KVR Audio

DPINCGK · Post by **DPINCGK** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 3:25 am

I imagine this has been posted before, so please pardon me if there are other existing threads.

I just love the sounds of Roland's XV and JV synths. I keep wishing there was a virtual version. If there was an authentic version with all of the ROM samples and possibly even an improved version - I'd spend good money for it.

I think the presets and performances in just the base unit, and a number of the expansion cards are usually very good. Many are easily playable, (they are actually FUN and inspiring to play), they usually work well in a mix, and I have not found a virtual synth yet that is the holy grail "all in one" replacement for this hardware unit so far. In my efforts to go virtual I keep finding myself wanting to reach for an XV hardware unit.

I assume today's computers would be capable of replicating the XV's capabilities, and I wonder if Roland would consider creating a virtual synth to reach what I imagine is a very large market.

Any thoughts on this?

Blue Wind Project · Post by **Blue Wind Project** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 3:41 am

Have you tried Cakewalk ' Rapture ' by Roland ?

meldavid · Post by **meldavid** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 3:48 am

A lot of the JV patches are trying to emulate other instruments though like pianos, eps, organs, guitars, and popular synth patches. Other VSTs have already surpassed the JV in these areas.

I don't think you would have to develop a whole new VSTi. Any synth capable of 4 sample layers with filter/amp envelopes and LFOs and basic effects should be able to recreate JV patches.

Just reverse-engineer your favourite JV patches to see what short samples were layered and try and recreate it.

Me I don't bother, as I've still got an XP-50, but I'll be getting rid of it once I've imported all the music created on it into my DAW. I'm not that attached to its patches.

Spitfire31 · Post by **Spitfire31** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 3:57 am

This is really a non-issue. The only thoughts worth hearing on the subject would obviously come from Roland themselves and they, equally obviously, are not going to share them until that (unlikely!) moment when a release is imminent.

I'm not sure if Korg's venture into soft versions of their classic flagships attracted "a very large market".

The obvious solution: just hang on to your XV/JV synths! I'm certainly going to keep my JV 1080 with lots of expansions - at least until I've established if I can conserve the best sounds in a playable Kontakt version courtesy of AutoSampler.

Kind regards,

Joachim

DPINCGK · Post by **DPINCGK** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 4:16 am

Thanks for the recommendation. I have Cakewalk's Dimension Pro but not Rapture. I will check that out.

DPINCGK · Post by **DPINCGK** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 4:17 am

mel I agree with you. My assumption is that it should be possible to recreate JV/XP patches and performances in today's computer technology. It's just that there are 1083 waveforms and tons of presets in the original unit! The good thing is that for today's standards, the JV/XV have small sample sets, and 4 layers per patch with filters and envelopes, etc.

DPINCGK · Post by **DPINCGK** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 4:17 am

Joachim, I just believe Roland would have a hit if they developed some software versions - they are in the best position to do so with the licensing agreements of the original content and ROM set data in their hands. Hopefully it would only enhance sales of their newer hardware instead of competing with it.

mkdr · Post by **mkdr** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 9:20 am

It certainly is possible with computer technology. But only Roland can do it so that it's authentic and true to the originals sound. That means, all the exact samples and algorithms as used in the originals..
There's no way you can replace JV/XV synth sounds with current software offerings. Even the first JV series synths sound so much more expressive and characteristic than any other synths(hw or sw). Arguments like "any synth with 4 layers can replicate it" are total bs!

Spitfire31 · Post by **Spitfire31** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 10:30 am

You also have to consider that probably some part of 'the Roland sound' lies in the hardware being used (D/A and so on). That aspect could probably be modelled, at an additional developing cost.

The bottom line is: would Roland believe they'll have a hit selling soft-JV:s? So far, apparently not - not even a soft D-50, which would be an obvious first choice. I believe that Roland is quite satisfied with including selected D-50 an JV emulations in their current h/w synths.

As in all businesses, the bottom bottom line would be: could Roland make any significant net profit, even if a hypothetical soft emulation would be a 'hit', now that even highly sophisticated VI:s sell for a hundred bucks?

/Joachim

liquid wind · Post by **liquid wind** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 11:07 am

Spitfire31 wrote:The bottom line is: would Roland believe they'll have a hit selling soft-JV:s? So far, apparently not

It's funny because you read things like this right now

mkdr wrote:Even the first JV series synths sound so much more expressive and characteristic than any other synths(hw or sw). Arguments like "any synth with 4 layers can replicate it" are total bs!

But like everything on KVR, you know the minute that gets released as software the release thread will instantly devolve into "but does it sound like a virus?"

Evan · Post by **Evan** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 11:45 am

If I were Roland (or Korg or whatever), I would create hardware recreations of these popular synths. Maybe combine a JV and D-50 in a single modern synth, and charge good money for it. I don't think they're worth to be made in software, with piracy and all. Just my opinion.

meldavid · Post by **meldavid** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 11:59 am

According to this page,
Eric Piersing would be the guy to make a virtual JV-1080 happen.

A future Omnisphere bank perhaps?

UltraJv · Post by **UltraJv** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 12:03 pm

This comes up frequently. I think it was Atmosphere that had quite a few of those sounds. Eric was quoted as saying that its boring to make stuff based on the past.

DPINCGK · Post by **DPINCGK** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 3:29 pm

Interesting opinions, and good points! Thanks -

A couple reactions - I think Omnisphere is an absolutely excellent product that has Eric's touch and it is also fun to play, expressive and inspiring. Like the Roland synths he developed.

Is recreating the past boring? Perhaps. However, Arturia certainly did a nice job on their classic synth emulations and it could be argued that they've even been successful doing it. Even Omnisphere uses source material from classic synths, so there is some value in what has been done in the past.

Is there any business demand or consumer interest to recreate a Roland JV/XV type synth in software? Would it be a profitable venture? I would imagine there is probably more consumer interest than is initially thought, but I could see that it may not be a highly profitable product. That said, Roland had developed software they generated absolutely no profit on - such as the editor librarians for the XV they gave away for free.

Agreed that software piracy is something every software manufacturer including Spectrasonics has to address and hopefully overcome.

To me, the true core value of the JV/XV is really the great work the sound designers did in developing source patches and performances. The most important thing to me is that I found it to be a very good sounding, useful and convenient sound set all in one unit that covered a lot of bases. It was usually my first "go-to" for a lot of projects to develop new ideas and create sketches, even if I replaced a few of the sounds later on. A virtual version could benefit from all the advantages of soft synths.

UltraJv · Post by **UltraJv** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 3:36 pm

There is probably a market of around 100 or so. Not enough to do anything about or it would have been done. Roland did try with Virtual Sound Canvas way back. Korg tried it with Legacy and now both are discontinued. I know its not what you want to hear but thats the way it is. Wont ever happen. There have been a few discussions on it that just faded away.

Roland JV / XV-5080 - could a virtual synth be developed?