Used sales of reason are SO high, it is time for props to take notice - serious topic, LONG post

[Trakstar]

I do not see a significant "rats leaving a sinking ship" effect here.. People who have stopped using Reason years ago just decide to sell their licences right now as there is some momentum in the app again.

FWIW I don't really care about the RE EULA policies, UA have similar policies (you can't resell the stuff you bought)
and they are still doing business. What I see here are customers who are too stuck on their own consuming habits, and reject everything that differs from their cozy. already established consuming habits.

U A allow resale but all in one as a bundle.

afaik RE can not be transferred whatsoever.

Again, props will not have a choice... either will Uaudio.. not for EU customers.. you will see it will change

For what its worth, I still like Reason and am just going to use it as is, and hope they keep it up to speed , who knows, they might even keep rack extensions as an optional extra and do seasonal updates, I wonder if we will ever see reason 7. Wishful thinking I suppose..Good Forum.

I expect to see Reason 7 but I think they are trying to transition Reason into a more traditional DAW but keep the integrity of what Reason has always been. I think they have been at this since version 3 or 4 and are slowly adding this stuff in as to not overwhelm their buyers. Idk Reason will always be a part of my tool box that is for sure. If for nothing else I have refills I really love.

Yeah, agreed, there are some really good refills you cannot get elsewhere. One of my personal favorites was norman cooks "skip to my loops", some realy funky breaks in there

[KevWestBeats]

A Reason user MUST believe it is complete: you have everything you need (this is the Propellerhead manthra). It is not true, of course, but their policy. Fanboys made me ban from PH forum because I was continuosly asking them "well, how can you reply sounds like omnisphere, pianoteq and absynth ones within reason" in perspective of vst support. That is why they introduced the RE thing: because of our vst support demand. They pretend in this way to make us "happy" and at the same time not to betray orthodox fanboys-against-plugins. And that is why we (i mean: the ones who have been asking patiently for vst support for 10 years) gave up and said bye bye. If you ask someone here "why you sell reason" the answer will be always the same: "because of no vst support". This is the only reason, alas. For what it offers it should cost half the price, or at least have vst support (like Orion, FL amd similar).

I use it as part of my tool box and I still feel its very complete and didn't need RE or vst support. No fanboy from here at all I will tell u everything that is wrong with it but no tool is perfect. Hell in fact Reason is my go to tool of choice most of the time. I don't need every plug in on the planet just like I don't need every RE out there and I tell the people on the Props forum to stop crying about the price too. Get what you need for your music and forget everything else exists or you will always feel you need more.

that is why i don't understand RE when presented as a "plugins alternative". It isn't of course. I mean, REs are fine if you consider them as new racks for reason: sort of "rack extensions" FOR reason. The problem is someone pretends them to be "vst IN reason". They aren't (i guess REs are 0,001% of total plugins), you have no choice (unless you think choosing among 15 REs can be called a choice). And, above all, the majority (yourslelf included) are very happy with Reason.

The thread is about "why so many people sell reason", right? For me it is because PH has never introduced VST support, and will never do. RE is not an answer for all those who wanted this feature. Just this.

I see it as a plug in alternative but you are right the options are not there yet. I actually said why do this round about shit at first too but adding vst to Reason would in many ways make Reason not Reason because of how its executed. I think RE is the best possible compromise. That said I have not bought a single RE but I have demoed a few. They are not making me sell any of my plug ins but I do see it as a new plug in format that I think will become just as standard as vst, Rtas, and AU once they get all the kinks ironed out for everyone. RE has only been out for a month I don't think we can expect it to have all the options vst does yet. Give it 5 years or so and I think it will be very common to have many if not most plug ins created in VST and RE format and released around the same time. If not then we will see what happens either way I think as a rewire user RE is a great option for instruments that might only be created for Reason. I love some vsts and I love some reason racks I don't want one or the other.

[jsp1979]

I do not see a significant "rats leaving a sinking ship" effect here.. People who have stopped using Reason years ago just decide to sell their licences right now as there is some momentum in the app again.

If there are indeed an increased number of Reason sales in the Market Place, then I find this explanation to be the most plausible (which actually means the introduction of RE has maybe increased interest...if perhaps only temporarily).

[liquidsound]

We also realize that probably anything coming new to future updates will be RE ($$) on top of the upgrade fee?. Then the "story" of PH having more time to focus on improvements....
10 years and now 50 workers...
BitWig 3 years? 4 people startup ?

I'm working with Reason for years and all I'm going to see is upgrades being turned into RE? Or get it now for free or else...
Maybe we should have a GUI option to have spiderwebs between cables to remember the old Reason world.

[KevWestBeats]

I do not see a significant "rats leaving a sinking ship" effect here.. People who have stopped using Reason years ago just decide to sell their licences right now as there is some momentum in the app again.

FWIW I don't really care about the RE EULA policies, UA have similar policies (you can't resell the stuff you bought)
and they are still doing business. What I see here are customers who are too stuck on their own consuming habits, and reject everything that differs from their cozy. already established consuming habits.

U A allow resale but all in one as a bundle.

afaik RE can not be transferred whatsoever.

Again, props will not have a choice... either will Uaudio.. not for EU customers.. you will see it will change

For what its worth, I still like Reason and am just going to use it as is, and hope they keep it up to speed , who knows, they might even keep rack extensions as an optional extra and do seasonal updates, I wonder if we will ever see reason 7. Wishful thinking I suppose..Good Forum.

I expect to see Reason 7 but I think they are trying to transition Reason into a more traditional DAW but keep the integrity of what Reason has always been. I think they have been at this since version 3 or 4 and are slowly adding this stuff in as to not overwhelm their buyers. Idk Reason will always be a part of my tool box that is for sure. If for nothing else I have refills I really love.

Yeah, agreed, there are some really good refills you cannot get elsewhere. One of my personal favorites was norman cooks "skip to my loops", some realy funky breaks in there

Mostly loops from vinyl in skip to my loops to my understanding. I have it too. I use it sometimes. For me its about Abbey Road Keyboards, Disco School and Soul School. Everything else is pretty replaceable as far as libraries are concerned. I cannot find a drum machine as deep as kong in one device and I love Thor but have recently been into Diva and Sylenth1. The Malstrom gets a lot of use lately too.

[eXode]

The really awkward part is that apparently there's an interview with props CEO in the latest issue of FM where he explicity states that there will be a solution for devs to give VST owners a free RE version... :)

I wonder when that interview was made...

FFS CHANGE YOUR POLICY NOW.. you will be losing too many sales.. DEVS WILL PULL OUT because of dismal sales, and RE's will FAIL. NO ONE wants to invest $1000 or more in RE's to find one day if they sell reason they have all that stuff unsellable in their account.

Please, stop this NONSENSE. Just STOP IT. And implement the crossgrade policy you initially promised OR lower your cut so devs can lower the prices.

[ObsoleteAcc99]

[DELETED]

[Frantz]

I think Reason are fighting a losing battle by maintaining the integrity of their "walled garden." They are turning Reason into a weird, limited, expensive DAW. I think they should have made Reason into a normal, fully-functional DAW that supports VSTs, MIDI out, and Reason-specific extensions. There will never be as many REs as there are VSTs. I expect Reason market share will decline as people get fed up with the limitations within "the garden."

[neverenoughfunk]

A Reason user MUST believe it is complete: you have everything you need (this is the Propellerhead manthra). It is not true, of course, but their policy. Fanboys made me ban from PH forum because I was continuosly asking them "well, how can you reply sounds like omnisphere, pianoteq and absynth ones within reason" in perspective of vst support. That is why they introduced the RE thing: because of our vst support demand. They pretend in this way to make us "happy" and at the same time not to betray orthodox fanboys-against-plugins. And that is why we (i mean: the ones who have been asking patiently for vst support for 10 years) gave up and said bye bye. If you ask someone here "why you sell reason" the answer will be always the same: "because of no vst support". This is the only reason, alas. For what it offers it should cost half the price, or at least have vst support (like Orion, FL amd similar).

I use it as part of my tool box and I still feel its very complete and didn't need RE or vst support. No fanboy from here at all I will tell u everything that is wrong with it but no tool is perfect. Hell in fact Reason is my go to tool of choice most of the time. I don't need every plug in on the planet just like I don't need every RE out there and I tell the people on the Props forum to stop crying about the price too. Get what you need for your music and forget everything else exists or you will always feel you need more.

that is why i don't understand RE when presented as a "plugins alternative". It isn't of course. I mean, REs are fine if you consider them as new racks for reason: sort of "rack extensions" FOR reason. The problem is someone pretends them to be "vst IN reason". They aren't (i guess REs are 0,001% of total plugins), you have no choice (unless you think choosing among 15 REs can be called a choice). And, above all, the majority (yourslelf included) are very happy with Reason.

The thread is about "why so many people sell reason", right? For me it is because PH has never introduced VST support, and will never do. RE is not an answer for all those who wanted this feature. Just this.

I see it as a plug in alternative but you are right the options are not there yet. I actually said why do this round about shit at first too but adding vst to Reason would in many ways make Reason not Reason because of how its executed. I think RE is the best possible compromise. That said I have not bought a single RE but I have demoed a few. They are not making me sell any of my plug ins but I do see it as a new plug in format that I think will become just as standard as vst, Rtas, and AU once they get all the kinks ironed out for everyone. RE has only been out for a month I don't think we can expect it to have all the options vst does yet. Give it 5 years or so and I think it will be very common to have many if not most plug ins created in VST and RE format and released around the same time. If not then we will see what happens either way I think as a rewire user RE is a great option for instruments that might only be created for Reason. I love some vsts and I love some reason racks I don't want one or the other.

why are "most" Reason answers... "In the future... Reason will do..."

how about today? why wait for Reason to have X, Y, Z when i could get them else where?

i think that is why individuals are selling Reason off... i have Ableton live and Reason in my machines... and every time i open Reason i ask myself why?

i have access to kontakt, omnisphere/trillian, east/west play, etc with Ableton Live...

[eXode]

But exode URS has chimed in and said they pulled that crossgrade option. I tend to trust URS pretty much always so....

Yes, that was my point actually. I think that the interview was made before they changed their minds...

[myrna]

yes i wish i said "everyone respond but myrna" because he is a dedicated reason basher and hater with passion, so much hate, who is ruining this good topic already.

Hey, relax: It is not me hating them. It's you hating me. The rest is just blablabla. If the question was "why so many people selling reason", the answer is clear. Infact i am one among them.

[Trakstar]

yes i wish i said "everyone respond but myrna" because he is a dedicated reason basher and hater with passion, so much hate, who is ruining this good topic already.

Hey, relax: It is not me hating them. It's you hating me. The rest is just blablabla. If the question was "why so many people selling reason", the answer is clear. Infact i am one among them.

Care to share the answer with us??

[myrna]

the answer: I and at least 90% of reason "resellers" sold Reason because of lack of vst supporting, even after 10 years of development (and patience: reason user since 2001). Just this. In 2012 vst support is a must in electronic music. This "no-vst" PH obsession is becoming something ridicolous. The others are happy with Reason, of course. So I am speaking for myself (... and the other 90%...). Does this mean to be a "hater"?!

[KevWestBeats]

A Reason user MUST believe it is complete: you have everything you need (this is the Propellerhead manthra). It is not true, of course, but their policy. Fanboys made me ban from PH forum because I was continuosly asking them "well, how can you reply sounds like omnisphere, pianoteq and absynth ones within reason" in perspective of vst support. That is why they introduced the RE thing: because of our vst support demand. They pretend in this way to make us "happy" and at the same time not to betray orthodox fanboys-against-plugins. And that is why we (i mean: the ones who have been asking patiently for vst support for 10 years) gave up and said bye bye. If you ask someone here "why you sell reason" the answer will be always the same: "because of no vst support". This is the only reason, alas. For what it offers it should cost half the price, or at least have vst support (like Orion, FL amd similar).

I use it as part of my tool box and I still feel its very complete and didn't need RE or vst support. No fanboy from here at all I will tell u everything that is wrong with it but no tool is perfect. Hell in fact Reason is my go to tool of choice most of the time. I don't need every plug in on the planet just like I don't need every RE out there and I tell the people on the Props forum to stop crying about the price too. Get what you need for your music and forget everything else exists or you will always feel you need more.

that is why i don't understand RE when presented as a "plugins alternative". It isn't of course. I mean, REs are fine if you consider them as new racks for reason: sort of "rack extensions" FOR reason. The problem is someone pretends them to be "vst IN reason". They aren't (i guess REs are 0,001% of total plugins), you have no choice (unless you think choosing among 15 REs can be called a choice). And, above all, the majority (yourslelf included) are very happy with Reason.

The thread is about "why so many people sell reason", right? For me it is because PH has never introduced VST support, and will never do. RE is not an answer for all those who wanted this feature. Just this.

I see it as a plug in alternative but you are right the options are not there yet. I actually said why do this round about shit at first too but adding vst to Reason would in many ways make Reason not Reason because of how its executed. I think RE is the best possible compromise. That said I have not bought a single RE but I have demoed a few. They are not making me sell any of my plug ins but I do see it as a new plug in format that I think will become just as standard as vst, Rtas, and AU once they get all the kinks ironed out for everyone. RE has only been out for a month I don't think we can expect it to have all the options vst does yet. Give it 5 years or so and I think it will be very common to have many if not most plug ins created in VST and RE format and released around the same time. If not then we will see what happens either way I think as a rewire user RE is a great option for instruments that might only be created for Reason. I love some vsts and I love some reason racks I don't want one or the other.

why are "most" Reason answers... "In the future... Reason will do..."

how about today? why wait for Reason to have X, Y, Z when i could get them else where?

i think that is why individuals are selling Reason off... i have Ableton live and Reason in my machines... and every time i open Reason i ask myself why?

i have access to kontakt, omnisphere/trillian, east/west play, etc with Ableton Live...

I think you have a point. It could very well be the reason why. I think the thing that made Reason unique to many was its closed environment but with it now being opened and seeing that RE vs VST options are not only limited but not ready when they are ready for them in our fast food microwave society is making many think twice about Reason.

[KevWestBeats]

the answer: I and at least 90% of reason "resellers" sold Reason because of lack of vst supporting, even after 10 years of development (and patience: reason user since 2001). Just this. In 2012 vst support is a must in electronic music. This "no-vst" PH obsession is becoming something ridicolous. The others are happy with Reason, of course. So I am speaking for myself (... and the other 90%...). Does this mean to be a "hater"?!

excuse my ignorance but why are vsts such a huge requirement in electronic music? I make mainly hip hop and among hip hop guys Reason is quite popular so it would be cool to see another POV on the matter.

OT but idk if anyone else seen this. FX pansion released a new compression suite and a free compressor today on their website. I tried to grab it earlier but their site was down within minutes of the announcement so it was a no go for me. Go check it out though when and if you can get your hands on it.