Hello,
I've been doing these exercizes where I have to orchestrate 3-part chorales for these instruments:
-Flute, oboe, clarinet, alto sax, tenor sax
-4 Horns, 3 trumpets, 3 trombones, euphonium, tuba
(-Percussion)
Here are some 3-part chorales so that we can talk about something concrete:
http://www3.cpdl.org/wiki/images/9/97/Luci_Care.pdf
http://www3.cpdl.org/wiki/images/3/33/062.pdf
Here is how I've been distributing the voices:
Upper voice: flute, oboe, clarinet, alto sax, 1st trumpet.
Middle voice: tenor sax, 2nd trumpet, euphonium.
Bass: 3rd trumpet, tuba.
My question is, I have no idea what to do with the 4 horns, the 1st and 2nd trombones. I usually know them as the instruments that play the chords in thirds and sixths, but here, I'm not supposed to add any notes that aren't in the 3-part chorale.
I thought it would be interesting to hear what other people would have done in this situation.
Orchestrating a 3-part chorale
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- KVRist
- 427 posts since 24 Sep, 2009
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- KVRAF
- 26033 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from gonesville
well... I don't know what kind of decision drove someone to come up with that many forces of that variety for that material.
it's going to be tough to make work artistically at all in my estimation. If I had to do it I would seek to morph instruments into the next one. Rather than a lot of doubling insts in the same range, overlaps and texture. There would be a lot of change in instrumentation. I guess I would look to the words for emotional context and see how the lines suited the feeling. That is the idea behind that particular music essentially.
as per "the chords in thirds and sixths" you need to lose that kind of idea forthwith, that is style and context-bound. if the example you linked to are the actual ones for the exercise, or you are in that style, chords are not the thinking at all, you need to think pure line. EG: A trombone has a range and a tone, it suits that line or it doesn't. Trumpet is not going to suit a bass line at all.
It looks pretty arbitrary to me, frankly, to assign that much to that particular material. EG: Four horns, that is bigass. I wouldn't know what to do with that myself. Three trumpets? well unison seems a better bet than distributing them. Vis a vis that style. but this band and that style seems incongruent.
First I would look to see vocal choirs doing that music, as a model. but you see there isn't going to be the kind of textural variance of instruments.
Overall I'm baffled. I can't blame you for thinking 'first, second, third trumpet' since really the whole setup suggests that. Maybe look for a model of bloated baroque arrangements or something, by conductors. which was fashionable a long time ago.
Is this inflicted on you in school? I think there may be a better use of time than this frankly. it's equivalent to a loaded question to me.
it's going to be tough to make work artistically at all in my estimation. If I had to do it I would seek to morph instruments into the next one. Rather than a lot of doubling insts in the same range, overlaps and texture. There would be a lot of change in instrumentation. I guess I would look to the words for emotional context and see how the lines suited the feeling. That is the idea behind that particular music essentially.
as per "the chords in thirds and sixths" you need to lose that kind of idea forthwith, that is style and context-bound. if the example you linked to are the actual ones for the exercise, or you are in that style, chords are not the thinking at all, you need to think pure line. EG: A trombone has a range and a tone, it suits that line or it doesn't. Trumpet is not going to suit a bass line at all.
It looks pretty arbitrary to me, frankly, to assign that much to that particular material. EG: Four horns, that is bigass. I wouldn't know what to do with that myself. Three trumpets? well unison seems a better bet than distributing them. Vis a vis that style. but this band and that style seems incongruent.
First I would look to see vocal choirs doing that music, as a model. but you see there isn't going to be the kind of textural variance of instruments.
Overall I'm baffled. I can't blame you for thinking 'first, second, third trumpet' since really the whole setup suggests that. Maybe look for a model of bloated baroque arrangements or something, by conductors. which was fashionable a long time ago.
Is this inflicted on you in school? I think there may be a better use of time than this frankly. it's equivalent to a loaded question to me.
Last edited by jancivil on Sun Jul 15, 2012 4:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
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- KVRian
- 1115 posts since 6 Jul, 2009
Couple things:
Don't feel pressured to use all of the instruments all of the time. That will create a very thick and monotonous orchestration that frankly will be ill-suited to the material you've presented.
You have repeats in each of the pieces. Take advantage of that by using different instruments, registers, and unison/octave doubles on the repeats.
Think in terms of the families (woodwinds, brass, etc) and make sure each family feels complete, behaves in sensible ways, and is well-balanced on its own. The way you are thinking about and distributing instruments strikes me as rather arbitrary and isn't going to provide a balanced sound. Additionally, think about the ranges of the instruments, what their best/most characteristic registers are, and exploit those facts.
Think carefully about each line, and decide if it should be doubled or not. If so, should it be at the unison, octave above, octave below, etc?
As a first step (based on what you've said, I think you need to do this to develop an intuition on what instruments pair together well, as well as how they're used), orchestrate this several times. The first, use only woodwinds (flutes, oboes, clarinets, saxophones--I assume this is meant to be in place of the bassoons--and French horns, which are traditionally used with the woodwinds). Next, do it for brass (trumpets, French horns, trombones, euphonium, tuba). Then, finally on the third time, use both woodwinds and brass.
You also mentioned percussion? Presumably timpani, and perhaps something else? What you're dealing with is a concert band, minus an instrument or so. You should look up recordings and familiarize yourself with that sound.
edit: Also, based on what you've written, it sounds like using this many instruments may be a bit ambitious for where you and your classmates are at the moment (plus, in my opinion, too big for the material you are orchestrating). Definitely take the time and do this separately for the different families of instruments.
Don't feel pressured to use all of the instruments all of the time. That will create a very thick and monotonous orchestration that frankly will be ill-suited to the material you've presented.
You have repeats in each of the pieces. Take advantage of that by using different instruments, registers, and unison/octave doubles on the repeats.
Think in terms of the families (woodwinds, brass, etc) and make sure each family feels complete, behaves in sensible ways, and is well-balanced on its own. The way you are thinking about and distributing instruments strikes me as rather arbitrary and isn't going to provide a balanced sound. Additionally, think about the ranges of the instruments, what their best/most characteristic registers are, and exploit those facts.
Think carefully about each line, and decide if it should be doubled or not. If so, should it be at the unison, octave above, octave below, etc?
As a first step (based on what you've said, I think you need to do this to develop an intuition on what instruments pair together well, as well as how they're used), orchestrate this several times. The first, use only woodwinds (flutes, oboes, clarinets, saxophones--I assume this is meant to be in place of the bassoons--and French horns, which are traditionally used with the woodwinds). Next, do it for brass (trumpets, French horns, trombones, euphonium, tuba). Then, finally on the third time, use both woodwinds and brass.
You also mentioned percussion? Presumably timpani, and perhaps something else? What you're dealing with is a concert band, minus an instrument or so. You should look up recordings and familiarize yourself with that sound.
edit: Also, based on what you've written, it sounds like using this many instruments may be a bit ambitious for where you and your classmates are at the moment (plus, in my opinion, too big for the material you are orchestrating). Definitely take the time and do this separately for the different families of instruments.
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 427 posts since 24 Sep, 2009
Thank you! I appreciate your advice.