything together. The chords are derived from the scale, just like the melodies are. You would also want to practice inversions and different chord voicings so that they become automatic to you. But if you know the scale, you should be able to figure out the notes of the chords without having to count out intervals.

[JumpingJackFlash]

Ive been having piano lessons for around 4 years and while i can read music im not very fast, my aim was to play my own basic chord progressions and
create my own music,

In my experience, classical piano teaching isn't overly concerned with block chords. A lead sheet with Am, G7, Csus4 and so on is not really part of the standard repertoire. You will still play those chords of course, but they will often be 'hidden' in counterpoint (of course it depends on the style of music you play).

If you're looking for a more block-chord approach, might I suggest having keyboard lessons instead? Or alternatively finding a more jazz-based teacher rather than classical-based? Definitely work out exactly what you want and either get your teacher to teach you it, or find a different teacher.

In the meantime, keep practising. As will all things, it takes a while to become truly proficient. Read up on music theory - just the basics will do to start with. Work out how to play major triads starting on every note on the piano, then do all the minor triads, then all the dominant sevenths and so on. Begin harmonising simple tunes using only primary triads (in different keys), then gradually begin to expand your harmonic vocabulary.

[tapper mike]

A teacher can do many things. Including provide skills. One thing a most teachers can't do is teach creativity. They can promote it via jamming but not teach it. Some people have amazing skills at recreating existing music. That doen't always transcend to writing music.

When you are writing it's about what you are doing with your stuff. If someone says....Play this, or use this then it's no longer your stuff. When I was younger I would write prolificly. Because that's what I really really wanted to do. Strum the guitar and sing along. It didn't matter if the chord progression may or may have not been used by someone else. And the more you listen and study music the more you begin to realize similarities. The same chord progressions popping up over and over again with different treatments.

Your education thus far is not a waste. You've developed muscle memory as well as other useful things. It's on you to take it to the next level you want to go. Stop thinking it's got to come out perfect the first time or you need to learn more. If you can't write your own progression it's simply because you haven't tried. You are still waiting for someome to show you.
If you can't start it by yourself use an existing chord progression to work against and try working out familiar phrases. The blues is always a great place to start. It's fine to use classic licks, It's also fine not to play them exactly as you learned them. it's also fine to try out different accents or make your own stuff up as you go.

So Play the blues, Play a lick, Do you repeat it? Do you play a different lick afterwards? Do you change the accents? It's all about self determination and decision making. The key and progression decisions have already been made but the rest is on you. Jam with others if at all possible. Learn how to work off of them but not against them. Record yourself for yourself and no one else. Don't be judgemental over your performance just use it as a chart for your progress.

Then take it back to what ever you are doing. Start with a lick, start with a chord, start with a rhythm. Start with anything that is going to move you from point a to point b. If you don't have a finished product put it on a shelf after awhile to pull it up later. A half baked idea attempted is better then none.

[z.electric]

I know it can be boring... but learning scales really is good for you.

You'll learn more about the key than just the dominant chords.
You'll also improve your overall instrument handling.

Start with a basic C major scale, one with each had (watch a youtube clip to get the fingering right) and work your way through the keys.

The chords really just follow from the scales.

Good luck by the way, and good on you.

[sjm]

First off, talk to your teacher and tell them what you want. You might simply have the wrong teacher, or your teacher might not know what it is you want to learn. I had piano lessons that involved the same things you're talking about, and I didn't like it at all. It's why I stopped going to lessons.

Second off, do your own thing and just play the instrument. Sit down and play anything and try and develop it into something. Learn some standard chord progressions and learn to jam/improvise with them. Mike is right in that you can't teach creativity. That's something you need to develop yourself. A good teacher will open up possibilities for you, will pique your interest and keep you motivated; it's then up to you to make the most of what you're taught.

While knowing scales is important, and it's worth knowing what keys you need to hit, it's not the be all and end all. You'll train your fingers and brain by playing anything at all - it doesn't need to be scales. And playing a piece in a certain key will teach you to play in that key better than playing the scale ever will.

If you want to learn to create your own music, then create your own music. It's the only way to learn. It won't suddenly happen that you can do it after X years of lessons. In fact, you can write your own stuff with minimal knowledge, it's just easier when you know what you're doing in a general sense. And you get better at it the more you do it.

I've played with classically trained musicians in the past, and it's happened quite a bit that they're completely lost when you say "It's in Am, just jam along, you'll soon know how it goes". They just say "but what am I supposed to play?". They're lost without sheet music; it sounds horrible, but to me, they're not musicians, they're parrots. Like the people who insist on playing guitar solos exactly like it's played on the recording when you're jamming, instead of just going with the flow. It's a skill, no question, but it won't help you do your own thing.

Conversely, I've got a good friend who only ever programmed music on a DAW. The first things he wrote were horrible, but every now and then he'd come up with something that works. I gave him some helpful general pointers, and he kept sticking with it. He must have written about 200 songs over the first year or so, of which 95% were awful. But after a while, he'd figured out what works, figured out what he was hearing in his head and how to implement it, and his songwriting really took off. He probably wouldn't know a Dsus2 from an A11, but he writes great tunes.

[gambaytheunspoken]

Dick Hyman, you may have heard of him, fantastic pianist and teacher. He has a cd-rom package out called A Century of Jazz Piano, you can buy it or use the videos on youtube. Here's a sampling:

Ciao!

[JumpingJackFlash]

I've played with classically trained musicians in the past, and it's happened quite a bit that they're completely lost when you say "It's in Am, just jam along, you'll soon know how it goes". They just say "but what am I supposed to play?". They're lost without sheet music; it sounds horrible, but to me, they're not musicians, they're parrots.

This is insulting. They are musicians, just a different sort of musician.
I could equally say that some jazz musicians are not "proper musicians" unless they can sight-read a Mozart piano concerto!
The world would be very boring if we were all good at the same thing.

[tapper mike]

Dick Hyman, you may have heard of him, fantastic pianist and teacher. He has a cd-rom package out called A Century of Jazz Piano, you can buy it or use the videos on youtube. Here's a sampling:

Ciao!

I've watched that video for hours and.... I still can't play the piano. Maybe because I don't have a keyboard and I've never really attempted with that video. With a teacher you are going to have to commit yourself to learning something rather then walking away when things get tough. And with a teacher the teacher generally has a good gauge (or should) of how you are progressing.

[stimresp]

4 years? Fire your teacher

This book is gold.

[sjm]

This is insulting. They are musicians, just a different sort of musician.
I could equally say that some jazz musicians are not "proper musicians" unless they can sight-read a Mozart piano concerto!
The world would be very boring if we were all good at the same thing.

I did say it was a horrible thing to say... But I take it you can understand where I'm coming from. To me, music is a creative endeavour, and while this video is fascinating, I don't think the bird is demonstrating any creativity.



Maybe I'm just frustrated because our band's new guitarist is one of those "let's play it exactly like the studio version" guitar players. I really don't see the point of that kind of thing. I can see the point of being able to play Mozart the way Mozart wrote it down - in terms of people going to a concert might expect a piece to sound a certain way - but I personally prefer it when people interpret pieces their own way, thereby making the piece their own.

I definitely think that there's something to be said for the "musician" who can play with anyone from any culture without needing to be told what to do; this is something that to me distinguishes the accomplished musician from an also-ran. I guess that at the end of the day, I see a "musician" as someone with an innate grasp of musical concepts - someone who can quickly join in without the need to have everything explained to them - rather than a technical virtuoso. Of course, it's even better if you can combine the two

I guess an analogy might be art forgeries - making a good forgery takes a special set of (technical) skills to do it well, but to me the true artist is the one the created the original work of art. That doesn't mean that I don't appreciate the skills, just that (to me) technical skill alone does not an artist make. On the other hand there are artists whose technical skills are so-so, but whose art is nonetheless compelling.