Wow, Rack Extensions are expensive

[ObsoleteAcc99]

[DELETED]

[ChiTown24]

Simple answer

Simple it may be but no less weird!
thanks for giving it though


sonic charge
magnus malmström
sugarbytes sugar bytes
softtube soft tube
microtonic
utonic
synplant
bitspeek
audio damage chris randall
u-he urs heckmann
{just trying to trigger some google alerts}


again i've got to ask why the devs {the ones who claim to have their hands tied by the propheads re;; crossgrading at least} won't just insist on crossgrade prices being facilitated, or certainly at the very least being supplied with the names of who's buying their plugs so they can work it from there end more easily, or even try to workaround it without the propheads direct help - and if not refuse to support the format. The devs are the very essence of this Rack Extension idea. Without the devs, there is no Rack Extensions ... just more proprietary in-house Reason synths/fx at an extra charge. The devs have all the power & influence they need to make this happen very quickly - so why aren't they exercising that power ?

In lieu of that, they could even insist on an official guarantee that crossgrading will be implemented.

Why isnt this being done ? ive mentioned this a few times in this thread in amongst some other points i made, ive got a few direct responses from sean@valhalladsp urs@u-he magnus@soniccharge only addressing imo the incidental issues raised or alluded to like the time it takes or doesnt take to port existing code to RE. Please address this point directly so i can stop bringing it up! Sean of course has answered me directly, kudos to him for both answering me and the answer he gave {he wont currently support the format, and is in 'devs should exercise their influence to bring crossgrading in to affect' camp. }


i decided i would start looking at more promo vids in case there are any other inconsistencies between the vids and the, imo, mealy mouthed excuses im seeing from some devs {or even complete avoidance} re;; crossgrading

how about this one;;
http://www.synthtopia.com/content/2012/ ... interview/

magnus@soniccharge talking about the vast reduction, in the long run, on development overhead and how much time it frees up for him. no cheeky editing in this one!
watch the whole thing, the last question he is asked is about pricing and he is very cagey about the topic. interesting stuff!


this isnt an issue to villainize devs about, theres time and opportunity to change these policies while we're at such an early stage. i think the pressure can be applied in a respectful non-inflammatory way. if the devs wont play their extremely strong hand then maybe it comes down to the relevant end-users {existing reason licensees who would be eligible for crossgrades} to plainly & simply state publicly that they wont be buying plugs they already own in the RE format until some kind of crossgrade option is offered. nor will they pony up for some kind of intro-offer in lieu of it.

i would start a poll about it, and encourage other eligible patrons to follow suit in not buying RE plugs they already own in vst/au format until crossgrades are offered.
but i dont own reason.
i also dont know what forum would be the best place to do it;;
KVR {vst/au licensees who might also own reason} or the propheads forum {reason licensees who might also own the relevant vst/aus} or both

however when reasonable crossgrading is available i will absolutely buy a reason license and subsequently the crossgrades of all my favorite plugins. for whatever that is worth.

[v1o]

I mean, the individual extensions aren't that expensive.. But they're also quite simple and limited for the price. If you buy several, it quickly adds up to a lot of money.

E.g. there's an extremely limited (judging by the GUI) "analog bass synth" for €50. Not a lot of money, but you can buy the U-He Ace or any number of other, far more flexible synths for €70 - €100. Even some of the more expensive (€200 - €300 range) "monster-synths" give you a lot of value for your money since they're so flexible and versatile.

It's very simple, if you dont think its worth it, then dont buy it! And besides its still early days, U-he is going to be on-board soon as well as G-Force Software and Korg with their synths.

Just like the Apple App Store if you dont like something, you ignore and look for something else that catches your fancy within your price range. The RE store is not any different in that aspect, there will be a variety of different products, from different devs, within different price ranges, to suit different people.

You cant really pass judgement on a store that has only been online for two weeks! Do you know how long it took Valve's Stream to really settle in? When Stream first came out everyone whinged about it - saying it was shiite. No one liked it. Now that everything has settled, its the best thing ever to happen to PC gaming. Likewise with the RE store, prices will settle down eventually as business models get settled and there will be big sales where prices do get slashed. There will also be more stuff added eventually so will you have more choices.

Same with effects - Buffer Override is €40, a Ring Modulator is €65 etc. There are some great VST effect bundles that give you everything you need for not much more - there are even some good freeware ones.

Definitely a bit of mark-up and exploitation of brand recognition here. I hope in the future they offer bundles (based on a category of extensions or a certain developer). Otherwise I'll stick fully with VST's.

Ohhhh how about Etch Red and the Softube stuff? Otherwise same as above, if you dont like something then don't buy it.

VSTs are more costly, try buying the RND portico suite from Steinberg or the Lexicon Reverb Suite, or other high end plugins from Steven slate, UAD or Waves. These are all more dear than anything on the RE store.

[ChiTown24]

You cant really pass judgement on a store that has only been for two weeks! Do you know how long it took Valve's Stream to really settle in? When Stream first came out everyone whinged about it - saying it was shiite. No one liked it. Now its the best thing to happen to PC gaming.

/\/\/\/\
\/\/\/\/

Yes, and that is also why it's important that people that are against the "no re-selling policy" and the "no crossgrades" policy are making their voices heard so that props can re-evaluate their stance.

this. a thousand times this!

[liquidsound]

Nothing less than full plug-in support would ever make me consider Reason, the poor excuse of Rack Extensions just doesn't cut it. They are just overly paranoid about stability, it's time they stopped worrying and just got on with it.

Yeap.
S1 is as stable as a rock without any propellers over their heads...

really? S1 crashes for me at least 5 times every few hours..

but i heard this is a mac version problem..

ok i now have reason open in backround with my logictech laptop speaker bar (usb 1.1) set at 64 samples which is giving a true reading of 2ms output (mac standard usb 1.1 core audio driver)

have opened ALL the demo tracks and playing them one by one in the backround whilst i am surfing KVR, answering emails and juggling a lot of stuff around, and not a single pop or dropout yet.

Crash? I don't know what that means since i bought Reason. Seriously.

That's great.
Both of us are in heaven then. I keep my CAD program running all the time as well and no crash.
Just Reason? I don't think so. But I rather have a little incident with a Ferrary then drive a Volvo that still crash eventually here and there. Crashing VST has nothing to do with choosing Reason over the rest of the "defective" world where 90% of the music is made now and forever.

[ObsoleteAcc99]

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[ObsoleteAcc99]

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[ObsoleteAcc99]

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[munchkin]

I mean, the individual extensions aren't that expensive.. But they're also quite simple and limited for the price. If you buy several, it quickly adds up to a lot of money.

E.g. there's an extremely limited (judging by the GUI) "analog bass synth" for €50. Not a lot of money, but you can buy the U-He Ace or any number of other, far more flexible synths for €70 - €100. Even some of the more expensive (€200 - €300 range) "monster-synths" give you a lot of value for your money since they're so flexible and versatile.

It's very simple, if you dont think its worth it, then dont buy it! And besides its still early days, U-he is going to be on-board soon as well as G-Force Software and Korg with their synths.

Just like the Apple App Store if you dont like something, you ignore and look for something else that catches your fancy within your price range. The RE store is not any different in that aspect, there will be a variety of different products, from different devs, within different price ranges, to suit different people.

You cant really pass judgement on a store that has only been online for two weeks! Do you know how long it took Valve's Stream to really settle in? When Stream first came out everyone whinged about it - saying it was shiite. No one liked it. Now that everything has settled, its the best thing ever to happen to PC gaming. Likewise with the RE store, prices will settle down eventually as business models get settled and there will be big sales where prices do get slashed. There will also be more stuff added eventually so will you have more choices.

Same with effects - Buffer Override is €40, a Ring Modulator is €65 etc. There are some great VST effect bundles that give you everything you need for not much more - there are even some good freeware ones.

Definitely a bit of mark-up and exploitation of brand recognition here. I hope in the future they offer bundles (based on a category of extensions or a certain developer). Otherwise I'll stick fully with VST's.

Ohhhh how about Etch Red and the Softube stuff? Otherwise same as above, if you dont like something then don't buy it.

VSTs are more costly, try buying the RND portico suite from Steinberg or the Lexicon Reverb Suite, or other high end plugins from Steven slate, UAD or Waves. These are all more dear than anything on the RE store.

And the moral is - never have an opinion or criticise unless you're v1o. It's simple, if you don't like something then don't read it!

[hibidy]

uh oh

[munchkin]

uh oh

I edited it slightly but I still think the OP made a fair comment. I'm ready to face the full wrath of the Reason orthodoxy.

[grymmjack]

http://shop.propellerheads.se/product/polysix/

That one is not over priced. It's the same price.

And it's great. Misses a few features of the VST, but the reason mixer makes it sound better than the plugin IMO.

[grymmjack]

I'm not high either, listen to the VST and compare the patches A:B.

In my test I'm using Ableton Live re-wiring Reason into it with no effects, all default fader levels, etc.

The RE sounds better passed through that mixer. Man, that's really making me wonder now...

If it sounds better because of the mixer console in reason it might be worth switching?

Someone check my ears, but I can hear it plainly. There is a more depth and sheen to the sound of the RE version (passing it through mixer I guess as I said).

[grymmjack]

Yep it's definitely the mixer. Going straight from the RE to the direct outs it sounds 99.99% the same

[grymmjack]

Hrm, no it sounds like even the direct out RE is a little better quality than the VST.