Just like porn, there are so many great free plug-ins on the net why pay for them?

[Proxima4]

When I first started out I used loads of freeware, UGO, HGFortune, Home Grown Sounds, Psychic Modulation and Anologue Warefare making up the bulk of my vst folder.

Soon I realised though, that support from the user's and the company themselves was key in providing some guidance on how to get the best out of the units and also that magazine articles and video tutorials seemed to revolve around comercial products for obvious reasons. they also guided me in my musical ideas. It was then that I started to notice the different and harder types of synthesis like FM and Granula Sampling, needed that kind of dedication from the users and ther company to help me realise my ideas.

Lately their seems to have been a flury of vst releases of anologue subtractive synths, that blur the lines of what can be found for free and what should be paid for, it's a difficult area but one that is completely down to what I stated before and working preferences like GUI, Possible Modulations and overall sound quality.

With effects however, sometimes their can be slightly less to worry about, DBGlitch is still in my folder and I can't see it leaving, as it still can do pretty much everything the other paid for versions do, if you choose some host modulation.

Certainly you should consider if you can get away with not replacing you trusty freeware folder with a comercial version.

But remember, the company's themselves debate long and hard about a potential product, so it's worth demo'ing new and older gear and doing some A/B comparisons against freeware alternatives, just to see how it will perform under the kind of pressure you think it should.

I reckon you may eventually see the likes of NI Massive and FM8, Camel Audio - Camel Space and Alchemy begining to seem some how filling a lot of different roles and worth the spend.

And I'm sure the rest of the guy's here on the forum, will agree buying a spare or unwanted licence from them here at KVR or E-Bay is a much more professional attitude towards the comercial music environment than anything else you might consider.

I saw a post on the Ableton forum for a guy who's selling a NI Massive licence for £60.00 today, that's very helpful to someone starting out..

[Mutant]

Who cares about what "experienced" musicians think about a synth sound in a full mix ?

Then the world is your oyster, you're one of the lucky ones who doesn't need a synth like DIVA. I happen to not be so lucky.

Well i wouldn't say i don't need it.
The demo version sounds very pleasing to my ears and once the developer kills all the bugs and annoyances, i might even buy it.
But buy it not because i think i need it to convince all these "experienced" musicians that i have a real hardware synth in my bedroom studio, but as i said, because it sounds good to my ears.

[Uncle E]

Well i wouldn't say i don't need it.
The demo version sounds very pleasing to my ears and once the developer kills all the bugs and annoyances, i might even buy it.
But buy it not because i think i need it to convince all these "experienced" musicians that i have a real hardware synth in my bedroom studio, but as i said, because it sounds good to my ears.

Feeling a little contrary today? You've now validated my original point that an experienced musician can hear the difference between DIVA and any free synth out there. There was nothing in my statement about this being for the end listener.

[David Carpenter Wind Core]

Free is good but much more effort usually goes into Plugins that cost money. And they should and most free bees have a donation area that I am sure you don't contribute to. These instruments take time and effort and I think the developers should be compensated for there efforts if you are making money off there sounds.

No freeware sampler will Ever come close to Kontakt no freeware synth will come close to Diva. However there are a ton of options for those on a budget. To me the most important part of the music is originality and song writing the actual sounds and patches effect etc are secondary. If you are playing good music then it doesn't matter much if you have the top dog patches loaded up or not.

But either way making an effort to support developers free or not only advances what is possible.

On the other side developers need to cater to there customers by providing a quality product and support which is very hard to find.

I think that a couple thousand spent on plugins is a good investment for a studio or a gigging band. For the average musician keyboard player around 800 to a 1000 plus some freebies is plenty. For the beginner 300 and a bunch of freebies is a great start.

My biggest gripe is sample libraries that are polished on top but watered down on the inside. East West is notorious for releasing sample libraries with only one velocity layer. What a rip off but you don't know til you buy it.

I think developers should state how many layers per note and if there are per note samples as opposed to stretched and pitch matched. There is a ton of this going on in the sample library world and it is just plain lazy and poor quality.

So I can understand not wanting to get ripped off, but if something truly is useful and makes you money then the developer should also profit from there efforts. This allows them to keep making you good products.

[jam92189]

An experienced musician can hear the difference between DIVA and any free synth out there. I love SQ-8L and miniSID but those are the exceptions.

Who cares about what "experienced" musicians think about a synth sound in a full mix ?
How many of those "experienced" ones are even out there in the general population ?
1 per 1000 ?
1 per 100000 ?

to be honest that sounds like a insult to musicians. I dont like synths because im a musician. it can easaly be put the other way around. look some synths are just easier to get a great sound out of. I dont have diva. and I never used it. so I guess diva is one of em.

[b4serenity]

Who cares about what "experienced" musicians think about a synth sound in a full mix ?

Then the world is your oyster, you're one of the lucky ones who doesn't need a synth like DIVA. I happen to not be so lucky.

Not that I doubt you but I would love to hear the difference. Do you have any sound clip comparisons? Thanks for your help!

Good posts everyone!

[jam92189]

I think that a couple thousand spent on plugins is a good investment for a studio or a gigging band. For the average musician keyboard player around 800 to a 1000 plus some freebies is plenty. For the beginner 300 and a bunch of freebies is a great start.

efforts. This allows them to keep making you good products.

mm it really depends. lots of people that spend alot of stuff like if I bought waves mercury I would not use all of those plugins. most of em would be a waist of money. I have seen lots of mixing engineers who love to use the native plugins in studio one or reaper. I think its more like spend what you need on tools that you will use. for less than 300 you can get some amazing plugins nowadays. Like I love my sknote stuff. and my Ik multimedia stuff. I bought off someone who hooked up a great price for my Ik stuff. so you know what where someone would have spend about 500 I spent 100 . and lots of studios and "real" acts do such things now. its called everyone got hit by the loss of money

[Dean Aka Nekro]

Both and whether it costs hundreds of quid per plug-in or it is a free one, To me it really does not matter as it is all about having the stuff I believe to be the stuff which I know works best for my needs and the needs of getting a job done if I am engineering for other people

Basically I do not discriminate between the two. A great Processor or Effect is just that, Can not speak much about the software synthesizer world as its not an area I spend money or use often at all, software instrument wise though, Without the likes of Toontrack Music, FXpansion Audio, XLN Audio and the rest whom have made getting real sounding acoustic drumkit tracks down without having to use any real drums, It changed my life and thank f**k they did and keep expanding/improving. That is where it is at for me and virtual instruments as I do not always have access to a drummer with a good drumkit plus good sounding recording space and even then sometimes the drummer(s) available are not upto playing such technically challenging drum tracks which I sometimes need. So its all good and freeware/cost effective audio software tools are at a level where they stand easily as great next to commercial big gun's payware *IMveryhumbleHO and in the areas which I am aware of/use often*

Best to all as always

Dean

[Trakstar]

Im saving a couple of grand for some hardware for a project studio, the idea is a 500 series lunchbox and then mix and match a few of the units that are quite cheap compared to the alternatives. I like the look of the lunchbox neves that have just been released like the 1073. Then probably an Xdesk for analog summing and a master stereo compressor and tube EQ for the master channel. Use the 500 series FX as inserts and patch into X desk. Just ideas at minute but it would cover everything I need and there is a lot of choice for the 500 series. You can get a real aphex big bottom and aural exciter in the same rack unit for £300-£400. Considering the waves plugin is £200 for the aural exciter alone, for a few extra quid you actually get to own some hardware, in fact the more I check these things out they are staring to really grow on me. Ill have around £5000 to play with because I was left some inheritance money from my gramps so its just a matter of time until I recieve it, and this is what Im thinking of doing.

[jam92189]

Im saving a couple of grand for some hardware for a project studio, the idea is a 500 series lunchbox and then mix and match a few of the units that are quite cheap compared to the alternatives. I like the look of the lunchbox neves that have just been released like the 1073. Then probably an Xdesk for analog summing and a master stereo compressor and tube EQ for the master channel. Use the 500 series FX as inserts and patch into X desk. Just ideas at minute but it would cover everything I need and there is a lot of choice for the 500 series. You can get a real aphex big bottom and aural exciter in the same rack unit for £300-£400. Considering the waves plugin is £200 for the aural exciter alone, for a few extra quid you actually get to own some hardware, in fact the more I check these things out they are staring to really grow on me. Ill have around £5000 to play with because I was left some inheritance money from my gramps so its just a matter of time until I recieve it, and this is what Im thinking of doing.

that sounds like a nice little investment
the thing about why people like plugins is more I can have that sound on every track if needed. its alot less of a hassle than rerouting everything. but we can all agree no plugin has knobs that you can feel and I personally Love my SSL hardware 2bus that I bought.

[MickGael]

...Considering the waves plugin is £200 for the aural exciter alone, for a few extra quid you actually get to own some hardware...

Plus, it goes without saying that an API 512 (to name but one of many examples) will retain its value in a way plugins never will.

If you record any acoustic instruments or sing, I think you'll find that a premium signal path and mic will get you closer to sonic nirvana than any plugin.

[Uncle E]

Not that I doubt you but I would love to hear the difference. Do you have any sound clip comparisons? Thanks for your help!

Download the demo and pick your side!

[b4serenity]

Both and whether it costs hundreds of quid per plug-in or it is a free one, To me it really does not matter as it is all about having the stuff I believe to be the stuff which I know works best for my needs and the needs of getting a job done if I am engineering for other people

Basically I do not discriminate between the two. A great Processor or Effect is just that, Can not speak much about the software synthesizer world as its not an area I spend money or use often at all, software instrument wise though, Without the likes of Toontrack Music, FXpansion Audio, XLN Audio and the rest whom have made getting real sounding acoustic drumkit tracks down without having to use any real drums, It changed my life and thank f**k they did and keep expanding/improving. That is where it is at for me and virtual instruments as I do not always have access to a drummer with a good drumkit plus good sounding recording space and even then sometimes the drummer(s) available are not upto playing such technically challenging drum tracks which I sometimes need. So its all good and freeware/cost effective audio software tools are at a level where they stand easily as great next to commercial big gun's payware *IMveryhumbleHO and in the areas which I am aware of/use often*

Best to all as always

Dean

I use free fx and vsti synths etc. because it's what I can afford, and like I said in the OP that is definitely not my weakest link right now. I did purchase BFD ECO for drums as I didn't see any free viable drums otherwise. I also purchased REAPER as anything free didn't do it for me, and I love there business model and total dedication to improvements. So, I can see both sides.

[highkoo]

Interesting thread!

The average bang-for-buck has certainly gone way way up.

The kicker:

As we are getting cheaper bangs, the ratio of good payware plugins to good freeware plugins gets closer and closer to equal.

i.e.
There is still plenty of amazing payware, and it is a better value than ever before.
But as time goes on it makes less and less sense to 'invest' in it due to the thinning margin between freeware-bang and payware-bang.

[Zaphod (giancarlo)]

just like plugins and porn, there is so much free music on yotube! honestly in many flv and mp4 uploaded there you'll never guess which plugins they used!!!
sometimes there is some 192 kbit good stuff, though. Do the homework now