Beginner producer - I'm stuck

[Puusti]

Okay, so I have been producing for less than 3 months, and even though my productions are becoming a little better it feels like I am stuck somehow. All my melodies sound the same, and the overall tracks too.
I try to 'copy' other producers arrangements and make something different, but in the end it sounds like the previous song.

Take a look at my Soundcloud, and listen to a couple of songs:

http://soundcloud.com/puusti

I also made this melody quick. No mixing, but it is just for demonstration purposes:

http://www4.zippyshare.com/v/97451897/file.html

I know my mixing and mastering sucks (the EQ is not my best friend so to say ), but that is not what I need help with.
My songs are boring. I want to advance, do something refreshing. Give me some guidance, tips, constructive criticism, whatever. It's highly appreciated.

[lfm]

I think you have a very good feel for how to build song and make it varied enough to make it interesting listening to.

I'm not into dance music and you should just note that when reading my comment.

What comes through after some songs is that you use only the main chords notes as melody. You could just as well use an automatic arpeggiator, it would use the same notes.

By that I mean - figure out an melody over a chord progression that uses notes in the key that not only are part of the main major or minor chords.

My guess that is what you feel also - saying it sounds the same.
You can only vary frasing of three notes that much.

You could almost say there is not melody at all. It's just a background track.

A couple of things I would do:

a) Over a chord progression, make up a melody that is not part of main chord notes only.

b) Use bridges/breaks that alter the key in a song to make it more varied. I don't know how chorus fits into dance music - but I think it might need that as well.

c) Productionwise there are just lows and highs, almost no mids. I don't have the best headphones on this computer, but still I think there is something about which frequencies that are represented.

You said something about EQ is not your friend - I think maybe you use it too much, really! Could be the monitors you use when mixing or something. A couple of the songs felt very much EQ'd and added highs.

d) Maybe use some other patches/sounds as instruments. Arrangements are too similar.

Or that is just because I'm not into dance music, I don't know.

[itsNano]

my best suggestion to you would be: don't try to be someone else. It's not going to get you anywhere. Also, your sounds seem a little empty. I think it's because you drain too much bass out of your tracks. Try to keep some bass in the songs, it adds power and flavor to a track. Last but not least, practice practice practice... read up on different tricks n tips. There is a lot of good info on dance music production in this forum, so feel free to do some reading. Like I always say: better to read now then later xD. Good luck!

[Puusti]

I think you have a very good feel for how to build song and make it varied enough to make it interesting listening to.

I'm not into dance music and you should just note that when reading my comment.

What comes through after some songs is that you use only the main chords notes as melody. You could just as well use an automatic arpeggiator, it would use the same notes.

By that I mean - figure out an melody over a chord progression that uses notes in the key that not only are part of the main major or minor chords.

My guess that is what you feel also - saying it sounds the same.
You can only vary frasing of three notes that much.

You could almost say there is not melody at all. It's just a background track.

A couple of things I would do:

a) Over a chord progression, make up a melody that is not part of main chord notes only.

b) Use bridges/breaks that alter the key in a song to make it more varied. I don't know how chorus fits into dance music - but I think it might need that as well.

c) Productionwise there are just lows and highs, almost no mids. I don't have the best headphones on this computer, but still I think there is something about which frequencies that are represented.

You said something about EQ is not your friend - I think maybe you use it too much, really! Could be the monitors you use when mixing or something. A couple of the songs felt very much EQ'd and added highs.

d) Maybe use some other patches/sounds as instruments. Arrangements are too similar.

Or that is just because I'm not into dance music, I don't know.

Amazing post, you had some really good points there. I am gonns try not to use the chord notes as melody as much.

Thank you!

my best suggestion to you would be: don't try to be someone else. It's not going to get you anywhere. Also, your sounds seem a little empty. I think it's because you drain too much bass out of your tracks. Try to keep some bass in the songs, it adds power and flavor to a track. Last but not least, practice practice practice... read up on different tricks n tips. There is a lot of good info on dance music production in this forum, so feel free to do some reading. Like I always say: better to read now then later xD. Good luck!

I know, I am trying too hard to make "avicii-sounding" tracks.
The next tune I make I am gonna try make slightly less cliche and more original.

I made this one earlier today in an hour, but i still think it came out pretty good, except the mixing and mastering:

http://soundcloud.com/puusti/just-a-little-idea

[deathwish]

pretty good for only being a musician for 3 months

[Nanakai]

I know, I am trying too hard to make "avicii-sounding" tracks.
The next tune I make I am gonna try make slightly less cliche and more original.

I made this one earlier today in an hour, but i still think it came out pretty good, except the mixing and mastering:

http://soundcloud.com/puusti/just-a-little-idea

Don't get too caught up in "originality" - it seems you've tapped into a creative vein, which is all that really matters. Which notes to play and how to mix are skills that can be worked on, but don't knock the simple fact that you have already created something that is your own!

My advice is to do the same things you have done to make a new song. Once you have a basic idea, you can transform parts of it to create variations. Start simple: grab a couple of bars and, while keeping all of the notes in the same rhythm, change their pitches around. Or, keep their same pitches but change their rhythm. Take lfm's advice to heart and throw in some non-chord tones. Don't destroy your original idea, but try to create from it.

Or don't. Whatevs.

[tibah]

pretty good for only being a musician for 3 months

+1

When I started out, nothing sounded like I wanted it to sound. For 3 months into this you actually are doing pretty well already from what I hear, obviously a great foundation there already. Listen to more music, listen to various genres and get some bits about the things you want to get better in and I'm sure you will get better and better.

[deathwish]

I was being sarcastic.

[Puusti]

I was being sarcastic.

I was just coming to say thanks.

[Tricky-Loops]

You have done nothing musically before and produce music since 3 month??

I can't believe that. There seems to be a remarkable foundation, otherwise it wouldn't sound so good compared to a real beginner.

[jam92189]

I was being sarcastic.

+1
i spent years learning how to play guitar well. so i like this guys post.
but on a fair note it is built on a decent structure i think the people i know who are into this sorta stuff would like it. I mix more rock and thrash metal some rap music but i mix actually instruments that where actually played. I just hate how the keyboard and mouse have stolen the life form music.

Okay enough on how I hate dance music. Honestly i would agree more mid range would be nice and also that arpagiator idea is a great one maybe try adding things like some melodic stuff arpagiating with some distortion on it to really cut through the mix. over all i would say it sounds to smooth it needs some life.and adding some mid range grit would help balance out the mix.

[jam92189]

also I dont thing it needs to be more complex maybe just some cool stuff like panning tricks making something pan left to right in a arpagiated ping pong would be cool to add a sense of space.

[Puusti]

You have done nothing musically before and produce music since 3 month??

I can't believe that. There seems to be a remarkable foundation, otherwise it wouldn't sound so good compared to a real beginner.

I started producing 3 months ago. I have no "musical" background, but I have listened to alot of house music.

I was being sarcastic.

+1
i spent years learning how to play guitar well. so i like this guys post.
but on a fair note it is built on a decent structure i think the people i know who are into this sorta stuff would like it. I mix more rock and thrash metal some rap music but i mix actually instruments that where actually played. I just hate how the keyboard and mouse have stolen the life form music.

Okay enough on how I hate dance music. Honestly i would agree more mid range would be nice and also that arpagiator idea is a great one maybe try adding things like some melodic stuff arpagiating with some distortion on it to really cut through the mix. over all i would say it sounds to smooth it needs some life.and adding some mid range grit would help balance out the mix.

I understand what you mean, and I'm not saying that i'm a musician or anything. I just like house music and doing creative stuff.

And thanks for the feedback man, I appreciate it!

[jam92189]

You have done nothing musically before and produce music since 3 month??

I can't believe that. There seems to be a remarkable foundation, otherwise it wouldn't sound so good compared to a real beginner.

I started producing 3 months ago. I have no "musical" background, but I have listened to a lot of house music.

that is one of the biggest things all musicians need when they are learning. and that's why you have such a strong foundation so early. I would say don't worry about sounding like everyone else focus on making your music sound good and exciting for you and your audience who cares what DJ spiny top or whoever sounds like.

[MOK19]

Consider call-and-response techniques. Where one instrument plays a segment for like 4 counts, then you lay off, and replace it with another instrument do something that goes with it.

Also consider stretching your chord progression out longer instead of changing chords every 2 beats.

Also consider using the 3/16th timing a little less often. It's catchy, but extremely common nowadays. EXTREMELY common. Try using it as a non-repetitive tool, to create occasional syncopation in un-syncopated sections.

Automate everything. As soon as the texture of something is basically established and understood, it's possible to cram in a lot of textural variation.

Similarly, once a hook or theme has been established, you can sometimes interrupt that series of notes and cords and still get away with it.

Augment into a different key during different phases of the song.

The energy dynamics do not need to be constrained to Build/Breakdown patterns. Entire sections are allowed to be more mellow without being a breakdown section. Sticking with build/breakdown patterns is like a pendulum swinging back and forth between extremities, when there's a perfectly good, big and useful middle-ground to be used. Meanwhile, when the audience is led to anticipates an extremity, it will be more difficult for them to be satisfied with the middle ground. So traverse the energy spectrum with a little more conservative care and foresight, so that you have more options throughout the song. In other words, don't blow your load so quick.

Try working with audio instead of MIDI for some parts. Different methods yield different sounds.

Try out using resolution more strategically. Notice when some notes and chords BEG to be resolved by returning to the root of the scale, and try to get away with NOT doing that.


Study the musical patterns of some music you like that sounds nothing like Aviici, to understand why it sounds the way it sounds. The contrast between it and Aviici/you will become useful knowledge. I did this recently by studying Quincy Jones(the crazy rad musician behind Michael Jackson's Thriller), and it taught me a lot about my habits by seeing Quincy Jones' habits.