KVR Audio

UltraJv · Post by **UltraJv** » Wed May 23, 2012 8:47 pm

There is mystique surrounding Blue Monday bass. When they perfomed it live, they couldnt remember how it was done so lifted it from original session. They knew it was a combination of 2 hardware synths. So they dont know how to do it either

KozzyKoz · Post by **KozzyKoz** » Wed May 23, 2012 9:04 pm

never seen or heard anyone play lead bass the way hooky did, and does, no one can anyways.. why try to emulate, or duplicate, try something new, that's what is genius about the sounds, styles we want to emulate. make something new, try something new.. maybe someday you'll see someone wanting to emulate you.. but if anyone tried to emulate me, i wouldnt want them too.. I'd want them to do something new.. sorry for being a downer on your thread...

braj · Post by **braj** » Wed May 23, 2012 9:09 pm

I'm not trying to emulate him in my music, it is similar to getting an accurate piano sound IMO, I just wanted to fiddle with it. People sample so many things and no one says 'be original' about that, so come on, don't be obtuse. Anyhow it was sort of a bored 'challenge' thing I thought up waiting to see my doctor, but you want to be like that be my guest

braj · Post by **braj** » Wed May 23, 2012 9:16 pm

So can someone make a good Bansuri flute sound in Trilian (is that less objectionable?)

noiseboyuk · Post by **noiseboyuk** » Wed May 23, 2012 11:01 pm

UltraJv wrote:
braj wrote:Out and about for the day, just thought I'd check and see if someone could share their recipe for the perfect New Order bass guitar sound in Trilian
Surely you cant be serious Its all in the technique - get the right acoustic bass and mic placement plus FX and playing style.

Eh? Acoustic bass?

I'd go for the picked rock p bass, slap ultrachorus on it, play it high and then he uses a lot of open strings drones. Obviously it's not HIM, but it's vaguely the right ballpark I'd say.

KozzyKoz · Post by **KozzyKoz** » Thu May 24, 2012 4:17 am

braj wrote:I'm not trying to emulate him in my music, it is similar to getting an accurate piano sound IMO, I just wanted to fiddle with it. People sample so many things and no one says 'be original' about that, so come on, don't be obtuse. Anyhow it was sort of a bored 'challenge' thing I thought up waiting to see my doctor, but you want to be like that be my guest

Are you for real?..Come on don't take yourself so seriously... I never said anything was objectionable. you want to copy and not grow as an artist, then by all means, your choice. As for sampling, I do a LOT of sampling and never try to sample or make sounds that are already available, takes all the fun out of it. As for comparing a piano sample to trying to copy an artists signature sound with a specific instrument.. apples and oranges.. come on braj.. use your time and energy and be creative. I am done, this could easily turn into a flame fest in which I have NO interest in, all the best in your future endeavours.

S

braj · Post by **braj** » Thu May 24, 2012 4:39 am

Well I'm glad you're done.

mholloway · Post by **mholloway** » Thu May 24, 2012 4:53 am

God this thread really epitomizes the pathetic, pointlessly condescending, holier-than-thou attitude of far too many members of this forum (and others like it). To half of the repliers in here: believe it or not, NOBODY gives a crap that you
feel 'above' emulating someone else's style, nobody gives a crap that you're such a talented, original artist that you would never lower yourself to ask a question like the OP'. So why bother wasting your and everybody else's time by posting here? It's a forum for discussing gear and being helpful, not for wagging your bullshit ego around.

to the OP: I own Trillian but sadly haven't messed around with it enough to be able to answer your question adequately. but I think the FX chain back then was *very* simple, which is to state the obvious, it was Chorus, Chorus, Chorus. Well just one really

but you know what I mean. Any bass guitar run through a chorus as insert at about 50% wet, and with the EQ pushing the mid-highs and highs will instantly start sounding very New Order-y regardless of what you are playing.

if I find anything in Trillian I'll be sure to let you know.

-M

LBN · Post by **LBN** » Thu May 24, 2012 5:00 am

KozzyKoz wrote:but if anyone tried to emulate me, i wouldnt want them too..

I seriously doubt that's something you'll have to worry about.

braj · Post by **braj** » Thu May 24, 2012 5:04 am

mholloway wrote:I own Trillian but sadly haven't messed around with it enough to be able to answer your question adequately. but I think the FX chain back then was *very* simple, which is to state the obvious, it was Chorus, Chorus, Chorus. Well just one really but you know what I mean. Any bass guitar run through a chorus as insert at about 50% wet, and with the EQ pushing the mid-highs and highs will instantly start sounding very New Order-y regardless of what you are playing.

Thanks, Yeah i haven't messed with the effects enough really myself, I know the basic setup he used (via Wikipedia):

The main equipment Hook used during the early days of New Order was an Alembic F-2B preamp/ Roland rack unit/ Amcron DC-300A power amp fed through two large custom built 2 x 15 Gauss loaded flightcase cabinets designed and built by Chris Hewitt of Tractor Music. These can be seen in the "Love Will Tear Us Apart" music video, as can Hook's Yamaha BB1200. The Alembic- Amcron- Gauss system was designed by Peter Hook, Chris Hewitt and Martin Hannett. In the earlier days of Joy Division, Hook used a Hiwatt Custom 100 Watt head initially on top of a Vox Bass Cabinet and then later on top of a 4x15 Gauss loaded Marshall cabinet put together by Tractor. The Marshall 4 x 15 Gauss cabinet was stolen during New Order's first visit to America. He has also used an Ampeg SVT rig, and has expressed interest in Ashdown amplification.

For the most part, his distinctive tone comes from the use of a chorus pedal, an Electro-Harmonix Clone Theory. This has recently been reissued by Electro-Harmonix, and whilst having the same circuitry as the original has a somewhat different tone than the original 1970s ones (described by many reviewers/players as "less exciting").

With Revenge and Monaco, he updated an Ampeg SVT, which is used at maximum volume when playing live.[5][6]

In New Order from 1990 onwards Hook used Hiwatt 200 watt heads mounted on Hiwatt 1x15 and 4x10 combined speaker cabinets with Fane speakers.

He is currently using Trace Elliot amplification.

I'm thinking that it may be easiest actually to do the 'emulation' just using a Fender bass from Trilian and then run that through an amp sim, at lest my PodFarm plugin is a little more clear to me and I can get the configuration done easiest. I'll try that. Just I thought this was all just an interesting thing to try to make in Trilian, like i said a 'challenge'

and really didn't expect the creativity police to come around. I mean WFT if I was in a New Order cover band or something, or I just wanted that tone for a song, what exactly is so bad about that anyhow? The funny thing is from what I've read so many famous singers and musicians got their style at failed attempts to emulate others

it is just ironic to me that such comments show up here. But just like assholes everyone has an ego, I should have expected it actually.

braj · Post by **braj** » Thu May 24, 2012 5:14 am

And now for something completely different:

http://www.southparkstudios.com/full-ep ... groundable

Edit: actually I meant to post the entire episode, I love Southpark.

KozzyKoz · Post by **KozzyKoz** » Thu May 24, 2012 6:48 am

All I was simply trying to get across, is that in my opinion, there is so much to be gained by trying something different, pushing the envelope, instead of trying to rehash something, that in my opinion was done quite well the first time. I honestly feel, with all the equipment available to us, we have become bogged down, and less creative. I would be way more interested in seeing what tone Braj could come up with in trying to do something original.. we have become preset monsters. I do not appriciate the remarks and insinuations.. I do not believe that I am an elitist, or a creativity cop. Is there not a constructive way you people can speak. Don't waste so much time hating..It does no one any good. I would like an apology, I feel I was wrongly attacked. As for questioning my ability, or chance of ever being emulated, I am sorry you feel so negative about my skill since you know so much about me, and haqve heard tons of what I have done. That was a dick move.

Braj I wish you well, in search of Hooky's tone.. I hope you find some interesting sounds on the way.

P)lease grow up people, i never questioned anyones person, or hurled insults please act properly

SK

braj · Post by **braj** » Thu May 24, 2012 7:19 am

KozzyKoz wrote:sorry for being a downer on your thread...

See you should have know right there, and probably did know, that you were off-base with your comment. And an apology? Well, I'm sorry that you posted in this thread and tried to impose your limited view of what is 'creative' or whatever. Thanks anyway for trying, I guess

Have a nice day.

Brittlestem · Post by **Brittlestem** » Thu May 24, 2012 7:23 am

KozzyKoz wrote:All I was simply trying to get across, is that in my opinion, there is so much to be gained by trying something different, pushing the envelope, instead of trying to rehash something, that in my opinion was done quite well the first time. I honestly feel, with all the equipment available to us, we have become bogged down, and less creative. I would be way more interested in seeing what tone Braj could come up with in trying to do something original.. we have become preset monsters. I do not appriciate the remarks and insinuations.. I do not believe that I am an elitist, or a creativity cop. Is there not a constructive way you people can speak. Don't waste so much time hating..It does no one any good. I would like an apology, I feel I was wrongly attacked. As for questioning my ability, or chance of ever being emulated, I am sorry you feel so negative about my skill since you know so much about me, and haqve heard tons of what I have done. That was a dick move.

Braj I wish you well, in search of Hooky's tone.. I hope you find some interesting sounds on the way.

P)lease grow up people, i never questioned anyones person, or hurled insults please act properly

SK

"Come on don't take yourself so seriously..."

braj · Post by **braj** » Thu May 24, 2012 7:37 am

I have to say I find it hilariously absurd that I asked a simple question, and instead of answering someone chose to give a self-righteous, condescending spiel and then demand an apology

ya gotta love the internet! I really dig the advice from KVRers, I love the humor too, and I even gotta love the nonsense. This place is so entertaining

Peter Hook bass sound in Trilian?